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  1. #1
    Senior Member Master Cylinder's Avatar
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    Is it true that bike racing doesn't really start unti one is a Cat-2?

    I received the following quote in the weekend race report from a local club.

    [SIZE="3It takes a special person to take the (bike racing) challenge to see if one can
    compete beyond that hill or stop sign and put it all on the line
    literally. But as everybody knows who enters the culture of racing,
    racing doesn't really start until one is a Cat-2.

    SIZE]

    Is it generally accepted that bike racing doesn't really start until one is a Cat-2?

    Thanx,

  2. #2
    Edificating dmotoguy's Avatar
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    i guess that kinda makes sense.
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  3. #3
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    My guess is that they are referring to team tactics. Though I am just guessing

  4. #4
    Transplant Robobo1's Avatar
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    Hell, I've only been in 3 Cat5 races.... but I sure feel like they were "real" races.

  5. #5
    Aut Vincere Aut Mori Snuffleupagus's Avatar
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    No.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Bantam's Avatar
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    No
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  7. #7
    Making a kilometer blurry waterrockets's Avatar
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    Yeah, that's total crap. If you pay an entry fee and someone watches you cross the duct-tape and posts results, that's real racing. I think how much you learn about racing spikes pretty heavily when you're a point-earning Cat 3. The learning continues as a Cat 2, all the way up through Lance's 7th Tour win.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by waterrockets View Post
    Yeah, that's total crap. If you pay an entry fee and someone watches you cross the duct-tape and posts results, that's real racing. I think how much you learn about racing spikes pretty heavily when you're a point-earning Cat 3. The learning continues as a Cat 2, all the way up through Lance's 7th Tour win.
    Well said.

  9. #9
    semifreddo amartuerer 'nother's Avatar
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    I think it's human nature for those in the upper echelons to think and act like that. Everyone thinks that the category they're in at the time is where it really begins and everyone below that is just toying around. i.e. the 1s are saying "the real racing doesn't start until you're a 1". And the Pros are saying, "the real racing doesn't start until you're a Pro." It's all BS, but it's also all true.
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  10. #10
    Race to train jrennie's Avatar
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    two guys sprinting for a city limit sign makes a race

  11. #11
    pan y agua merlinextraligh's Avatar
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    I do think that getting to Cat 2 is sort of a dividing line. When you get to Cat 2, (and are doing mostly Pro 1-2 races) unless you're incredibly gifted, you can't be successful without team tactics, and a real focus on bike racing as your principle avocation.

    Racing Cat 3, Masters, and below is still real racing, but it doesn't have to be quite the same committment.

  12. #12
    . botto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrennie View Post
    two guys sprinting for a city limit sign makes a race
    maybe, but it would be a boring one.

  13. #13
    Racing iS my Training Pizza Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by botto View Post
    maybe, but it would be a boring one.
    Unless you're 1 of the 2 guys racing for the sign.

    I felt that racing starts in training rides before 1 even enters a race. Granted, I don't remember too many tactical Cat 5 races, but there were definitely some organized teams and team tactics in Cat 4 and Cat 3.

    The difference is that a strong rider can still often break away and win solo in a Cat 4 or Cat 3 race. It's just way way harder to do well in Cat 1-2 without the help of a team.

  14. #14
    Senior Member spunky's Avatar
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    I've heard this before from other sources. I believe they're referring to the lack of use of team tactics in the lower categories. I also think fitness has something to do with it too. It seems like a lot of guys in the 4's and 5's are only good for a couple of hard efforts before getting shelled. Therefore, not many attempts at breakaways are made and guys just tend to sit in and wait for the final sprint....not realizing that with a bit more effort, they could possibly breakaway and have to only sprint against 5-10 riders versus 30+.
    running makes your legs nasty. Cycling makes them look a weird way that i like.

  15. #15
    Glimmers of form esammuli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pizza Man View Post
    Unless you're 1 of the 2 guys racing for the sign.

    I felt that racing starts in training rides before 1 even enters a race. Granted, I don't remember too many tactical Cat 5 races, but there were definitely some organized teams and team tactics in Cat 4 and Cat 3.

    The difference is that a strong rider can still often break away and win solo in a Cat 4 or Cat 3 race. It's just way way harder to do well in Cat 1-2 without the help of a team.
    Thats why I love collegiate cycling, there are team tactics even at the B and C level. Riders are actually willing to sacrifice and work for a team leader in pursuit of a common goal.

  16. #16
    Senior Member Duke of Kent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by esammuli View Post
    Thats why I love collegiate cycling, there are team tactics even at the B and C level. Riders are actually willing to sacrifice and work for a team leader in pursuit of a common goal.

    Everyone from USC jumping and chasing down the first guy from UCLA to try to go up the road does not qualify as team tactics.
    "If a non personal post makes you feel as if you've been attacked, maybe the problem IS you."

  17. #17
    Senior Member filtersweep's Avatar
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    That is a load of crapola. Consider any local 10K run, or even a tri--- they are loaded with "participants." To be in a bike race that even has categories, the bar is already set quite high. It is not an event for the casual "participant." It is not a particularly inclusive environment--- even at cat 5.

    Tell whoever wrote that, "real racing doesn't exist in the US" or "real racing is only for pros"---


    ---it is a bunch of elitist garbage in an already elitist sport. No wonder so many people are afraid to start racing.

  18. #18
    Peloton Dog patentcad's Avatar
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    That is not the dumbest thing I've read here (see any of DocRay's posts) but it's close.

  19. #19
    Announcer EventServices's Avatar
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    I've seen some amazing races at the Cat 4 level. I've seen some astounding team tactics at the Cat 3 level.
    So in the spirit of Jeff Foxworty, I offer to change this thread to "... you might be in a bike race."

    If you used 4 safety pins. . .

    If you waited at the starting line for someone to say "Riders Ready" . . .

    If you had to wait in line for a volunteer sitting at a folding table to to take your money . . .

  20. #20
    starting pistol means war YMCA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by filtersweep View Post
    ---it is a bunch of elitist garbage in an already elitist sport. No wonder so many people are afraid to start racing.

    Bike racing is an elitist sport? It grew out of newspaper sales and the blue-collar factory blues. How does that qualify as elitist?

  21. #21
    Peloton Dog patentcad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YMCA View Post
    Bike racing is an elitist sport? It grew out of newspaper sales and the blue-collar factory blues. How does that qualify as elitist?
    The Titanic was once on the cutting edge of trans-Atlantic travel. Things change, but your oblivion may preclude you from taking notice. I'm trying to keep my tone elitist in keeping with modern American amateur bicycle racing. How am I doing so far?

  22. #22
    Senior Member filtersweep's Avatar
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    Knock yourself out. Show up in your tube socks, vintage beer cooler helmet, and 1974 Varsity. Let us know how well you are received.

    I know far more people who have "participated" in a marathon or a tri than race bikes. Last I checked, you didn't need a license to run a marathon... you might need to "qualify" to run the Boston marathon, or whatever... but somehow, thousands of people qualify.

    Quote Originally Posted by YMCA View Post
    Bike racing is an elitist sport? It grew out of newspaper sales and the blue-collar factory blues. How does that qualify as elitist?

  23. #23
    RacingBear UmneyDurak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duke of Kent View Post
    Everyone from USC jumping and chasing down the first guy from UCLA to try to go up the road does not qualify as team tactics.
    I see hills.... Bring them on!!!
    Stay calm and bring a towel.

  24. #24
    Senior Member Duke of Kent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by filtersweep View Post
    Knock yourself out. Show up in your tube socks, vintage beer cooler helmet, and 1974 Varsity. Let us know how well you are received.

    I know far more people who have "participated" in a marathon or a tri than race bikes. Last I checked, you didn't need a license to run a marathon... you might need to "qualify" to run the Boston marathon, or whatever... but somehow, thousands of people qualify.

    You could also buy a license and do 2 or 3 races for the price of "admission" to a marathon. And I'd like to see how you'd put thousands of people on a crit or road course. Two different sports.
    "If a non personal post makes you feel as if you've been attacked, maybe the problem IS you."

  25. #25
    more ape than man timmhaan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Master Cylinder View Post
    I received the following quote in the weekend race report from a local club.

    [SIZE="3It takes a special person to take the (bike racing) challenge to see if one can
    compete beyond that hill or stop sign and put it all on the line
    literally. But as everybody knows who enters the culture of racing,
    racing doesn't really start until one is a Cat-2.

    SIZE]

    Is it generally accepted that bike racing doesn't really start until one is a Cat-2?

    Thanx,
    i read the quote as saying: you don't know if you have what it takes (i.e. put it all on the line) until you get to cat 2 and race at that level.

    which, of course, makes sense because you can't really use other top riders as a benchmark unless you're actually racing in the same field.

    anyone can get to cat 4 and a lot of people make it to cat 3. cat 2 seems like the first real barrier that seperates those with real talent and those without.

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