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Old 05-13-07, 06:38 PM   #1
reef58
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2 CSC Riders Doping?

The article is at toward the bottom of the page. I have to question their motives for leaking this since they are not naming names.

Richard

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?...ay07/may14news
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Old 05-13-07, 06:50 PM   #2
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Uhhhh... Whose motives are you worried about, CSC's? I don't get it.

I think it's better that they don't release any names unless there's something truly definitive, which does not seem to be the case yet.
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Old 05-13-07, 06:57 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe
Uhhhh... Whose motives are you worried about, CSC's? I don't get it.

I think it's better that they don't release any names unless there's something truly definitive, which does not seem to be the case yet.
Then why say anything at all?
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Old 05-13-07, 06:58 PM   #4
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Then why say anything at all?
That was my point

Richard
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Old 05-13-07, 07:05 PM   #5
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Then why say anything at all?
I would assume it is to show that CSC is keeping a close eye on their riders and are trying to keep the team clean.

What, do you think they're making this up, or arranged for the riders to have anomalous results or something?

And how is it a "leak" when the guy makes an open and attributed statement to a reporter? That's like calling Tony Snow a "leaker."
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Old 05-13-07, 07:07 PM   #6
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Well you are right leak might have been the wrong term to use.

Richard
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Old 05-13-07, 07:54 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe
Uhhhh... Whose motives are you worried about, CSC's? I don't get it.

I think it's better that they don't release any names unless there's something truly definitive, which does not seem to be the case yet.
Agreed... and I think it's good that they're actually using the testing system to raise questions when something seems a little out of line, rather than looking the other way and using it as a hollow PR gesture.
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Old 05-13-07, 07:59 PM   #8
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Agreed... and I think it's good that they're actually using the testing system to raise questions when something seems a little out of line, rather than looking the other way and using it as a hollow PR gesture.
But I can't help thinking how different CSC's approach is to WADA. CSC says there's something "irregular" and they'll investigate to see if the data are correct and whther this is natural for these riders. WADA, on the other hand, says tests are infallible, strict liability, and the riders are presumed guilty.
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Old 05-13-07, 08:39 PM   #9
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Interesting...T Mobile has also sidelined 2 riders this week for the same thing...also claiming that they didn't fail any WADA doping control but their internal testing shows irregularities.
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Old 05-13-07, 08:54 PM   #10
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Interesting...T Mobile has also sidelined 2 riders this week for the same thing...also claiming that they didn't fail any WADA doping control but their internal testing shows irregularities.
I was very suspicious of T-Mobile as a collective team after the ITT stage of the TDF last year. I joked about them having small electric motors hidden in their bikes. I wonder if Honchar will be back this season.
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Old 05-14-07, 03:11 PM   #11
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All CSC riders dope, the thread title should read "2 CSC riders caught doping?"


hahahahhaaa, sorry
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Old 05-14-07, 03:15 PM   #12
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i'm surprised that it took tis long to pop up here, and even more surprised that the dope troll with the hinault avatar wasn't the one to bring it up.

guess s/he doesn't read cyclingnews.
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Old 05-14-07, 04:33 PM   #13
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only 2???
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Old 05-14-07, 04:57 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe
That's like calling Tony Snow a "leaker."
yeah we all know he is a "licker" .

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Old 05-15-07, 04:04 AM   #15
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Just to clarify, further tests have apparently already been done:

"En ustabil blodprofil kan indikere manipulation med dopingprodukter, men det har ifølge de målrettede dopingtest, som Rasmus Damsgaard efterfølgende har lavet på de to ryttere, ikke været tilfældet for dem. Han forklarer, at det i stedet kan handle om analyseforhold, apparatur eller fysiologi."

---

"A varying blood profile can indicate use of doping products, but according to further tests that Damsgaard performed on the two riders, this is not the case for them. It could instead be because of test procedures, equipment, or physiology."

---

Non-issue.

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Old 05-15-07, 04:11 AM   #16
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i'm surprised that it took tis long to pop up here, and even more surprised that the dope troll with the hinault avatar wasn't the one to bring it up.

guess s/he doesn't read cyclingnews.
Damn...now I got to the fridge this morning to learn that I had only a limited amount of coffee left and you are responsible for what little I could make ending up all over my desk.



I am not sure the "dope troll" can read at all....
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Old 05-15-07, 04:13 AM   #17
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All CSC riders dope, the thread title should read "2 CSC riders caught doping?"


hahahahhaaa, sorry
Riis says he knows nothing about it...what the riders do after he tucks them into bed is their business.
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Old 05-16-07, 08:45 AM   #18
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I don't understand Italian, but watching Rai today, they are saying Schleck and Zabriskie a lot - and they aren't on the break, nor are they leading the Peloton.
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Old 05-16-07, 08:49 AM   #19
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the only mention of zabriskie on belgian coverage today has been to note tha he's the csc GC guy for the giro, and andy schleck is riding as well.

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Old 05-16-07, 09:21 AM   #20
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"Dutch newspaper Algemeen Dagblad linked Luxembourger Frank Schleck to the codename "Amigo di Birillo" in the Puerto dossier. Schleck and Basso rode together on CSC during the Giro d'Italia last year, but no concrete evidence was presented by the paper as to why Schleck was the as yet unnamed "Amigo di Birillo""

Was mentioned here
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Old 05-16-07, 12:32 PM   #21
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I don't understand Italian, but watching Rai today, they are saying Schleck and Zabriskie a lot - and they aren't on the break, nor are they leading the Peloton.

OKOKOK, take it easy and don't mix up things.If they are talking about Schleck on RAI, they're talking about ANDY Schleck, who is the young brother of FRANK Schleck, who was one of Basso's best pals ("amigo di Birillo???).

Frank Schleck (winner of last year's Alpe d'Huez stage in Tour de France) is not on the Giro this year. He'll be the main man with Sastre in July in France.
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Old 05-16-07, 12:34 PM   #22
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OKOKOK, take it easy and don't mix up things.If they are talking about Schleck on RAI, they're talking about ANDY Schleck, who is the young brother of FRANK Schleck, who was one of Basso's best pals ("amigo di Birillo???).

Frank Schleck (winner of last year's Alpe d'Huez stage in Tour de France) is not on the Giro this year. He'll be the main man with Sastre in July in France.
why didn't i think of that?
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Old 05-16-07, 12:37 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe
Uhhhh... Whose motives are you worried about, CSC's? I don't get it.

I think it's better that they don't release any names unless there's something truly definitive, which does not seem to be the case yet.
Well, I'm from Europe, and I don't know the way you test your riders in the States. In France ( I'm NOT French !) you use "tests longitudinaux" (don't know the translation, HELP?) whereby riders are tested on regular basis (blood, heart, performance, etc). What they are looking for are anomalies or large changes in values from one test to the other. If changes are abnormal or not probable, a more forensic research is needed.

CSC and T-Mobile are important sponsors, and they imposed this method internally in their teams. It's simply a matter of showing "if one of my guys is caught, he's out, and I did everything I could to detect it." Hence regular comments one test results from CSc and T-Mobile doctors.
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Old 05-16-07, 12:39 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe
Uhhhh... Whose motives are you worried about, CSC's? I don't get it.

I think it's better that they don't release any names unless there's something truly definitive, which does not seem to be the case yet.
Well, I'm from Europe, and I don't know the way you test your riders in the States. In France ( I'm NOT French !) you use "tests longitudinaux" (don't know the translation, HELP?) whereby riders are tested on regular basis (blood, heart, performance, etc). What they are looking for are anomalies or large changes in values from one test to the other. If changes are abnormal or not probable, a more forensic research is needed.

CSC and T-Mobile are important sponsors, and they imposed this method internally in their teams. It's simply a matter of showing "if one of my guys is caught, he's out, and I did everything I could to detect it." Hence regular comments one test results from CSc and T-Mobile doctors.

The reason why French riders have not won any major tour since...???...Fignon? is because of of this medical method in place in their country. The closest to win something (Virenque) was on EPO.
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Old 05-16-07, 12:56 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by adamastor
Well, I'm from Europe, and I don't know the way you test your riders in the States. In France ( I'm NOT French !) you use "tests longitudinaux" (don't know the translation, HELP?) whereby riders are tested on regular basis (blood, heart, performance, etc). What they are looking for are anomalies or large changes in values from one test to the other. If changes are abnormal or not probable, a more forensic research is needed.

CSC and T-Mobile are important sponsors, and they imposed this method internally in their teams. It's simply a matter of showing "if one of my guys is caught, he's out, and I did everything I could to detect it." Hence regular comments one test results from CSc and T-Mobile doctors.

The reason why French riders have not won any major tour since...???...Fignon? is because of of this medical method in place in their country. The closest to win something (Virenque) was on EPO.

A big reason why FdJ is one of the poorer performing team.
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