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-   -   So, was Lemond a doper too? (http://www.bikeforums.net/33-road-bike-racing/215954-so-lemond-doper-too.html)

iluvfreebeer 08-02-06 12:06 PM

So, was Lemond a doper too?
 
Did Lemond dope? GLs been getting trashed by some for his comments re doping. Do you think he was a user in his TDF days?

rgerve 08-03-06 12:31 PM

He say he was ignorant of doping in his day. That is hard to believe.

Snicklefritz 08-03-06 01:33 PM

I think Lemond should keep his mouth shut. He is one of the biggest whiners in sports...after all
his attacks on Armstrong I think he has really lost a lot of credibility to the point where I and many
others no longer pay attention to anything he says.

Trev Doyle 08-03-06 01:42 PM

I would rather be a whiner than a cheater though. I am sure he doesn't give a 'F' about his "credibility" . He has done his work. As for his opinions, he is not very relevant anyways. If he bashes Lance....so what? Lance is no angel either. BTW, Merckx doped. Notice he doesn't say too much on the subject, and no one bashes him. Christ, I have a painting of him( Merckx, not Christ) in my hallway.....

USAZorro 08-03-06 02:10 PM

I don't know if Greg doped or not - but it wouldn't surprise me if some day he said he had.

Consider this from the OLN special on Greg Lemond that aired the evening the TDF concluded. "In 1991, something had changed in the peleton...".

That one statement ruined all credibility that had been been building through the whole show.

Hey Greg, ever hear of Tommy Simpson? Charlie Gaul? It isn't like something just started occurring in '91. Maybe some of the riders came upon a more effective way of doping then, but the concept and practice have been around since the beginning of the sport. You had to know it had been going on from the first week you rode in Europe (if not well before then). I'm sorry, but I dislike hypocrisy almost as much as I dislike cheating.

TCR 08-03-06 02:12 PM

He's obviously the only rider who has never doped.

ed073 08-03-06 08:46 PM

Professional bike racer + multiple 3-week Tour winner = doped.

Blaireau 08-03-06 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ed073
Professional bike racer + multiple 3-week Tour winner = doped.

Yes, and most pros would agree --off the record of course! Jacques Anquetil admitted this freely when he was alive (he, unlike Landis or Armstrong was honest about it at least).
And for further corroboration, just listen to Oscar Peirero who basically said that he did not want the tdf title if Landis was destituted... I wonder why...

ed073 08-03-06 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blaireau
..


Username......ironic in this thread....lol....

:D

BoSoxYacht 08-03-06 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgerve
He say he was ignorant of doping in his day. That is hard to believe.

That's half right, he was ignorant back then(and now).

Blaireau 08-03-06 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ed073
Username......ironic in this thread....lol....

:D


No question....:D
And of course he doped too. But what a cyclist, what a fighter! I fondly remember that one time, in the early 80's or late 70's, on a particularly steep climb, some bozo was insulting him and standing in his way... so the Blaireau got off his bike, punched out the annoying guy (who must have outwighed him by 75 pound) and promplty got back on his bike and won the stage. It made French TV at the time.
Ah, le blaireau, une personnalite legendaire!

BoSoxYacht 08-03-06 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ed073
Professional bike racer + multiple 3-week Tour winner = doped.

What is wrong with that? It's been going on forever in the tour. It's almost a tradition. You can't put the genie back in the bottle. Why not be the best athlete that science can build?

spearce 08-03-06 10:17 PM

i think that once this poll reaches a definitive answer regarding the doping tendencies of one Mr. Lemond one of us should head over to Wikipedia and total Colbert the Greg Lemond page.

redtires 08-04-06 12:24 AM

Egads...true, it is well known that doping has been and most likely is relatively wide spread in the peloton, but can we at least wait to see what the lab says first? LeMond, like MOST cyclists during that period and before probably did use some kind of enhancement. It may be discouraging to some of the "youngins" who aspire to be a professional, but it is a fact, only for now hopefully. But I don't think that it is going to stop most people from watching racing, nor cause anyone to hang their wheels up in the garage for good. I'm not going to miss any OLN coverage anytime soon if I can help it. Also, no one seems to want to examine just how new "modern" cycling is. Up until LeMond, european cycling was very much a sport that was a pathway out of a rather poverty level life. When "GL" showed up, cycling became far more available to the international community AND salaries increased sometimes as much as ten-fold for riders. Large coporations became interested and massive amounts of money started pouring into the sport. Today's racing is still an evolving enterprise and it's true that old habits die hard and I'm confident that drug use will be cut further and further as time goes on and hopefully, personal responsibility will increase also. By the way, does anyone here know that Merckx used to do advertisements for Camel cigarettes...standing with his bike in front of him while in his team duds!!!! I didn't believe it until I saw it!!

Blaireau 08-04-06 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redtires
By the way, does anyone here know that Merckx used to do advertisements for Camel cigarettes...standing with his bike in front of him while in his team duds!!!! I didn't believe it until I saw it!!

Wow:eek:
Do you have any pictures? or can you give us a reference, I'd like to see that too. The slogan might be a cool sig line, lol.

Trevor98 08-04-06 11:30 AM

I neither know nor really care.

TomM 08-04-06 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blaireau
Yes, and most pros would agree --off the record of course! Jacques Anquetil admitted this freely when he was alive (he, unlike Landis or Armstrong was honest about it at least).

That's probally because Armstrong has a lot more to lose.

Dolomiti 08-04-06 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by USAZorro
Consider this from the OLN special on Greg Lemond that aired the evening the TDF concluded. "In 1991, something had changed in the peleton...".

That one statement ruined all credibility that had been been building through the whole show.

Hey Greg, ever hear of Tommy Simpson? Charlie Gaul? It isn't like something just started occurring in '91. Maybe some of the riders came upon a more effective way of doping then, but the concept and practice have been around since the beginning of the sport.

Nowhere in that quote or that entire show did Lemond suggest that doping suddenly started in the early 1990s.
The stuff that people like Gaul and Simpson used to take weren't things that necessarily gave much performance boost in a grand tour. Unlike EPO. Personally I think a rider could have won the TDF without doping, up until the time when they started blood doping and/or taking EPO. (although steroids seemed to help some riders such as Thevenet)
To get some perspective... Simpson died in 1967. That isn't far from the 80's. And he was drinking alcohol as a 'doping product'. The riders who were clean were probably the ones with the 'unfair advantage'.

domestique 08-05-06 07:43 PM

Plain and simple.... Greg Lemond doped... he is now bitter for not having the celeb status that he would have if he lived in Europe and was French, Italian, Spanish etc. He is also bitter that Lance has taken the American image of TDF cycling.

Lemond..... I liked watching your races (great comeback from being shot....BUT 1.) you also doped (everyone does) 2.) get over yourself (no one likes a over weight whiner)

paednoch 08-06-06 05:50 AM

EPO wasn't around when lemond raced. It was introduced in 1989 by amgen..so you can count EPO use out for lemond. He may have done the autologolous packed cell transfusion.

BoSoxYacht 08-06-06 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paednoch
EPO wasn't around when lemond raced. It was introduced in 1989 by amgen..so you can count EPO use out for lemond. He may have done the autologolous packed cell transfusion.

I witnessed Lemond in Paris, winning the TDF in 1989. He also won(the TDF) in 1990 and continued to race through 1992. Why do you think he couldn't have used EPO?

ed073 08-06-06 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paednoch
EPO wasn't around when lemond raced. It was introduced in 1989 by amgen..so you can count EPO use out for lemond. He may have done the autologolous packed cell transfusion.


Yep.

Johannes Draiijer died in Feb 1990. Widely accepted as the first EPO death amongst pro cyclists.

classic1 08-06-06 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paednoch
EPO wasn't around when lemond raced. It was introduced in 1989 by amgen..so you can count EPO use out for lemond. He may have done the autologolous packed cell transfusion.

Not necessarily. Riders have been caught with drugs that haven't even been through clinical trials (Mauro Gianetti anyone?).

ed073 08-06-06 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by classic1
Not necessarily. Riders have been caught with drugs that haven't even been through clinical trials (Mauro Gianetti anyone?).


Museeuw dropped him like a hot brick in his back yard on the Worlds course designed for him to win on in 1996.......nothing suss about that! :D

Totoro 08-06-06 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by domestique
get over yourself (no one likes a over weight whiner)

Some people here like to whine about others whining, so now let me whine about you whining about someone else whining. And don't whine about me whining about you whining about others whining. Got it.


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