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  1. #251
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    Do any of you find that a TT-specific bike is easier to ride, thus producing significant gains in power, than a road bike with aerobars? I love the TT, and I want to use it to compete against myself and a few peers, but I am super uncomfortable in the RB with bars. The issue is that I wouldn't mind the discomfort if I felt that the discomfort was worth it. I know that when I get into a great aero position that I can actually breathe in, I can't steer mybike because I am so far over the front wheel. Does a good TT bike solve this, or is it a fool's errand to try to improve TT times with a TT specific frame? I feel like I would love to TT at a solid 173bpm (a good HR for 30min efforts for me) but I feel my HR shoot up every time I am in the aero position.

    I could care less about aero at my speed, but does the comfort and efficiency of the TT or tri frame make it worth the gains for you?

  2. #252
    Resident Alien Racer Ex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by momo15 View Post
    I could care less about aero at my speed, but does the comfort and efficiency of the TT or tri frame make it worth the gains for you?
    Yes.

    It's a lot more involved than buying a frame and sticking parts on there though. And there's wide range of differences between TT frames.

  3. #253
    Senior Member Yotsko's Avatar
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    I got suckered into doing my first TT this weekend. Looking forward to trying it out, but I have a feeling it's going to suck. At least they have a merckx class! It's a 40k, so get up to speed, set FTP and stop pedaling an hour later....that about right?

    Is there any point in taking spare wheels to a TT? There couldn't possibly be enough follow trucks...
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  4. #254
    My idea of fun kensuf's Avatar
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    Always bring spare wheels in case something happens before the event starts, or for any changes in the conditions. There probably won't be any trucks following you, so a flat can ruin your day.
    Putting the Duh in Floriduh.

  5. #255
    Senior Member jsutkeepspining's Avatar
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    My note to everyone: Ride your damn tt bikes, or be prepared to be embarrassed when you dont win tt's, and produce 50 watts less than you should be producing!!!!!!!
    cat 1-o-meter: wtf am i doing??????
    Quote Originally Posted by Racer Ex View Post
    You're not dumb. You're just less smart.

  6. #256
    Senior Member ericm979's Avatar
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    I have a power pacing question. I'm going to do a hillclimb TT, my first TT in over 20 years. There's some false flat and flat, maybe a mile or so, and the remaining 5.2 miles is a climb. It should be about 30 minutes. My best 20 minutes, set about three weeks ago, was about 10% over ftp. What sort of power should I try to put down? Should I start conservative and ramp it up if I am feeling good?

  7. #257
    Resident Alien Racer Ex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ericm979 View Post
    IShould I start conservative and ramp it up if I am feeling good?
    That would be my call, especially on Diablo. Really easy to find yourself in trouble when the climb starts; this is where you'll spend most of your time on the course and where you want your best effort.

  8. #258
    Senior Member ericm979's Avatar
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    How conservative? FTP, or lower?

  9. #259
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    I've got a 24k TT this sunday.
    Forecast says it's going to be 30C, which is hot for our standards.
    It's also always quite humid around these parts, which makes for a tough combo.
    Any recomendations or tips for TT's in especially hot & humid weather?

  10. #260
    These Guys Eat Oreos Creatre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    I've got a 24k TT this sunday.
    Forecast says it's going to be 30C, which is hot for our standards.
    It's also always quite humid around these parts, which makes for a tough combo.
    Any recomendations or tips for TT's in especially hot & humid weather?
    HTFU.

    24k isn't that long, heat shouldn't be that big of a deal. Should still be able to do this without a bottle. Stay hydrated right up until you head out. Just make sure you have some tape on your bars if you are one of those guys that doesn't have any because of aero or weight. Hands get real slippery when its that hot and humid.
    Category 2 | | Velogames BikeForums Leagues: 1st - 2012 Veulta, 1st - 2011 Vuelta, 2nd - 2013 Vuelta, 3rd - 2012 Giro, 4th - 2012 TdF

  11. #261
    My idea of fun kensuf's Avatar
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    Bags of ice on your neck during warmup.
    Putting the Duh in Floriduh.

  12. #262
    These Guys Eat Oreos Creatre's Avatar
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    So, I've ridden my TT bike less than 250 miles since I got it built up about 2 months ago. Ever since I got it, I have been able to produce the same watts at threshold as on my road bike. Am I just super unaero or just don't have the problems that some people do with the 5-10% difference. I don't think I'm that unaero, I was fit by my coach, and have done reasonable in TTs so far, but I haven't videotaped myself or seen pics yet of what I look like. Just wondering if this is normal?
    Category 2 | | Velogames BikeForums Leagues: 1st - 2012 Veulta, 1st - 2011 Vuelta, 2nd - 2013 Vuelta, 3rd - 2012 Giro, 4th - 2012 TdF

  13. #263
    Resident Alien Racer Ex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
    So, I've ridden my TT bike less than 250 miles since I got it built up about 2 months ago. Ever since I got it, I have been able to produce the same watts at threshold as on my road bike. Am I just super unaero or just don't have the problems that some people do with the 5-10% difference. I don't think I'm that unaero, I was fit by my coach, and have done reasonable in TTs so far, but I haven't videotaped myself or seen pics yet of what I look like. Just wondering if this is normal?
    Q: I have a tree. Is it big enough?
    A: Eat lightbulbs.

  14. #264
    Resident Alien Racer Ex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdelaaR View Post
    I've got a 24k TT this sunday.
    Forecast says it's going to be 30C, which is hot for our standards.
    It's also always quite humid around these parts, which makes for a tough combo.
    Any recomendations or tips for TT's in especially hot & humid weather?
    1) Put Creatre on your ignore list.

    2) Think cool...stay shaded as much as possible, heat is cumulative and the more time you stay out of it the better. Don't warm up on a trainer unless you have shade and a fan. Cold, not lukewarm fluids go in and don't over do it. Don't leave your clothing/helmet/shoes in the sun or a hot car. I'll pour cold water over myself several times prior to the race and especially right before. If your TT helmet has a face shield go ride without it and see if you notice more air flow into the helmet. The wattage reduction you'll experience without it will be paid back in gains in wattage from the additional cooling.

    There's a lot more but those are starter points. You might also poke around the TDF TT pages...there are often some nuggets there as those guys are doing long TT's in some very hot weather also.
    Last edited by Racer Ex; 08-16-12 at 09:10 AM.

  15. #265
    These Guys Eat Oreos Creatre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Racer Ex View Post
    Q: I have a tree. Is it big enough?
    A: Eat lightbulbs.
    WTF man.
    Category 2 | | Velogames BikeForums Leagues: 1st - 2012 Veulta, 1st - 2011 Vuelta, 2nd - 2013 Vuelta, 3rd - 2012 Giro, 4th - 2012 TdF

  16. #266
    Resident Alien Racer Ex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
    WTF man.
    Ask a general question with no specifics in a TT thread and you're going to get that type of answer. At least from people who actually know what they are talking about.

    Breaking it down:

    Quote Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
    Am I just super unaero or just don't have the problems that some people do with the 5-10% difference.
    Dunno without at least looking at some video or pics

    Quote Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
    I don't think I'm that unaero, I was fit by my coach
    Some of the worst TT fits I've worked with were done by coaches.

    Quote Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
    and have done reasonable in TTs so far,
    Define reasonable. Time/distance/wattage? Relative to who/what/where? Course details? You a big guy or a little guy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
    but I haven't videotaped myself or seen pics yet of what I look like.
    See above.

    Quote Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
    Just wondering if this is normal?
    Not having much of a clue about your TT set up? Yes. And that's not a dig. People aren't born knowing things. What separates folks is those that realize they are in 1st grade and those that don't and give advice based on a very thin veneer of knowledge.

    My comment about putting you on the ignore list for your HTFU comment was a dig, and well deserved. I could do a long dissertation on the effects of heat during a TT, both anecdotal and scientific, especially when people from normally cold, damp climates suddenly are out doing efforts in hot, damp climates, including passing out and crashing.

    TT's are all about specifics and details. Start at ground zero and take some pics or video, and keep records of watts/time/distance/conditions for your efforts. That's your baseline
    Last edited by Racer Ex; 08-16-12 at 09:42 AM.

  17. #267
    These Guys Eat Oreos Creatre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Racer Ex View Post
    Ask a general question with no specifics in a TT thread and you're going to get that type of answer. At least from people who actually know what they are talking about.

    Breaking it down:



    Dunno without at least looking at some video or pics



    Some of the worst TT fits I've worked with were done by coaches



    Define reasonable. Time/distance? Relative to who/what/where?



    See above.



    Not having much of a clue about your TT set up? Yes. And that's not a dig. People aren't born knowing things. What separates folks is those that realize they are in 1st grade and those that don't and give advice based on a very thin veneer of knowledge.

    My comment about putting you on the ignore list for your HTFU comment was a dig, and well deserved. I could do a long dissertation on the effects of heat during a TT, both anecdotal and scientific, especially when people from normally cold, damp climates suddenly are out doing efforts in hot, damp climates, including passing out and crashing.

    TT's are all about specifics and details. Start at ground zero and take some pics or video, and keep records of watts/time/distance/conditions for your efforts. That's your baseline
    Brutal, man. Even for you!

    Could have just said: We need more info. Or: yes that's common if you are as aero as a tree.

    And honestly, in that question about the heat, it was no different than mine. How does he normally hydrate before a race? Does he usually have trouble in heat? Is he expecting to warmup in the sun? Is he expecting to have to be in the heat an extended amount of time? ETC, could go on and on.

    For most people, if you HTFU and are decently hydrated beforehand, that race in specific won't be much different than a normal race. That's only 30C degrees, which is extremely cool, even with humidity. It might be warm considered to normal for his location, but it's not mind blowing difference. Again, do we know where he lives? What's the normal climate? Is his location accurate in his avatar?

    Now, a 115 degree TT in Arizona, or a 105 degree TT with 100% humidity in Georgia, and maybe we need to discuss what we need to do special.
    Category 2 | | Velogames BikeForums Leagues: 1st - 2012 Veulta, 1st - 2011 Vuelta, 2nd - 2013 Vuelta, 3rd - 2012 Giro, 4th - 2012 TdF

  18. #268
    Resident Alien Racer Ex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
    Brutal, man. Even for you!

    Could have just said: We need more info. Or: yes that's common if you are as aero as a tree.

    And honestly, in that question about the heat, it was no different than mine. How does he normally hydrate before a race? Does he usually have trouble in heat? Is he expecting to warmup in the sun? Is he expecting to have to be in the heat an extended amount of time? ETC, could go on and on.

    For most people, if you HTFU and are decently hydrated beforehand, that race in specific won't be much different than a normal race. That's only 30C degrees, which is extremely cool, even with humidity. It might be warm considered to normal for his location, but it's not mind blowing difference. Again, do we know where he lives? What's the normal climate? Is his location accurate in his avatar?

    Now, a 115 degree TT in Arizona, or a 105 degree TT with 100% humidity in Georgia, and maybe we need to discuss what we need to do special.
    You're right, what would I know about this. 86F and high humidity is extremely cool. He should put on a sweater. I'm sorry. Proceed.
    Last edited by Racer Ex; 08-16-12 at 10:01 AM.

  19. #269
    I need speed AzTallRider's Avatar
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    I've been using a Camelbak 'RaceBak' under my skinsuit, and playing around with methods to get the most out of it. First time, I didn't add air when I froze it, couldn't add water, and had a hard plank of ice against my back that I couldn't drink from until halfway through the 40K. Second time I was able to add water, but didn't have enough ice, and it didn't provide much cooling through the pad that comes with it. Sunday I froze more water in it, and also didn't use the pad, so there was better contact with my back. I could have frozen even more water, as it was gone before the end of the race. But I believe there was a significant amount of heat transfer over the course of the 30K, and that is helpful in 100*+. An ice sock may cool even better due to evaporation, but it's harder to drink from, and I'm someone who wants (as of now anyway, and in the summer) to drink frequently during the race.

    TTs involve at least as big a learning curve as the other disciplines.
    "If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."

  20. #270
    Resident Alien Racer Ex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzTallRider View Post
    TTs involve at least as big a learning curve as the other disciplines.
    I used to think so, but I've been duly corrected.

  21. #271
    Senior Member AdelaaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
    That's only 30C degrees, which is extremely cool, even with humidity.
    You may call that extremely cool, which is probably an exaggeration, but it's all very relative.
    I've been in the Sahara at 50 degrees Celcius ... no problem.
    But here in Belgium, with the humidity, anything above 30 degrees is almost unbearable.
    Since this was my first "hot" TT ... I asked if anyone had some tips for a newbee.
    Last edited by AdelaaR; 08-28-12 at 05:08 PM.

  22. #272
    ride lots be safe Creakyknees's Avatar
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    Hey guys, check out the TT course for the Cotton Patch (Greenville, TX) this Saturday 15 Sep: 1 mile total, out and back, turnaround on a 2-3 lane city street.

    http://ridewithgps.com/routes/1516479

    The "hill" on the profile is just an overpass.

    So I'm thinking, all-out effort, but what about the turnaround? Come in hot, brake at the last possible moment (while downshifting), then sprint away... seems simple... what am I forgetting?
    "have fun and be kind"
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  23. #273
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    The race will be won at the turnaround. Practice this.

  24. #274
    Making a kilometer blurry waterrockets's Avatar
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    Agreed. Practice the turnaround, and fire out of it like you're on fire. Get up to ludicrous speed, then recover a tiny bit from the sprint.

    My approach to these < 3 minute efforts is to pace it slightly in the first half. At 30mph, it takes a lot more power to go a little faster, so overcooking it will not gain you much time, and will ruin you on the way back. I would get to where I was within about 1:30 of the finish, then really do go 100% all-out every pedal stroke, leaving you down at 300W or so at the line. For this course, I'd probably fly up the overpass and maybe accelerate on that climb, and then come out of it channeling Hoy.

  25. #275
    Resident Alien Racer Ex's Avatar
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    Two ways of riding this. It's essentially a 1.5k effort so you can either go flat out then survive, or try to pace.

    Either one is going to be horrible.

    I'd also look at the wind, if it's a headwind out bury it and survive on the way back, if it's a tail on the way out hold back a little.

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