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Old 09-10-07, 07:06 PM   #1
CrimsonKarter21
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Racin in Cat 3

So, the last road race of the year is coming up at the end of this month. There are four races in total, the Cat 1-2's, 3's, 4-5's, and women. Obviously I can't do the firat and latter. Since it's the last race, I want to use it as a kind of meter to rate myself on. Will I have a problem getting into the 3's race, even though I'm a 4? I've got no huge problem sticking with 3's on the competitive group rides I have on Wednesday's, but I'm 2-3 mph behind them in the sprints.
So, has anyone ever gotten into a higher category race before? How could I do it?
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Old 09-10-07, 07:08 PM   #2
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Sneak in?
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Old 09-10-07, 07:20 PM   #3
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How many points do you have?
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Old 09-10-07, 07:25 PM   #4
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Barely any right now, only six races I've done have actually been entered into the USA Cycling Points.
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Old 09-10-07, 07:28 PM   #5
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Did you do the Fall Challenge race in Penninsula?
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Old 09-10-07, 07:31 PM   #6
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No, I didn't know that there was one until I got there, but I did do the Mountain Bike race. It was slog-fest, and was the worst course to race in the deep, ****ty mud.
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Old 09-10-07, 07:41 PM   #7
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Barely any right now, only six races I've done have actually been entered into the USA Cycling Points.
If that was how they did upgrades, I wouldn't be applying to be a Cat2. Less than half of my results are on the USCF site.

If you keep track of all of your races and places, and points, you either have the points or you don't, regardless of what the USCF website says. And then, if you have good showings at big races but technically not enough points to upgrade, they might let you through if you're consistently getting it done. I'm a couple points shy but both our elite team's coach and two USCF officials from another state told me to send it in, due to finishes at big races.

In terms of just being allowed to race the 3's race when you're a 4...why do you think you should be allowed to? If you have the points or a strong resume, upgrade. If you don't, race the 4s. Simple as that.
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Old 09-10-07, 07:46 PM   #8
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So, the last road race of the year is coming up at the end of this month. There are four races in total, the Cat 1-2's, 3's, 4-5's, and women. Obviously I can't do the firat and latter. Since it's the last race, I want to use it as a kind of meter to rate myself on. Will I have a problem getting into the 3's race, even though I'm a 4? I've got no huge problem sticking with 3's on the competitive group rides I have on Wednesday's, but I'm 2-3 mph behind them in the sprints.
So, has anyone ever gotten into a higher category race before? How could I do it?
Just tell the officials you're really fast on group rides and want to challenge yourself by racing with the Cat 3s, heck, why stop there, you might as well enter the Cat 1/2 race

The answer to your question is obvious. You get into a higher category by meeting the upgrade requirements through performance, submitting an upgrade request to your upgrade coordinator, and receiving your upgrade to race in higher category races.
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Old 09-10-07, 08:33 PM   #9
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You can beg, but if you're honest with the Official, I'd hope they would be honest back at you.
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Old 09-10-07, 09:11 PM   #10
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What is the point of the cat system if people do not follow it.
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Old 09-10-07, 09:18 PM   #11
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What is the point of the cat system if people do not follow it.
It's flawed and nobody can think of a better system, I'd suspect. It also goes both ways: Just look at how many folks should be in the faster cats but continue to slum it up with the slower folks so they can shine.

Get out and ride, that's my philosophy.
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Old 09-10-07, 09:19 PM   #12
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Here's a meter for you ... stop thinking that you're better than the 4's and 5's and go win that race. You'll kill two birds with one stone. You'll get upgrade points and a trip to the 3's and you'll have your meter (the best 4's usually make solid 3's).

Mark
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Old 09-10-07, 09:49 PM   #13
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It's flawed and nobody can think of a better system, I'd suspect. It also goes both ways: Just look at how many folks should be in the faster cats but continue to slum it up with the slower folks so they can shine.

Get out and ride, that's my philosophy.
I realize that some people do this, and I'm puzzled by that. What do they think is honorable about sandbagging?

How is that shining at all?

I mean...sweet. You just won the Cat4/5 race in Bumblefoock, TN. Run along now.

Perhaps it's just me, but truely testing one's self, getting destroyed, building one's self back up and seeing how you stack up is the true measure of a person. How you react when all the cards are against you, that sort of thing. A guy who wins 10 Cat4 races a year, every year, will never know that.
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Old 09-11-07, 03:49 AM   #14
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I realize that some people do this, and I'm puzzled by that. What do they think is honorable about sandbagging?

How is that shining at all?

I mean...sweet. You just won the Cat4/5 race in Bumblefoock, TN. Run along now.

Perhaps it's just me, but truely testing one's self, getting destroyed, building one's self back up and seeing how you stack up is the true measure of a person. How you react when all the cards are against you, that sort of thing. A guy who wins 10 Cat4 races a year, every year, will never know that.
+1
Very well said my man!
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Old 09-11-07, 04:37 AM   #15
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Barely any right now, only six races I've done have actually been entered into the USA Cycling Points.
1. You need to keep track of your own points.
2. I can't forsee them letting you race in the 3's when you only have a few points. That's why we have the upgrade system.
3. If you can't get the required points in the 4's, what makes you think you're ready for the 3's?
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Old 09-11-07, 06:59 AM   #16
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A guy a PUR Tour last year raced the cat 4 only race and immediately after did the cat 3 only race. The USCF official looked at him and asked "Didn't you just race the cat 4?" then asked what category he actually was (he was cat 4). The official just continued his counting of riders and let him race.


I agree with the post above that just suggests that you race the 4-5's and go out and win it if you are so good.
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Old 09-11-07, 07:05 AM   #17
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Unless you are a 4 on the verge of upgrading to a 3, or a really strong power climber, I wouldn't waste your money. Do the 4s. Powerman, I believe, is similar to the course as Tym's Malabar farms race. Well at least it will go up that nasty hill.

Though I may be mistaken, I've never done the powerman
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Old 09-11-07, 07:10 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by CrimsonKarter21 View Post
So, the last road race of the year is coming up at the end of this month. There are four races in total, the Cat 1-2's, 3's, 4-5's, and women. Obviously I can't do the firat and latter. Since it's the last race, I want to use it as a kind of meter to rate myself on. Will I have a problem getting into the 3's race, even though I'm a 4? I've got no huge problem sticking with 3's on the competitive group rides I have on Wednesday's, but I'm 2-3 mph behind them in the sprints.
So, has anyone ever gotten into a higher category race before? How could I do it?
I guess I'm dumb, but it isn't obvious to me why you can't do the 4-5 race? You're a 4 right? Isn't the 4-5 race for 4s?
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Old 09-11-07, 07:13 AM   #19
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I guess I'm dumb, but it isn't obvious to me why you can't do the 4-5 race? You're a 4 right? Isn't the 4-5 race for 4s?


He can't do the women's race (latter)
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Old 09-11-07, 08:10 AM   #20
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So, the last road race of the year is coming up at the end of this month. There are four races in total, the Cat 1-2's, 3's, 4-5's, and women. Obviously I can't do the firat and latter. Since it's the last race, I want to use it as a kind of meter to rate myself on. Will I have a problem getting into the 3's race, even though I'm a 4? I've got no huge problem sticking with 3's on the competitive group rides I have on Wednesday's, but I'm 2-3 mph behind them in the sprints.
So, has anyone ever gotten into a higher category race before? How could I do it?
especially if you are riding on flats, this is probably true of mose cat 4 riders. that extra 2-3 mph on the sprint is kind of a big deal. i guess if you have your heart set on getting to race the 3's, you could sneak in pretty easily, but i would stick to the 4's and try to get a good result. this is, of course, disregarding ethical concerns.
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Old 09-11-07, 08:11 AM   #21
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Unless you are a 4 on the verge of upgrading to a 3, or a really strong power climber, I wouldn't waste your money. Do the 4s. Powerman, I believe, is similar to the course as Tym's Malabar farms race. Well at least it will go up that nasty hill.

Though I may be mistaken, I've never done the powerman
i'm going to try to get a routeslip file for it later today, will keep you posted. are you going?
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Old 09-11-07, 08:19 AM   #22
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So, the last road race of the year is coming up at the end of this month. There are four races in total, the Cat 1-2's, 3's, 4-5's, and women. Obviously I can't do the firat and latter. Since it's the last race, I want to use it as a kind of meter to rate myself on. Will I have a problem getting into the 3's race, even though I'm a 4? I've got no huge problem sticking with 3's on the competitive group rides I have on Wednesday's, but I'm 2-3 mph behind them in the sprints.
So, has anyone ever gotten into a higher category race before? How could I do it?
Good God. Cherry picking cat's? Do officials really let this slide?

Why not race p,1,2 then?
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Old 09-11-07, 09:10 AM   #23
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It's flawed and nobody can think of a better system, I'd suspect. It also goes both ways: Just look at how many folks should be in the faster cats but continue to slum it up with the slower folks so they can shine.

Get out and ride, that's my philosophy.

What is flawed with the "system"? I think it's really well organized and thought out. There is an entry level category (5) for never evers and new racers; an experiential upgrade to get into the novice category (4); a results based pathway as well as an experiential pathway for upgrading to Senior category (3); and additional results based pathway for upgrading to elite categories (1/2).

I think it's really a feather in the cap of USA cycling to have such an organized and accessible structure, and non-racers are almost always amazed at how well organized and structured the category system is.

While I hear about sandbaggers or folks "slumming it up" with slower folks so they can shine, I just dont witness it often enough to worry about it. Also, if there are "sandbaggers" out there, they are forcing you and your team to become better, so really, what's the big issue?
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Old 09-11-07, 09:24 AM   #24
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here is the course (i think) with elevation, ck:

http://veloroutes.org/bikemaps/?route=4099#
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Old 09-11-07, 10:35 AM   #25
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So, the last road race of the year is coming up at the end of this month. There are four races in total, the Cat 1-2's, 3's, 4-5's, and women. Obviously I can't do the firat and latter. Since it's the last race, I want to use it as a kind of meter to rate myself on. Will I have a problem getting into the 3's race, even though I'm a 4? I've got no huge problem sticking with 3's on the competitive group rides I have on Wednesday's, but I'm 2-3 mph behind them in the sprints.
So, has anyone ever gotten into a higher category race before? How could I do it?
Yes. Upgrade.

You want to test your might against the 3's, find a 3/4 race. Otherwise, go to a group ride where there will be 3's. If you are a 4 you race with the fours. The threes do not want their race compromised by a four who does not deserve to be there. They have enough of their own problems.
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