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  1. #1
    Senior Member Snicklefritz's Avatar
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    Floyd, the US ADA and the offer to "rat out" Lance

    What do you guys think of this:

    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,271395,00.html

  2. #2
    It is fantastic. voltman's Avatar
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    Stupid Americans.

  3. #3
    Seņor Member USAZorro's Avatar
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    If USADA did make that offer, it was incredibly stupid on their part.
    The search for inner peace continues...

  4. #4
    Senior Member donrhummy's Avatar
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    Wow. If this is true (and they'll deny, deny) I hope Landis' lawyer recorded the conversation. It still won't win him his case, as he's clearly being setup to lose (whether or not he's guilty), but it'll look a lot better when he sues them in a real court.

  5. #5
    Senior Member VT Biker's Avatar
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    At the end of the day, it was a stupid proposition. Unless Landis has photos or other hard evidence (which I am sure he does not), it becomes a he said/she said issue. And if that is the case, Lance is going to win. What was the USADA thinking? Did they really think Landis was going to rat out Lance? He would never be welcomed in the cycling community again.

    The current ethos is much like that scene from Goodfellas where Deniro tells the kid that everyone gets pinched once in a while, but the important thing is he didn't squeal.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Snicklefritz's Avatar
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    I agree the whole proposition is really dumb. However let's say, for the sake of argument, that Landis took the bait and said something about Lance. What would the USADA hope to gain by getting info on Lance if indeed there is anything out there?

    I'm tired of seeing these people go after cyclists when there are so many pro sports that are dirtier than dirty and just get mere hand slapping for offenses (I'm thinking NFL, MLB, etc.)

  7. #7
    . botto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snicklefritz
    I agree the whole proposition is really dumb. However let's say, for the sake of argument, that Landis took the bait and said something about Lance. What would the USADA hope to gain by getting info on Lance if indeed there is anything out there?

    I'm tired of seeing these people go after cyclists when there are so many pro sports that are dirtier than dirty and just get mere hand slapping for offenses (I'm thinking NFL, MLB, etc.)
    Seeing as he didn't, lets not.

  8. #8
    Senior Member roadwarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by botto
    Seeing as he didn't, lets not.
    Good to see a sane person out here.
    "Nothing is so typical of middling minds than to harp on the intellectual deficiencies of the slightly less smart, but considerably more successful."
    Bret Stephens, WSJ

  9. #9
    Senior Member roadwarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snicklefritz
    I agree the whole proposition is really dumb. However let's say, for the sake of argument, that Landis took the bait and said something about Lance. What would the USADA hope to gain by getting info on Lance if indeed there is anything out there?

    I'm tired of seeing these people go after cyclists when there are so many pro sports that are dirtier than dirty and just get mere hand slapping for offenses (I'm thinking NFL, MLB, etc.)


    To pick on the two that you mention...the USADA does not have jurusdiction over them. They do their own testing. And the NFL regularly suspends players who have positive tests.

    Baseball, on the other has just seemed to have discovered this steroid thingy...

    But that's not the subject of the thread.

    American pro sports have their own unions, their own collective bargaining agreements, and run their own shops. And the players are not treated with the disdain that pro cyclists are. "We think you might be guilty, so we'll suspend you until we figure it out. It might take six to nine months, maybe a year, but be patient."
    If people had drug testing on their jobs and were treated like this, they'd be screaming.
    "Nothing is so typical of middling minds than to harp on the intellectual deficiencies of the slightly less smart, but considerably more successful."
    Bret Stephens, WSJ

  10. #10
    Peloton Dog patentcad's Avatar
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    Let me state unequivocally that I the case against me has nothing to do with Cypress and any damning evidence I might be able to provide in this matter will not be forthcoming at this juncture.

    That being said, anyone who sprints 40mph on his bicycle is juicing.

    Or maybe I'm just really slow.

  11. #11
    Senior Member WCroadie's Avatar
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    Good for Landis to not even respond to that BS. I wish Armstrong would show more support for Floyd and maybe throw a little money his way.

  12. #12
    Banned. El Diablo Rojo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by patentcad
    Let me state unequivocally that I the case against me has nothing to do with Cypress and any damning evidence I might be able to provide in this matter will not be forthcoming at this juncture.

    That being said, anyone who sprints 40mph on his bicycle is juicing.

    Or maybe I'm just really slow.
    Or both

    Landis is cooked, even if he's innocent he's cooked. For him to walk away with a not guilty verdict now would embarrass every governing body involved and frankly I can't see that being allowed to happen.

  13. #13
    . botto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo
    Or both

    Landis is cooked, even if he's innocent he's cooked.
    For him to walk away with a not guilty verdict now would embarrass every governing body involved and frankly I can't see that being allowed to happen.
    if floyd loses, the terrorists win.

  14. #14
    The mods changed this... damocles1's Avatar
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    I think it's the principle for Floyd at this point.

  15. #15
    pan y agua merlinextraligh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAZorro
    If USADA did make that offer, it was incredibly stupid on their part.

    Why? The whole criminal justice system depends on giving some criminals a break to roll on other criminals. If you didn't have plea bargaining the whole system would grind to a halt.

    Why would it be shocking or wrong to apply the same principles to doping control enforcement in sports?
    Last edited by merlinextraligh; 05-11-07 at 07:17 AM.

  16. #16
    Banned. El Diablo Rojo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by botto
    if floyd loses, the terrorists win.

    You sir, are a true Patriot

  17. #17
    Seņor Member USAZorro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
    Why? The whole criminal justice system depends on giving some criminals a break to roll on other criminals. If you didn't have plea bargaining the whole system would grind to a halt.

    Why would it be shocking or wrong to apply the same principles to doping control enforcement in sports?
    Stupid because, as VT Biker points out, even if Floyd did have knowledge of Armstrong doping, what action would they be able to pursue against Lance? All it could do would be to diminish Armstrong's reputation.

    If this was what happened, it could only have been an attempt to play Floyd for the fool.
    The search for inner peace continues...

  18. #18
    Professional Fuss-Budget Bacciagalupe's Avatar
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    I think Landis has gone completely off the deep end. I don't believe that the USADA did anything even remotely similar to what Landis is claiming, and he can't have much confidence in his defense if he's pulling stunts like this.

    They already have what they need to determine whether or not Landis doped: test results, and extensive documentation that the defense can examine for errors and/or protocol violations.

    There are no pending cases or hearings against Armstrong, and no reason for the USADA to even consider going after him.


    If Landis keeps this up, WADA may lift the gag rule on sporting authorities during proceedings. And despite Landis' shenanigans, I don't think that would be a good thing....

  19. #19
    . botto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo
    You sir, are a true Patriot
    incorrect. i don't have enough spacers.

  20. #20
    Used to be a climber.. GuitarWizard's Avatar
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    Lol
    1999 Trek 2500 - hit by a car on it in May, 2011 and currently bikeless

  21. #21
    Biker looking for a ride!
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    I am completely not surprised......once again it shows the doping agencies expectations to live life in secret....the only person watching over them is Dick Pound....

    Guilty or Not Guilty WADA needs to change....

  22. #22
    Senior Member djbowen1's Avatar
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    If it is true, which i believe then i would think it stems from Andreu claiming Floyd has pictures of a motorcycle with drugs in a bag that delivered to usps early in Lance's tour streak.

  23. #23
    pan y agua merlinextraligh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAZorro
    Stupid because, as VT Biker points out, even if Floyd did have knowledge of Armstrong doping, what action would they be able to pursue against Lance? All it could do would be to diminish Armstrong's reputation.

    If this was what happened, it could only have been an attempt to play Floyd for the fool.

    The USADA absolutely could take action against Armstrong if they had evidence. You don't need a postive test, possession is enough for a violation (UCI Artcle 15.6.1). The statute of limitations is 8 years (UCI article 307) And the UCI rule specifically provide for reductions of period of ineligiblity for providing material assistance, so the alleged offer is consistent with the rules (UCI Article 266).

    And you wouldn't need pictures. If Landis testified he observed Armstrong use PED's that would be sufficient to find a violation, as long as the USADA, and (ultimately an arbitration panel, and the Court of ARbitration for Sport) found it to be credible.

    If I'm a Prosecutor, I'm absolutely going to explore whether I can get a defendant to roll up bigger players.

    If I'm in charge of enforcing doping controls, I'd do the exact same thing.

  24. #24
    Senior Member erader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snicklefritz
    at this point if flandis said the sky was blue i would assume it had changed colors .

    ed rader

  25. #25
    Senior Member reef58's Avatar
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    It sounds like they are going after Lance, so if anyone is going to rat him out it will be soon. If not soon then we will have to wait for the deathbed confession.

    Richard

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