Coyote2

Hi all. I have now done a few road races, and they are all subject to the rule that riders from different cats may not work together -- and in each race, riders from different cats have worked together -- albeit not riders in contention for the podium.

Is this just a rule that is not really observed or enforced, or is there something I don't know about this?

jfmckenna

I never heard of such a rule. In a cat 3/4 race for example in a break that is mixed 3/4 of course you work together. Now in seperate races if a cat 4 field catches up to a cat 3 field (rare) then you cannot work together.

dmotoguy

Its been enforced in the RR's I've been in. I got dropped hard and fell back to the group behind me, the official came up next to me and made sure I didnt join their group as they passed.

jfmckenna

yeah that is a seperate race and that is the rule I missunderstood the OP.

recursive

I've never seen this rule violated. I assume the OP meant different races, not categories, as many races are combined categories, and that wouldn't make any sense.

EventServices

In our Masters road race yesterday, we passed a woman who had been chewed up, spit out, and dropped, and she her riding style showed it. But since we weren't moving very fast, I told her to jump on and take a free ride back to the S/F.
She tried, but couldn't.

I think there are some situations where it's acceptable to let them co-mingle. In this case, it would have been OK to get a solo unprotected rider off the open road a little earlier. I seriously doubt she would have used us to catch her field. We weren't catching anyone, but that's an entirely different thread.

cslone

Around here I have seen it enforced many times. They are pretty specific about it in the pre-race meeting a lot of times too.

Duke of Kent

I know the rule, but I've never seen a situation where it was applicable. Most of the RR courses have features that make intermingling of two groups damn near impossible; if the guys in the lower cats were capable of hitting the power climbs at a certain rate, they should be in another race. Obviously not a problem in crits.

Odd thing I've noticed: sandbaggers or the lazy sprinter types are much more rare in hilly RRs, even those with long flat finishes. Harder to hide from the wind if everyone is slogging up the climb at 15 per.

All of this being said, I generally try to follow all of the rules of the race. Never knowingly or intentionally violated any rules, except for the odd madison sling here and there...

thatguy

It's happened in every road race I've ever done. All were dropped riders, however. (Including me). Here in Florida, if you're not in the front group, the officials don't really seem to care what you do.

DrPete 

I got dropped in an RR last year and the women's breakaway group caught up with me. I felt like the moto would've run me off the road before I saw any of that draft...

It appears to be quite strictly enforced by the officials around here.

VosBike

I think the rule is mostly in effect so people won't intentionally drop back to help riders breaking away from a race behind them.

Coyote2

This was the situation in my last RR: I got gapped on a big climb, then when the road flattened out, I was eventually passed by a group comprised of about three riders from my category (35+ cat 4) and a couple of riders from a category that had started ten minutes after my cat (55+ open). They were all working together, and I joined them. I did, however, try to stay on the wheels of the guys from my cat, but we were all working together.

I suppose the refs were watching other riders who may have actually been in contention for something (i.e., not us). So I am still wondering: if a ref saw us working together, would we likely have been warned, DQ'd, or what?

Cypress

If it's a concern to you, come to MT where there are only two cat races. P/1/2/3 and 4/5. The masters are usually thrown into the 4/5's for fun.

waterrockets 

Yeah, I popped off the back of the 2nd climb at the Iron Horse Classic (SM3), and got caught by a 5-woman break including Inga Thompson and Rebecca Twig. I hung with them for 5 minutes until I couldn't hang on any more. There was a moto right there, and nobody said anything to me.

bdcheung

Around here if you're OTB, you're OTB. And if the wheel truck passes you, you're SOL because that usually means the road behind them is open to traffic. And you better not flat on clinchers, else you're walking home.

Coyote2

Waterrockets, what was your time for the Iron Horse? Just curious.

'nother

This is the text of the rule, from the USCF 2007 Rulebook: "3B5. Taking pace or assistance from any outside means is forbidden, including holding on to a motor vehicle or taking pace from riders in a different race that is concurrently on the same course [relegation or disqualification]."

So to clarify, the rule does not necessarily prohibit working with other category riders, it prevents working with people in other races. As such it may even prevent riders within the same category from working together, if they are in different races (i.e. Cat 4 Elite and Cat 4 Master 35+).

I have yet to see the rule be enforced by a race official around here, but the general disparity between riding abilities usually takes care of it anyway. And if it doesn't, many of the riders themselves seem to be aware of the rule...I've heard guys warning other riders to get out of their pack because they're in a different field (race).

waterrockets 

DNF After all the pro women's scenery rode by, I hopped out and hitched a ride back to Durango in an RV. Bad day (this was 1993). The next day, I got 5th in the cross-country MTB sport race, with a field of 100, so I made up for it somewhat (my 2nd MTB race).

thatguy

ditto