rideaz

Actually I was! My teammates said I should be in the fossil jersey (like the young rider jersey) 😁

rideaz

I'm too old, see above 😁
I wouldn't say never but it's unlikely.

globecanvas

The prestigious gray jersey!

Really, that's great. What an experience!

Enthalpic

Nice

Doge

So cool to experience that! Congratulations.

Ygduf

I thought I said that you had the ability to ride with any women's field when we had a chance to ride together years ago. Happy to hear that I was (of course) right and even happier to see you have the opportunity!

Doge

So how did you get the bottles?

scheibo

Sea Otter Classic Road Race - E3 - 3/26

Pretty much exactly as expected, I got beaten by the mostly undefeated hero of the lower NCNCA categories + his teammate, my uber climber friend. Course was ~60 miles with 6 laps of a rolling course with a 1:30-2:00 steep climb being the main feature, several fast descents and then a longer finishing climb on the last lap.

There was only one game plan in this race - sit in the pack and do nothing until the big boys decided they wanted to race. I wanted points, and was willing to sacrifice the top step to ensure I got on the podium. I really hate this, but it was 'smart' racing.
Having done a decent amount of racing at this point proved to be beneficial, as it was easy to tell which moves were serious and where the power was. A break of 4 got away for a few laps and had a sizable gap, but I had supreme confidence that it would be brought back given that the undefeated guy would have to find a way of winning somehow. The laps mostly played out the same way - the eventual winner would bomb the mile long descent and then slow-climb the steep hill, drifting to the back of the pack and them bombing the descent after it. The whole pack would then slow to a crawl into the wind along the backside and then we'd ramp it up a little with the tailwind along the rollers until we repeated the same process.

I should have paid more attention to the winner's strategy - I noticed he would bomb the descents (and somehow get a huge gap, despite just sitting on his top tube with everyone chasing!), but I didn't put it together that we was doing it to be able to do the climb slower given he's a bigger guy and there were steep ramps. I also figured he'd attack on the last lap on the descent, but I guess that was just him lulling me into a false sense of security because he attacked on a smaller descent before the tailwind section a couple minutes before the last descent. The field was strung out trying to pull him back and another rider was able to bridge, but the field didn't close so I decided I had to try to bridge to not let the podium slip away. Another rider came with me and we kept the gap to around 10-15s after the descent, but the whole field gave chase so at the base of the final climb everyone was mostly together.

I hadn't tried to kill myself chasing on the descent too much, so I was now in a pretty good position at the base of the climb, but there was a headwind and the first miles of the climb were quite shallow so I just let the pack chase. Only they were going super slow (IMO), so I had to be really patient to just let the 2 riders up the road pull away from us and hope that in the last km which was steep we'd be able to catch one of them. This finishing climb was done mostly as a ramp test, with riders making an attack, my friend and I covering them easily and then parts of the field falling off each time as we kept up applying pressure. In the last kilometer we had caught 2nd place and there were only 3 of us left in the chase, with my friend visibly frustrated because he is such a good climber he wanted to try and go for the win but had his hands tied because he couldn't pull me up to his teammate. In the end, the other guy with us continued trying to eat away at the gap and we jumped away at ~300m to go, but given it was a 10% grade I had trouble coming past my friend so ended up in 3rd.

Takeaways

- The winner is super impressive. I complained about being heavily marked at another race earlier in this thread, but *everyone* by this point in the weekend had to realize that the guy who won both the crit and the circuit race so far is clearly the man to watch. I think this made for pretty boring racing - we rode super slow a lot of the time because everyone kind of felt there was no point trying to beat this guy. I was most impressed with his descending - the descents weren't really technical at all, just fast descents you can bomb but he was always able to pull out huge gaps even over guys I consider to be good descenders. Also - why does everyone have to descend on their top tubes these days? I feel like only maybe ~20% of the field (including myself) wasn't performing this risky technique. Most of the time I don't feel its a huge disadvantage to not do it, but the winner definitely has clearly perfected it.
- I don't really feel fulfilled from 'smart' racing if it wasn't also 'hard' racing. I complained about this earlier in the thread as well. I was very well behaved this race, sitting behind the leaders, spending a lot of time in the baby ring and chatting with my friends. I got the result I was expecting, but my legs felt so good and were itching to go harder the whole day. Even on the finish climb I wanted to go harder, and felt fine afterwards (I actually did some bonus climbing with my friend afterwards while we waited for the podium). I guess the solution is to either STFU and just do a breakaway regardless of how dumb it may be, or be smart, get the points to upgrade and then enjoy getting my face bashed in by the P12s.

To preempt another snarky comment by @globecanvas: I fully understand that I came 3rd and any scenario I dream up in which I might have improved my placing is hypothetical and possibly misguided (e.g. no reason to think that if the race played out differently my competitors wouldn't have been able to respond in kind). This is all theoretical and an attempt to learn from the race and see what I possibly could have done to have achieved a better result.

I'm not sure how to have improved my results in this one:
a) I think the smallest change would have been to have not downshifted before the sprint - I think I like high cadence sprinting and I don't think I would have 'spun' out on a 10% grade. Possible I could have got 2nd this way, but still a toss up.
b) My best chance would probably have been to have been more alert and been with the guy that bridged to the leader before the descent. If I had been able to get on the leader's wheel for the flatter section on the base into the headwind I could have started the steep section with a 30s+ lead over his climbing teammate and perhaps had a chance at beating the eventual winner as well given he didn't seem to be as strong on the sustained steep climbing. Of course, if I was up ahead, his teammated behind would have been 'allowed' to then work to close us down (which he probably could), or maybe the winner would have slowed down at the base to not give me a free ride to the steep bit. Who knows? This was probably still my best bet for changing up the ordering of the podium, but I don't necessarily know that it would have worked
c) Option b) is probably also my best shot for winning, as while I easily could have held the race's average speed in a solo breakaway (we went so slow!), I don't think the heavy hitters would be stupid enough to let me get away, as we all know each other. I think where the winning move happened is probably the place to attack, but I didn't figure that out myself, so clearly I need to do a better job reading the course and wind so as not to be caught off guard/to have given myself the option for launching a successful attack.

globecanvas

Jeez man. It sounds like you played the race very well strategically. I get that you say smart racing isn't fulfilling, but consider the even less fulfilling scenario where you raced less smart but harder and got beat by lots of weaker people.

Sounds to me like you now have the 'strong' piece and the 'smart' piece, and if you figure out how to put them together you can beat the few guys who are stronger than you.

Doge

Smart racing is a rather big topic by ex-pro type dads feeding junior kids in the Euro trips.
Most the dad don't want the kids doing that.

scheibo

Thanks. I agree, I would have been very mad at myself if I anyone other than those two had beaten me, and it would have been completely my fault. Without question, my number one biggest flaw in life as well as racing is patience, but I tend to get the best results when I hold back as much as possible. That's always been the case, in running, TTs, hill climbs, etc. It's just hard because it feels less fulfilling. I guess I'll need to win one by being smart instead of just placing highly to see if it really is not as satisfying.

UmneyDurak

Can't you race masters? Should give you more time to recover for 1/2 race.

Wylde06

2nd race on the club calendar tonight, 9.1 mile TT. Cross wind on the inital leg, tail cross on the second, then dead into the wind on the last leg. DId it on my road bike..havent been on my TT bike since September and I kind of want to be able to walk tomorrow.

Ended up with a time of 23:28 and 272 watts. Im pretty happy with that considering the headwind on the last leg. Probably last in the A's, but I don't do the time trials to win them..especially racing with the A group. Also, most everyone else was on their TT bike so I was at a disadvantage from the start.

Either way, im happy with how it went

https://www.strava.com/activities/958293459/overview

Doge

The collegiate USA National TTT was today.
I had suspected that Club was stronger than Varsity.
The Varsity winning time would have been good for 3rd in Club.
The USAFA kids got a 5th place podium. 1.5 Sec off 3rd place, .5 ahead of 6th place.
Collegiate TTT Results 2017.jpg

hack

Did Jr run a normal bike or that makeshift Felt DA?

Ttoc6

You gonna be on course tomorrow? Pretty excited for what should be a fast and furious race.

miyata man

Good luck to you Ttoc6 and puppy Doge.

Have to admit to backing a couple local D1 riders in the RR today.

Doge

FELT DA2.
Pre-race they had a whole UCI measuring rig setup and that certainly concerned me (not for our bike) and I got clarification that was for the Para racing which is TTT. That FELT DA was one of the more aero setups but not the only one setup for IAB position. The ITT bikes seemed to be geared more toward that.

I had a good chat post race with the chief referee, in the parking lot. Puppy has padding on the bars (allowed) for the IAB position. Randy mentioned to Puppy he'd prefer he had his hands on the bars at the start line, not the IAB position. I asked him about his comments to Puppy on the line. He said some back east riders are taking the plastic cups off aero extensions and putting them on road bars and that is sometimes being allowed/sometimes not and there may be a rule clarification coming. About the rules being vague he laughed and said something like their were no standards. I also asked about the hands on the bars and he said in the ITT he had no issue with it, but in the TTT he saw it as a safety issue with wind guts. Specifically to Puppy's bike it is well within what is allowed. I mentioned possibly doing something next year closer to the limits and his reaction (my read) was until things are less vague - why not.

Personally I would like them to adopt the UCI TT bike standard for a mass start bike. I understand the intent of the collegiate rules to have college kids use just one bike, for cost, simplicity etc. A few things are clear. The big schools drive big vans or trailers and carry multiple bikes. Having a TT set and RR set would be easy. Several of the ITT bikes I saw were not setup to be optimum for a RR (high bars with bar top pads, TT seat and position, more aero frame).

Doge

I'm not clear if you are a rider or coach. I think it is a great course. The gravel in the downhill off-camber 120 degree turn will be interesting, but there is no cliff to fall off. I think that will be cleaned up.

I'm not sure if I'll be in the feed zone or driving reverse course and videoing. I'll be in that 10 year old black Benz off the side of the road. I do not look like a rider. Say hello. And if you are a rider, ride next to a USAFA kid and wave and you might make it on video.

As Posted the TTT confirmed where the power is. I don't think the smaller teams have a chance. But then I hope the big teams care much more about beating each other than the little gnat teams/riders that get caught up in it. That would provide some opportunity.

Doge

I already gave a long reply, but here is a collegiate road bike:
(more here USAC Gallery - USA Cycling)
Collegiate ITT Winner.jpg

rubiksoval

Is he wearing leg warmers? Was it cold? That looks so strange!

Costco hot dogs

American Velo Club RR - 35+ M3/4

10 mile rolling loop with one 50 second, stair-stepped climb halfway through the course. 4 laps. Not a target race for me, so I offered to do whatever painful work the team wanted.

According to the team race plan, my job was to animate the first half of the race. Staged at the front, and on the whistle, quickly ramped up to tempo. One racer held on for about 30 seconds, then drifted back. So I decided to try the soft attack. Put 30 seconds on the field after about 15-20 minutes of racing, then rested for about half a lap, hoping another racer or two would bridge. That didn't happen. So, with the rest of my team controlling the front (chasing down any attacks) I ended up gaining about 1:40 on the field and stayed away for about an hour; 2.5 laps. Got caught at the base of the 50 second climb on lap 3 and couldn't decide whether I wanted to finish out the race or not. I figured I'd "done the work" so I toodled back to the finish and called it a day for a DNF.

I was hoping there'd be a counter attack once I got caught, but only 1 of my teammates was in good position at that point. But, with 5 others on the team in the field, we ran our leadout, and netted a 5th place for one of our sprinters. Fun day, but probably made some mistakes in timing the attack and metering out effort.

TheKillerPenguin

I Quabbin'd, race length 124ish miles of endless grindy climbing. I made it ~82. I was really really comfortable and feeling nice and fresh until somewhere around mile 60, at which point we wound up on wide stretches of highway with no shade and I started seriously overheating, and my breathing also started acting up and made life pretty awful. Around mile 75 I picked the wrong wheel while pack surfing up a climb and said wrong wheel let a large gap open up while attacks started going, and it had to be closed with a pretty big push. While that in and of itself didn't end my day it was enough to make sure I did not make it over the next climb.

So on the one hand I am happy that over the time that I felt normal my legs felt great, but on the other hand I'm getting really frustrated with not feeling normal. The overheating thing is whatever, basically don't be an idiot about about liquids and drink more often. The breathing thing is left over from being sick though. It was fine last week until the day after last saturday's race, at which point my chest got a bit weird again. I'd been hoping it would be cleared up for Quabbin because I need all the race miles I can get with the real meat of the season coming up. But...I guess I will take a few days off and pretend I don't know what a bike is.

Anyway it's a really great course and a well run race. Despite the wtfness I had a blast. This one's lesson is, sag climbing saves energy, but don't surf too far back or you're basically kicking yourself in the nards.

grolby

GJ TKP, and be careful out there. I'm glad you're taking it easy. A bout of sickness can take a surprisingly long time to recover from, and you can really set yourself back if you push it too much.

mattm

Cat's Hill p/1/2, a local classic since like forever.

Greg Lemond raced it back in the 70's or something.

I've done it five times, finished it once (in 2015). Was hoping to at least finish it again.. but no.

After 25 mins/~15 times up the short but really steep climb, I gave up. Damn. Maybe just do 35+ next year.. or train better.