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  1. #1
    Since Ever Since Devil's Avatar
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    Doping doctor Fuentes speaks out

    From cyclingnews.com:

    Fuentes: "Tour at that speed impossible without doping"

    In an extensive interview broadcast by Spanish radio Cadena Ser, gynaecologist and doping expert Eufemiano Fuentes has talked about his behind-the-scenes activities in the sport. First of all, he insisted on his belief that he was not a criminal and only attended to his medical duty of preserving the athlete's health.

    "I'm don't feel like a criminal; I haven't killed anyone and I haven't destroyed anyone's health," he said. "I'm a health professional; my priority is to cure my patients because I think that the sport at high level is not healthy. I'm accused of crime against public health, but they should sanction those who play at being doctors." So instead of boosting the rider's performances, Fuentes considered that he only "supplemented and adjusted" those bodily functions of the riders which showed a deficit.

    "[Cyclists] are very special sportsmen because they reduce their heart rate by half when resting," he continued. "Their hearts are big, and when they stop cycling their hearts reduce their size to normal within six months, which results in what we call 'sudden death'."

    Fuentes, who added that his treatments also concerned other sports than cycling (football, tennis, athletics), said that it was possible to ride the Tour de France without "medical" help, but not at that speed. "You just can't ride four of these mountain stages successively at that speed, it's very harmful," he said, adding that in his opinion it was more dangerous for a cyclist to start the Tour de France with a hematocrit level of 31 percent, than one of 51 percent - even though this meant that the rider would be excluded from competition.

    The Madrid-based doctor named two cyclists, Alberto Contador and Vicente Ballester, but only to say that he did not know them and that he did not know why their names were on the list established by the Spanish criminal investigators. He also said that there were riders still participating in the Tour de France that he had treated and that he "had enough of the hypocrisy. The Tour direction sent home riders that I never treated, and there are now clients of mine in the peloton. I'm furious. People were named that I don't even know but other names were concealed."

    Moreover, he stated that the bags of blood that were found were destined "for use in the next ten years", and that the quantities of EPO seized "for a family member who might need it." he also added that he had been threatened not to reveal any persons involved with him. Fuentes felt "lynched by the media" and "killed professionally".
    Last edited by Devil; 07-06-06 at 06:12 AM.

  2. #2
    Dirt-riding heretic DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil
    Moreover, he stated that the bags of blood that were found were destined "for use in the next ten years", and that the quantities of EPO seized "for a family member who might need it." he also added that he had been threatened not to reveal any persons involved with him. Fuentes felt "lynched by the media" and "killed professionally".
    Hmm... Bags of blood to be used in the next 10 years? Last I checked you could only keep blood around for a couple months. And EPO for a "family member who might need it???!!!" Have you ever heard of a pharmacy???

    Sounds like someone trying to cover their own a$$, nothing more. He's a victim. He's really a hero, protecting the safety of cyclists everywhere. What a load of crap.

    DrPete

  3. #3
    Wher'd u Get That Jacket? flythebike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete
    Sounds like someone trying to cover their own a$$, nothing more. He's a victim. He's really a hero, protecting the safety of cyclists everywhere. What a load of crap.
    Like my father has always said, rationalization is the secret to happiness. Dr.Pete has it right. This guy is just trying to say he had to do it. The reality is that he engaged (so they say) in sporting fraud.

    I mean if you want to make the "all drug olympics" argument, ok, fine. And I don't buy the mule into a race horse argument, Basso and Ullrich are great riders with or without drugs. I would prefer the sport be clean and everybody play fair.
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  4. #4
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    He says he has clients who are riding in this year's Tour de France, but he won't name them. I guess if you hire a criminal for a doctor, at least you want a criminal who respects your privacy.

    Barry Bond's trainer went to jail yesterday rather than answer grand jury questions about Bond's crimes. Always nice to have a partner in crime who is willing do time for everyone in the gang.

  5. #5
    Wher'd u Get That Jacket? flythebike's Avatar
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    The Bond trainer guy did that becuase when the grand jury's term expires, they have to let him go. It is said that will happen in a few weeks. Knowing he will be out in a few weeks makes it easy to do that time. Much easier than knowing Barry Bonds now has a score to settle with you.

    Fuentes saying he has clients in the tour - he may be lying. But it highlights the point that it is a mistake to assume the peloton in that race is clean just because they busted Fuentes.
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    This is really the first Tdf that I have paid a lot of attention to and watched everyday...even so here are my thoughts.

    The quote that says that people on the list that were not allowed to race wernt taking any drugs is prob the worst part to me. How bad would it suck if you trained all year for this thing and then got taken out becuase of a bunch of cheaters. What if some of the big name contenders taken out wernt on drugs after all. What if Vinos team would of had enough members for him to race?

    Also the quote wehre he says people in the pelaton are people he has helped...that sucks as well.

  7. #7
    your nightmare gal chipcom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete
    Hmm... Bags of blood to be used in the next 10 years? Last I checked you could only keep blood around for a couple months. And EPO for a "family member who might need it???!!!" Have you ever heard of a pharmacy???

    Sounds like someone trying to cover their own a$$, nothing more. He's a victim. He's really a hero, protecting the safety of cyclists everywhere. What a load of crap.

    DrPete
    Hey Doc, what about this line:
    "Their hearts are big, and when they stop cycling their hearts reduce their size to normal within six months, which results in what we call 'sudden death'."

    Am I gonna die, or become the Grinch if I stop cycling?
    "Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey

  8. #8
    Dirt-riding heretic DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chipcom
    Hey Doc, what about this line:
    "Their hearts are big, and when they stop cycling their hearts reduce their size to normal within six months, which results in what we call 'sudden death'."

    Am I gonna die, or become the Grinch if I stop cycling?
    Yeah, um... not sure what that's about. Pretty sure that the response to exercise isn't an issue of the size of the heart. But yes, if you stop cycling, you will die.

    DrPete

  9. #9
    Banned. El Diablo Rojo's Avatar
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    Fuentes, who added that his treatments also concerned other sports than cycling (football, tennis, athletics), said that it was possible to ride the Tour de France without "medical" help, but not at that speed.
    Interesting FIFA claims that no Footballers were on the list.


    "You just can't ride four of these mountain stages successively at that speed, it's very harmful," he said, adding that in his opinion it was more dangerous for a cyclist to start the Tour de France with a hematocrit level of 31 percent, than one of 51 percent - even though this meant that the rider would be excluded from competition.
    I've been saying this for years. I believe that a rider can ride the high mountians at these speeds one day but not day after day. They seem to get stronger and faster as each day in the mountains goes by.

    The good doctor has much to say that I've read in some other mags by ex pros. That riders need some of the banned substances to keep themselves healthy because they wear their bodies down so much. I think this guy my flip on his pals, which might finally open up the flood gates and reveal how doped up this sport is.

  10. #10
    Shut Up and Ride domestique's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo
    The good doctor has much to say that I've read in some other mags by ex pros. That riders need some of the banned substances to keep themselves healthy because they wear their bodies down so much. I think this guy my flip on his pals, which might finally open up the flood gates and reveal how doped up this sport is.

    What will it matter? We all know cyclists doped decades ago? Im pretty sure 80% of the Euro Peloton dopes..... Even if the entire peloton gets booted out.... it will only be a couple years until new riders start pushing the system.

    I don't think this will ever end until doping gets so extreme that riders are dying on a daily basis.
    do·mes·tique (dms-tk) n.
    A member of a competitive bicycle-racing team whose role is to assist the team leader, as by setting the pace.

    C'Dale Six13 (Record 08), Olmo Antares (Record/Chorus 06)

  11. #11
    Peloton Dog patentcad's Avatar
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    A) Doctors can be staggeringly arrogant about what they don't know. And one thing they DON'T know is if a track or cycling athlete will die from his 'enlarged heart' when he stops competing. They told my brother (the Penn Relays quarter miler) this 30 years ago. He's 54 years old now, doesn't exercise much and is in perfect health. Uh huh.

    B) This guy sounds like he's so full of **** it defies further comment. You MUST be joking. Good grief, why don't these clowns shut up and hire a lawyer already?

  12. #12
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    [QUOTE=Radiohead84]What if Vinos team would of had enough members for him to race?QUOTE]

    Well, you must be right, as one of the riders with Vino's team is surely clean. Sergio Paulinho. Who says he's clean? Me? Noooooo, Johan Bruyneel himself. A couple of days ago Discovery have signed up Paulinho for next season, hence a guy who is involved in the Operacion Puerto affair. But Bruyneel has confirmed Paulinho must be clean ( he's got a confirmation from Portuguese cycling association. Hahahahaaha - by the way that association is so serious they let Comunidad Valenciana race on their soil at this moment ). Who's Paulinho. He's the nobody who out of the blue came out to win silver at the Athens Olympics in road cycling.

    I hope you took all I said above with irony, even cynism. It was my intention.
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete
    Yeah, um... not sure what that's about. Pretty sure that the response to exercise isn't an issue of the size of the heart. But yes, if you stop cycling, you will die.

    DrPete
    I'm no doctor (but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night....), but I think you will die whether or not you stop cycling.

    We're ALL going to die.

    Bob

  14. #14
    Cycling Anarchist Trsnrtr's Avatar
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    Oh, give me the good old days when riders got daily "vitamin" shots under the shoulder blades to hide the needle marks.
    Dennis T

  15. #15
    By-Tor...or the Snow Dog? hi565's Avatar
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    So how come people are basing these facts off a gynaecologist ???

    Thats what I would like to know...
    ----------------------------------------------------------

  16. #16
    Elitist Jackass Smoothie104's Avatar
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    Becuase having a sign that says "sports doping doctor" over the door would attract too much attention, besides everyone loves P***y!
    "You should already be aware that riding with people who steer with their elbows, stick food to the top tube of their frames and ride around in dick togs is not a great idea." -- Classic1

  17. #17
    By-Tor...or the Snow Dog? hi565's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smoothie104
    Becuase having a sign that says "sports doping doctor" over the door would attract too much attention, besides everyone loves P***y!
    haha
    ----------------------------------------------------------

  18. #18
    Senior Member 7rider's Avatar
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    "[Cyclists] are very special sportsmen because they reduce their heart rate by half when resting," he continued. "Their hearts are big, and when they stop cycling their hearts reduce their size to normal within six months, which results in what we call 'sudden death'."
    I thought they just got fatter when they stopped cycling. Hearts usually enlarge when they're inefficient, and the body compensates with a larger heart. I'd guess most of the guys in the pro peloton have hearts more efficient than the general populace.
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  19. #19
    My Name is Nobody
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smoothie104
    Becuase having a sign that says "sports doping doctor" over the door would attract too much attention, besides everyone loves P***y!
    Brilliant...
    Health, Friendship and Love

  20. #20
    Senior Member Mojo GoGo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPete
    Hmm... Bags of blood to be used in the next 10 years? Last I checked you could only keep blood around for a couple months. And EPO for a "family member who might need it???!!!" Have you ever heard of a pharmacy???
    DrPete
    Don't remember where I read it but I saw an article saying that one of the possible charges Fuentes may face has to do with the use of "substances" that extend the shelf life of blood (used by the military).

    As I understand it there are/were no doping laws in Spain which is one of the reasons why Fuentes hasn't been charged with anything to date. The article stated that Fuentes procured the substance but his source understood that it was going to be used in conjunction with the hospital where one of the others implicated in Operation Puerto worked. I'm guessing they're also checking his tax records - if they can't bust him for what he was doing maybe they can Capone him...

    It might be rationalizing on his part (and mine) but I'd rather see him working with riders rather than riders trying to play doctor and having a heart attack in the middle of the night. In that sense, he is helping the riders... I don't condone it but I'm not morally offended by it either as they'll dope one way or the other.
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  21. #21
    DocRay
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    "[Cyclists] are very special sportsmen because they reduce their heart rate by half when resting," he continued. "Their hearts are big, and when they stop cycling their hearts reduce their size to normal within six months, which results in what we call 'sudden death'."

    This is only true for cyclists abusing EPO. So people with normal sized hearts get sudden death?
    I'd like to see....aaaccckkkk!!! THHFFt!


  22. #22
    Dirt-riding heretic DrPete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mojo GoGo
    Don't remember where I read it but I saw an article saying that one of the possible charges Fuentes may face has to do with the use of "substances" that extend the shelf life of blood (used by the military).
    Being in the military and really liking to have a few units handy when I need it, I'm not aware of anything that's in the field right now that extends the shelf life to years--maybe a couple days/weeks. You may be referring to a couple products out there that are synthetic or recombinant hemoglobin formulations that are acellular, i.e. lots of hemoglobin but no red blood cells. That stuff, as far as I know, is still on the horizon in terms of FDA approval and actual use, but I'll confess I'm not 100% current on HBOC and all those.

    DrPete

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