things to do in the off season to stay decently fit
#1
commu*ist spy
Thread Starter
things to do in the off season to stay decently fit
cycling training takes a lot of time, and to a lot of us, that's a problem. I'd like to focus on other things right now, and with the short daylights these days, training volume has gone way way down. what do you do to keep in decent shape and also save some time?
I think running is a good option. you can get some good cardio in a much shorter period of time. there's also other sports that involve running (like ultimate frisbee or something like that). however, I realize running uses totally different muscle groups than cycling. so what's your take on off season training on a time budget?
I think running is a good option. you can get some good cardio in a much shorter period of time. there's also other sports that involve running (like ultimate frisbee or something like that). however, I realize running uses totally different muscle groups than cycling. so what's your take on off season training on a time budget?
#2
Rides too much bike
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Boston
Posts: 842
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 232 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I have taken up some running more for the aspect of whole body fitness and an embarrassment that I can't run more than 2 miles without feeling terrible. That being said I still think that committing to trainer time is better than cross training if you intend to see any increase in cycling related power. Trainer time lets you get alot done in 1 hour, 2X20s are great and fit perfectly into a 1 hour trainer ride.
Or failing that: Elliptical is about the best workout you can get that may transfer something to cycling.
Or failing that: Elliptical is about the best workout you can get that may transfer something to cycling.
#4
Ninny
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: The Gunks
Posts: 5,295
Mentioned: 53 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 686 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
I do as much backcountry XC skiing as I can during the winter. I find it to fill a lot of the same niches that cycling does. Gets you places you wouldn't otherwise go, can be as easy or as hard as you want it to be, etc.
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 2,910
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 140 Post(s)
Liked 327 Times
in
161 Posts
I love backcountry and other XC skiing in the winter as well. I think it is good for base fitness, but doesn't help with the time aspect of the OPs question. For me it takes much longer to get to where I can ski than it does to hop on the bike and get in a workout.
#7
Senior Member
Cross-training is probably a good idea for overall health, strength, stability and injury prevention. Nothing will touch cycling for increasing your power on the bike. You can probably train your aerobic energy systems very well via running, rowing or XC skiing, but you won't help your speed at all. Basically you can build good endurance, but speed on the bike will be a problem. It depends on your priorities. I think I would prefer to get my cross-training benefits through strength and flexibility training. I'll do a little bit of XC skiing when weather conditions allow and the mood takes me, but I'm not likely to make it a routine part of winter training.
#8
Version 7.0
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: SoCal
Posts: 13,118
Bikes: Too Many
Mentioned: 297 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1338 Post(s)
Liked 2,473 Times
in
1,448 Posts
Two years ago, I used my former Russian coach and he loves jumping. He likes squat jumps and wanted me to do 600. I have a bad back and had not jumped in conservatively 30 years so I was skeptical. And I thought that 600 was a lot. He said he could do 300 easily and he was in lousy shape.
Here is lesson number one... listen to what the Russians say but tread carefully in the execution.
Yuri Verkhoshansky, Russian, developed plyometrics as we know today. It is the compression of muscles and tendons followed by an explosive move. This is the most effective way to increase power and endurance. Crossfit uses this technique in its box jumping where one jumps up and then jumps down. One gets more height, if one compresses the achilles tendon. Hence to high jump or slam dunk, one preloads the achilles tendon.
However, cyclists and older racers (and some younger ones) may not have very strong tendons so preloading although effective, can cause injury.
I went to my sports medicine doc at Stanford Hospital and asked him about my back and jumping. I expected him to pee all over the concept. Instead, he said that jumping would be good for my pathology but landing was not good. So he said, I could box jump, land soft and step off the box.
So I have been box jumping since then. I suggest a one to two foot box and start jumping every other day. Work up to 300 or so or more. However, do not do 600 the first time. The height of the box is not that important.
If you want to make it harder and add more endurance, do a run and jump. Run on a treadmill for 100 meters and then do 20 box jumps. And with the run and jump, you can play with the speed of the run, number of jumps and rest periods. The less rest you take, the more endurance one builds. The faster the run and higher and more explosive the jump, the more power one builds.
Another variation is to run up a hill and do 20 squat jumps at the top...but be careful with the landing and land like a cat and definitely work into these slowly.
OP, you asked for it. The most effective workout for cyclists that do not involve a bike for the shortest period of time per unit of gain. But with it comes the most chance for injury. Good luck.
Here is lesson number one... listen to what the Russians say but tread carefully in the execution.
Yuri Verkhoshansky, Russian, developed plyometrics as we know today. It is the compression of muscles and tendons followed by an explosive move. This is the most effective way to increase power and endurance. Crossfit uses this technique in its box jumping where one jumps up and then jumps down. One gets more height, if one compresses the achilles tendon. Hence to high jump or slam dunk, one preloads the achilles tendon.
However, cyclists and older racers (and some younger ones) may not have very strong tendons so preloading although effective, can cause injury.
I went to my sports medicine doc at Stanford Hospital and asked him about my back and jumping. I expected him to pee all over the concept. Instead, he said that jumping would be good for my pathology but landing was not good. So he said, I could box jump, land soft and step off the box.
So I have been box jumping since then. I suggest a one to two foot box and start jumping every other day. Work up to 300 or so or more. However, do not do 600 the first time. The height of the box is not that important.
If you want to make it harder and add more endurance, do a run and jump. Run on a treadmill for 100 meters and then do 20 box jumps. And with the run and jump, you can play with the speed of the run, number of jumps and rest periods. The less rest you take, the more endurance one builds. The faster the run and higher and more explosive the jump, the more power one builds.
Another variation is to run up a hill and do 20 squat jumps at the top...but be careful with the landing and land like a cat and definitely work into these slowly.
OP, you asked for it. The most effective workout for cyclists that do not involve a bike for the shortest period of time per unit of gain. But with it comes the most chance for injury. Good luck.
#10
Nonsense
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Vagabond
Posts: 13,918
Bikes: Affirmative
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 880 Post(s)
Liked 541 Times
in
237 Posts
1) Son if God wanted us to run he wouldn't have gifted us the wheel.
2) Have you seen an ultimate frisbee player? Don't expect a workout, do expect hilarious banter. Your knees might ache and you'll probably get hit in the face with a disc.
3) Decreased volume means you can crank the intensity to gangbusters level. If you have a trainer and really don't like yourself you can maintain most of your base fitness by turning the screws, and you might even pick up some watts on the top end if you're doing it right. Just have to make every pedal stroke count.
2) Have you seen an ultimate frisbee player? Don't expect a workout, do expect hilarious banter. Your knees might ache and you'll probably get hit in the face with a disc.
3) Decreased volume means you can crank the intensity to gangbusters level. If you have a trainer and really don't like yourself you can maintain most of your base fitness by turning the screws, and you might even pick up some watts on the top end if you're doing it right. Just have to make every pedal stroke count.
#11
Killing Rabbits
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,697
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 278 Post(s)
Liked 217 Times
in
102 Posts
Nothing will touch cycling for increasing your power on the bike. You can probably train your aerobic energy systems very well via running, rowing or XC skiing, but you won't help your speed at all. Basically you can build good endurance, but speed on the bike will be a problem.
#12
Batüwü Creakcreak
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: The illadelph
Posts: 20,784
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 228 Post(s)
Liked 288 Times
in
160 Posts
Two years ago, I used my former Russian coach and he loves jumping. He likes squat jumps and wanted me to do 600. I have a bad back and had not jumped in conservatively 30 years so I was skeptical. And I thought that 600 was a lot. He said he could do 300 easily and he was in lousy shape.
Here is lesson number one... listen to what the Russians say but tread carefully in the execution.
Yuri Verkhoshansky, Russian, developed plyometrics as we know today. It is the compression of muscles and tendons followed by an explosive move. This is the most effective way to increase power and endurance. Crossfit uses this technique in its box jumping where one jumps up and then jumps down. One gets more height, if one compresses the achilles tendon. Hence to high jump or slam dunk, one preloads the achilles tendon.
However, cyclists and older racers (and some younger ones) may not have very strong tendons so preloading although effective, can cause injury.
I went to my sports medicine doc at Stanford Hospital and asked him about my back and jumping. I expected him to pee all over the concept. Instead, he said that jumping would be good for my pathology but landing was not good. So he said, I could box jump, land soft and step off the box.
So I have been box jumping since then. I suggest a one to two foot box and start jumping every other day. Work up to 300 or so or more. However, do not do 600 the first time. The height of the box is not that important.
If you want to make it harder and add more endurance, do a run and jump. Run on a treadmill for 100 meters and then do 20 box jumps. And with the run and jump, you can play with the speed of the run, number of jumps and rest periods. The less rest you take, the more endurance one builds. The faster the run and higher and more explosive the jump, the more power one builds.
Another variation is to run up a hill and do 20 squat jumps at the top...but be careful with the landing and land like a cat and definitely work into these slowly.
OP, you asked for it. The most effective workout for cyclists that do not involve a bike for the shortest period of time per unit of gain. But with it comes the most chance for injury. Good luck.
Here is lesson number one... listen to what the Russians say but tread carefully in the execution.
Yuri Verkhoshansky, Russian, developed plyometrics as we know today. It is the compression of muscles and tendons followed by an explosive move. This is the most effective way to increase power and endurance. Crossfit uses this technique in its box jumping where one jumps up and then jumps down. One gets more height, if one compresses the achilles tendon. Hence to high jump or slam dunk, one preloads the achilles tendon.
However, cyclists and older racers (and some younger ones) may not have very strong tendons so preloading although effective, can cause injury.
I went to my sports medicine doc at Stanford Hospital and asked him about my back and jumping. I expected him to pee all over the concept. Instead, he said that jumping would be good for my pathology but landing was not good. So he said, I could box jump, land soft and step off the box.
So I have been box jumping since then. I suggest a one to two foot box and start jumping every other day. Work up to 300 or so or more. However, do not do 600 the first time. The height of the box is not that important.
If you want to make it harder and add more endurance, do a run and jump. Run on a treadmill for 100 meters and then do 20 box jumps. And with the run and jump, you can play with the speed of the run, number of jumps and rest periods. The less rest you take, the more endurance one builds. The faster the run and higher and more explosive the jump, the more power one builds.
Another variation is to run up a hill and do 20 squat jumps at the top...but be careful with the landing and land like a cat and definitely work into these slowly.
OP, you asked for it. The most effective workout for cyclists that do not involve a bike for the shortest period of time per unit of gain. But with it comes the most chance for injury. Good luck.
#13
commu*ist spy
Thread Starter
well here's my take. while it's true that speed and power on the bike is important, they're not mandatory to the off season. when you're not training, the first thing to go is cardio. my understanding is your jump stays more or less the same, though repeated efforts might also take a hit. perhaps we can do some high intensity intervals in our running to get the same effect.
I am not personally worried about my jump, but rather my endurance. but then again, being a good p12 racer requires you to burn matches in the frequent surges that happen in the attacks, and endurance in the p12 has less to do with cardio as having enough fast twitch muscles left to have a good sprint.
will running intervals be almost as good as cycling intervals?
I am not personally worried about my jump, but rather my endurance. but then again, being a good p12 racer requires you to burn matches in the frequent surges that happen in the attacks, and endurance in the p12 has less to do with cardio as having enough fast twitch muscles left to have a good sprint.
will running intervals be almost as good as cycling intervals?
Last edited by spectastic; 11-24-15 at 05:04 PM.
#14
commu*ist spy
Thread Starter
Nah - they are the same groups. Patterns and ratios may change but they are the same muscles. The mitochondria and capillaries don't care what you are doing.
I disagree provided you actually run fast. I recall a paper where they took elite cyclists and replaced some of their off-season riding with running and their power increased more than the controls who actually did more total training. Lots of cyclists bash running because they can't do it for more than a few minutes without getting hurt.
I disagree provided you actually run fast. I recall a paper where they took elite cyclists and replaced some of their off-season riding with running and their power increased more than the controls who actually did more total training. Lots of cyclists bash running because they can't do it for more than a few minutes without getting hurt.
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 944
Bikes: Scott Foil 10, Di2
Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 148 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Heh. I got a coach and my volume went *up* in the winter, not down. My short weeks are 8hrs of riding and ~2hrs in the gym. My long weeks are >14hrs on the bike mostly grinding base miles.
#16
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Virginia, USA
Posts: 199
Bikes: Jamis Sputnik
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I would recommend basic compound lifting movements i.e. squat, deadlift, bench press. I don't think anything has helped my cycling as much as squatting (particularly more quad-dominant front squatting). And I don't mean doing 100 reps of bodyweight squats. Obviously, this requires specialized equipment. The goal here isn't so much to develop muscle mass as it is to train yourself to work at higher intensity and thus develop a 'stronger' CNS.
Mix in some cardio of choice, and you'll be good to go.
IMO jumping presents too high a risk of injury.
Edit: I'm not a racer.
Mix in some cardio of choice, and you'll be good to go.
IMO jumping presents too high a risk of injury.
Edit: I'm not a racer.
#18
**** that
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: CALI
Posts: 15,402
Mentioned: 151 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1099 Post(s)
Liked 104 Times
in
30 Posts
cycling training takes a lot of time, and to a lot of us, that's a problem. I'd like to focus on other things right now, and with the short daylights these days, training volume has gone way way down. what do you do to keep in decent shape and also save some time?
I think running is a good option. you can get some good cardio in a much shorter period of time. there's also other sports that involve running (like ultimate frisbee or something like that). however, I realize running uses totally different muscle groups than cycling. so what's your take on off season training on a time budget?
I think running is a good option. you can get some good cardio in a much shorter period of time. there's also other sports that involve running (like ultimate frisbee or something like that). however, I realize running uses totally different muscle groups than cycling. so what's your take on off season training on a time budget?
For me, the "off season" is a few weeks or a month after race season, where I might ride once a week, but I do more hiking, and some running. I think this is more formally known as the Transition period in Friel's books.
Then there is the training season, over the winter months, which is a lot of bike riding, and maybe a little bit of running, and a little bit of plyo/weights. I ride more in this period than during the actual racing season.
#19
commu*ist spy
Thread Starter
I think it depends on how you're defining "off season" - is that the whole time there is no racing?
For me, the "off season" is a few weeks or a month after race season, where I might ride once a week, but I do more hiking, and some running. I think this is more formally known as the Transition period in Friel's books.
Then there is the training season, over the winter months, which is a lot of bike riding, and maybe a little bit of running, and a little bit of plyo/weights. I ride more in this period than during the actual racing season.
For me, the "off season" is a few weeks or a month after race season, where I might ride once a week, but I do more hiking, and some running. I think this is more formally known as the Transition period in Friel's books.
Then there is the training season, over the winter months, which is a lot of bike riding, and maybe a little bit of running, and a little bit of plyo/weights. I ride more in this period than during the actual racing season.
#20
**** that
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: CALI
Posts: 15,402
Mentioned: 151 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1099 Post(s)
Liked 104 Times
in
30 Posts
my definition of off season is loosely based on my schedule. I realize I need to take some time to focus on my career, family, school and other stuff. this is going to be bleeding into march, and I'll be using the early spring crit series to get back into racing shape. until then, I'm just trying to find ways to not stray too far from where I left off last season
Consistency is key, whatever you do.
#22
Senior Member
I disagree provided you actually run fast. I recall a paper where they took elite cyclists and replaced some of their off-season riding with running and their power increased more than the controls who actually did more total training. Lots of cyclists bash running because they can't do it for more than a few minutes without getting hurt.
FWIW I'm not trying to bash running at all, it's "conventional wisdom" (for better or worse) that running will hurt your speed on the bike.
well here's my take. while it's true that speed and power on the bike is important, they're not mandatory to the off season. when you're not training, the first thing to go is cardio. my understanding is your jump stays more or less the same, though repeated efforts might also take a hit. perhaps we can do some high intensity intervals in our running to get the same effect.
I am not personally worried about my jump, but rather my endurance. but then again, being a good p12 racer requires you to burn matches in the frequent surges that happen in the attacks, and endurance in the p12 has less to do with cardio as having enough fast twitch muscles left to have a good sprint.
will running intervals be almost as good as cycling intervals?
I am not personally worried about my jump, but rather my endurance. but then again, being a good p12 racer requires you to burn matches in the frequent surges that happen in the attacks, and endurance in the p12 has less to do with cardio as having enough fast twitch muscles left to have a good sprint.
will running intervals be almost as good as cycling intervals?
I'm not a P/1/2 racer, but from my limited experience in 1/2/3 races and in races with lots of sprinting and high-intensity intervals (cyclocross, for example), endurance in those kinds of racing has a LOT to do with aerobic capacity. A better aerobic engine helps to buffer those hard efforts so you can draw more on your aerobic energy system and less on anaerobic or neuromuscular energy systems. Working on high-intensity intervals in training is also super important, of course, but aerobic ability really helps in preserving some jump for late in a race.
#24
Version 7.0
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: SoCal
Posts: 13,118
Bikes: Too Many
Mentioned: 297 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1338 Post(s)
Liked 2,473 Times
in
1,448 Posts