Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

"The 33"-Road Bike Racing We set this forum up for our members to discuss their experiences in either pro or amateur racing, whether they are the big races, or even the small backyard races. Don't forget to update all the members with your own race results.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 06-19-11, 08:28 PM   #3326
rbart4506 
You blink and it's gone.
 
rbart4506's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Dundas, Ontario
Bikes: Race bike, training bike, go fast bike and a trainer slave.
Posts: 4,436
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Select the section and hit CTRL+X to cut it out....
__________________
"On the other hand riding down a hill at 55 MPH wearing (essentially) women's underwear and a Styrofoam cup on your head is the epitome of rational life-extending decisions." - RacerEx
rbart4506 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-11, 08:07 AM   #3327
Creatre
These Guys Eat Oreos
 
Creatre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes: Yes
Posts: 3,422
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbart4506 View Post
Select the section and hit CTRL+X to cut it out....
Thanks to whoever asked that and rbart for the answer.

Finally got rid of my 10s of 900w that showed up when I did a wheelie starting a TT on a 15% grade. As cool as it was having a world-class/pro 1min power, it was not true to my actual power.
Creatre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-11, 04:09 PM   #3328
heckler
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: South Jersey
Bikes:
Posts: 2,023
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Just bought a ptap used from a fourm member. Fun to play around with and I am having fun screwing around trying to hit new personal bests every day.

For my fifth day with the wheel I hooked the bike up to the trainer (inside my hot garage on a humid day) and warmed up for 5 min then rode for 20 min as hard as I felt I could hold on a screen that didn't display power. Is the idea that 95% of that number is your FTP?

If that is the case I am confused because the second day I had the ptap I did a local group ride and have a higher 20 min number while riding in a pack of people with zeros added into the average. Should your 20 min be based on my gararge "test" or the best 20 min number I can generate under any condition?

Numbers below:
(Garage first then group ride day)
Peak 20min (255 watts):
Duration: 20:00
Work: 305 kJ
TSS: 36.3 (intensity factor 1.043)
Norm Power: 258
VI: 1.01
Pw:HR: 3.98%
Pa:HR: -2.63%
Distance: 6.185 mi
Elevation Gain: 0 ft
Elevation Loss: 0 ft
Grade: 0.0 % (0 ft)
Min Max Avg
Power: 191 635 255 watts
Heart Rate: 146 193 166 bpm
Cadence: 83 117 92 rpm
Speed: 16.6 30.9 18.6 mph
Pace 1:56 3:37 3:14 min/mi
Altitude: 231 231 231 ft
Crank Torque: 190 488 234 lb-in
Temperature: 82.4 86 84.3 Fahrenheit

Peak 20min (286 watts):
Duration: 20:00
Work: 342 kJ
TSS: 58.9 (intensity factor 1.329)
Norm Power: 328
VI: 1.15
Pw:HR: 8.46%
Pa:HR: 7.73%
Distance: 8.561 mi
Elevation Gain: 79 ft
Elevation Loss: 59 ft
Grade: 0.0 % (22 ft)
Min Max Avg
Power: 0 935 286 watts
Heart Rate: 150 194 179 bpm
Cadence: 20 111 89 rpm
Speed: 11.9 32.3 25.7 mph
Pace 1:51 5:03 2:20 min/mi
Altitude: 91 127 108 ft
Crank Torque: 0 1092 267 lb-in
Temperature: 82.4 84.2 83.7 Fahrenheit
heckler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-11, 05:13 PM   #3329
shovelhd 
Senior Member
 
shovelhd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western MA
Bikes: Yes
Posts: 15,383
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'd do a MAP test.
shovelhd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-11, 08:03 PM   #3330
asgelle
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Bikes:
Posts: 3,205
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by heckler View Post
For my fifth day with the wheel I hooked the bike up to the trainer (inside my hot garage on a humid day) and warmed up for 5 min then rode for 20 min as hard as I felt I could hold on a screen that didn't display power. Is the idea that 95% of that number is your FTP?
http://alex-cycle.blogspot.com/2008/...adly-sins.html
http://alex-cycle.blogspot.com/2009/...ing-ftp-2.html
asgelle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-11, 12:33 PM   #3331
lennyk
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 460
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I just replaced the battery in my yellow ptap computer,
forgot to adjust the date, did a ride yesterday and it came out as 2005
any idea how to change the date in the data ?
I checked the csv file but there is no date value in it.

thanks,

L
lennyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-11, 01:06 PM   #3332
Specialized2k10 
Pedal Warrior
 
Specialized2k10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NorCal
Bikes: 2010 Specialized Allez with SRAM Force gruppo
Posts: 486
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I just started trying to get a structure program going. I did a 30 min LT heart rate test the way Joe Friel stated in his Training with heart rate book. i have a question...

1. i know he said not to train with max heart rate. my max is 191 but the LTHR avg I got from the test was 165bpm. would this 25 bpm diff be normal or did i do the test wrong? i will do the test in a few weeks and recheck my numbers.'

2. im still learning how to make an actual training program, i was considering buying spinerval dvds to ride on the trainer. would spinervals help improve my performance or a still not well structured riding program?
__________________
2011 BMC Team Machine SLR01

2005 Specialized FSR XC

Last edited by Specialized2k10; 06-23-11 at 01:11 PM.
Specialized2k10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-11, 01:49 PM   #3333
caloso
Packfodding 3
 
caloso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
Bikes: Ridley Excalibur, Gazelle Champion Mondial, On-One Pompino, Specialized Rock Hopper
Posts: 33,496
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
1. If your max is 191, then 165 sounds like it's in the ball park for LTHR.

2. I've never used Spinervals -- I know a lot of folks love them for the winters, but you should be riding outside this time of year.
caloso is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-11, 02:03 PM   #3334
Specialized2k10 
Pedal Warrior
 
Specialized2k10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NorCal
Bikes: 2010 Specialized Allez with SRAM Force gruppo
Posts: 486
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
thanks Caloso. i got the same answer about spinervals. i agree about riding outside, so ill try to create a workout program for the summer and hope it provides good results.
__________________
2011 BMC Team Machine SLR01

2005 Specialized FSR XC
Specialized2k10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-11, 02:03 PM   #3335
shovelhd 
Senior Member
 
shovelhd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western MA
Bikes: Yes
Posts: 15,383
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by caloso View Post
1. If your max is 191, then 165 sounds like it's in the ball park for LTHR.
Those are my exact numbers.
shovelhd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-11, 02:23 PM   #3336
caloso
Packfodding 3
 
caloso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
Bikes: Ridley Excalibur, Gazelle Champion Mondial, On-One Pompino, Specialized Rock Hopper
Posts: 33,496
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Specialized2k10 View Post
thanks Caloso. i got the same answer about spinervals. i agree about riding outside, so ill try to create a workout program for the summer and hope it provides good results.
Check out the BF Workout Cookbook sticky at the top of the forum. I'm a big fan (well, that's not the right word, but you know what I mean) of ZCI's. They work better with a powermeter but I did them last summer with an HRM.
caloso is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-11, 08:02 PM   #3337
Specialized2k10 
Pedal Warrior
 
Specialized2k10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NorCal
Bikes: 2010 Specialized Allez with SRAM Force gruppo
Posts: 486
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Caloso you have any tips about training with heart rate since you mentioned doing it for some intervals? Things I should avoid or how to get more accurate results. Thanks.
__________________
2011 BMC Team Machine SLR01

2005 Specialized FSR XC
Specialized2k10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-11, 04:57 PM   #3338
heckler
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: South Jersey
Bikes:
Posts: 2,023
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
pro+ ptap, does the cassette get a spacer?
heckler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-11, 05:11 PM   #3339
caloso
Packfodding 3
 
caloso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
Bikes: Ridley Excalibur, Gazelle Champion Mondial, On-One Pompino, Specialized Rock Hopper
Posts: 33,496
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Specialized2k10 View Post
Caloso you have any tips about training with heart rate since you mentioned doing it for some intervals? Things I should avoid or how to get more accurate results. Thanks.
First thing is to establish a lactate threshold HR, which you've already done. Most of the interval workouts are based on functional threshold power, but you can use HR as a proxy for that, so if it says 108% FTP, try doing the interval at 108% of your LTHR. Keep in mind that the longer you're working, the higher your HR will be at a similar power ("cardiac drift"). I think this has to do with losing a slight amount of blood volume as you dehydrate, and your heart has to beat a little faster to push the same amount of RBCs to your tissues.

I've also found that the shorter the interval, the more I needed to focus on perceived effort and less on actual HR. It's hard to explain in words, but the more intervals you do, the better in tune you will be with how much effort you can maintain for the given time. So for example a 3 minute interval needs to be hard, not an all out sprint, but you need to push it. I'd call that an 8 or 8.5 out of 10. A 20 minute interval is going to be more like a 7 -7.5. A one minute interval ("Waterrocket interval") is 9.5-10. It HURTS.
caloso is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-11, 07:57 PM   #3340
shovelhd 
Senior Member
 
shovelhd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western MA
Bikes: Yes
Posts: 15,383
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by heckler View Post
pro+ ptap, does the cassette get a spacer?
Yes. Powertaps use standard freehubs.
shovelhd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-11, 09:02 PM   #3341
heckler
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: South Jersey
Bikes:
Posts: 2,023
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
not really a question, but I finally brought my 1 min power into the untrained section of the chart (560 w), so now I am represented in all 4 sections. (the rest are at least in cat 5 level

I never really did 1 min sprint type training. I have found out 1) I am not very good at them 2) I hate them, they seem long enough that they aren't a true sprint, but if you don't stand and sprint the number is too low. I actually have a low of 101 watts for my peak 1 min so clearly I gave up a little too early and have room to improve. It is quite hard to test without a 1 min hill.
heckler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-11, 10:20 PM   #3342
waterrockets 
Making a kilometer blurry
 
waterrockets's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin (near TX)
Bikes: rkwaki's porn collection
Posts: 26,130
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by heckler View Post
not really a question, but I finally brought my 1 min power into the untrained section of the chart (560 w), so now I am represented in all 4 sections. (the rest are at least in cat 5 level

I never really did 1 min sprint type training. I have found out 1) I am not very good at them 2) I hate them, they seem long enough that they aren't a true sprint, but if you don't stand and sprint the number is too low. I actually have a low of 101 watts for my peak 1 min so clearly I gave up a little too early and have room to improve. It is quite hard to test without a 1 min hill.
I actually enjoy about a 40 second hill. Roll into the bottom of it off the previous descent, open the hell up with a really hard sprint, then just don't let up until 1:03. The hill ending at about 40 seconds allows me to get back on top of the gear and get some cadence going again. Seems to bump power a bit.
waterrockets is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-24-11, 11:03 PM   #3343
crapweasel
Senior Member
 
crapweasel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 322
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I still can't figure out how to fit in 1' testing. I'm either knackered from long rides, recovering from short intervals, or trying to do a rest week. I sprint at the end of a long ride and pull out good e-wang sprint power, but that's not exactly a test.
crapweasel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-11, 11:35 AM   #3344
HMF
SkinnyStrong
 
HMF's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Austin, Tejas
Bikes:
Posts: 1,169
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have a Golden Cheetah question. Does the CP curve get "pushed up" automatically as you set new PRs? I'm hitting some PRs lately and they're right up against the CP curve, but I can't remember if the CP curve used to be lower. It seems to think that my 1 hour power could be 250 watts, which is above what I entered as my threshold power in the Athlete preferences.
HMF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-11, 02:35 PM   #3345
waterrockets 
Making a kilometer blurry
 
waterrockets's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Austin (near TX)
Bikes: rkwaki's porn collection
Posts: 26,130
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by crapweasel View Post
I still can't figure out how to fit in 1' testing. I'm either knackered from long rides, recovering from short intervals, or trying to do a rest week. I sprint at the end of a long ride and pull out good e-wang sprint power, but that's not exactly a test.
It's no good anyway. You only need a few of them each year, if that much. Do one before a threshold workout after you're fully recovered from a day or two off. Just make it a sub-threshold threshold workout
waterrockets is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-11, 03:22 PM   #3346
AzTallRider 
I need speed
 
AzTallRider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Bikes: Giant Propel, Cervelo P2
Posts: 5,550
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I did my first formal FTP test this morning, using Coggan's method, which includes a 5' max effort, a 10' rest interval, and then the 20' FTP effort. It came in lower than I expected. My guesstimate was overly optimistic, and, for a variety of reasons, today just wasn't a good day for me. I also made the usual rookie mistake of going out too hard in both efforts, so I was fading, rather than building to the finish:

.........Min.....Avg.....Max
5'......270......378......601
20'......94......286......633

I gained a lot of respect today for you folks that do the long TT's. I kept thinking "Okay, that's a long enough pull - where the hell is a wheel to suck?"
__________________
"If you're riding less than 18 MPH up a 2% grade please tell people Coggan is coaching you."
AzTallRider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-11, 06:40 PM   #3347
crapweasel
Senior Member
 
crapweasel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 322
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by HMF View Post
I have a Golden Cheetah question. Does the CP curve get "pushed up" automatically as you set new PRs? I'm hitting some PRs lately and they're right up against the CP curve, but I can't remember if the CP curve used to be lower. It seems to think that my 1 hour power could be 250 watts, which is above what I entered as my threshold power in the Athlete preferences.
It recalculates automatically, but new PRs don't mean it's going to go up. You could just be filling in area under the previously calculated curve. It calculates CP based on two points, so you could still have other points that are better.
crapweasel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-11, 10:06 PM   #3348
HMF
SkinnyStrong
 
HMF's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Austin, Tejas
Bikes:
Posts: 1,169
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by crapweasel View Post
It recalculates automatically, but new PRs don't mean it's going to go up. You could just be filling in area under the previously calculated curve. It calculates CP based on two points, so you could still have other points that are better.
Yea that's what I meant. Right now everything from 3 minutes to 20 minutes is bumping right up against the curve estimate.

What 2 points are you referring to? the best two? or specific power peaks?
HMF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-11, 01:12 AM   #3349
crapweasel
Senior Member
 
crapweasel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 322
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'm pretty sure it picks the best two points that give you the highest possible CP, so the specific points could change over time. It might be 2' and 15' one time, then 3' and 20' if you set a new "CP busting" power there.
crapweasel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-11, 12:07 PM   #3350
SpongeDad
Overacting because I can
 
SpongeDad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: The Mean Streets of Bethesda, MD
Bikes: Merlin Agilis, Trek 1500
Posts: 4,552
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
How do I export WKO data to MS Excel? I tried copy/paste, but that didn't work.
__________________
“Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm." (Churchill)

"I am a courageous cyclist." (SpongeDad)
SpongeDad is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:49 PM.