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Old 04-07-14, 11:44 AM   #6026
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I'm unfamiliar with this "trophies" you speak of. I did, however, win a bottle of chain lube at a mtb race once. And a hat that says Root 66 on it. So worth it.
LOL - I'm also a competitive shooter and my wife used to greet me when I came back from a match by asking "Did you win another hat, or was this a coozie match?"

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Old 04-08-14, 10:22 AM   #6027
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I have a ptap/Joule configuration question:

Why do I see no readings on my Joule?

I have installed the software, and navigated through the "find" and "pair all" portions of the sensor menu. It doesn't really give me any verification that it indeed has (or hasn't) paired to the G3 hub unit, and afterward I get no readings when I pedal the bike.
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Old 04-08-14, 10:24 AM   #6028
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Is there a screen on the Joule for sensor ID?
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Old 04-08-14, 11:17 AM   #6029
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No, there is no sensor ID; it just goes back to the sensor menu.

I followed the video below and received no ID number after attempting to pair:

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Old 04-08-14, 02:48 PM   #6030
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try new batteries?
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Old 04-08-14, 04:01 PM   #6031
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try new batteries?
No comment...
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Old 04-10-14, 08:31 AM   #6032
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yesterday - warmed up and a 20min FTP test into a headwind at 290 watts.

Question for you Golden Cheetah users... my power meter drops signals here and there, once for 10 seconds during that test. I can Edit the ride and delete those rows, and the interval itself seems to update in GC with new Average and XWatts for that period. But the CP graph and chart doesn't seem to be affected. Is there anything to do there to remove data points where the meter drops and update the whole ride?
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Old 04-10-14, 10:00 AM   #6033
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Okay I broke down and looked at WKO+ for a ride where I did a set of Vo2 3min intervals. The rest of the ride was Z2. Here is the breakdown

Total Ride Time: 1:43:00

It doesn't seem like its way off, it didn't capture the max 3min power



[table="width: 500, class: grid, align: center"]
[tr]
[td][/td]
[td]Quarq[/td]
[td]Powertap[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]5s Peak
[/td]
[td]702[/td]
[td]705[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]10s Peak
[/td]
[td]605[/td]
[td]592[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]20s Peak
[/td]
[td]543[/td]
[td]525[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]30s Peak
[/td]
[td]498[/td]
[td]489[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]1min Peak
[/td]
[td]418[/td]
[td]403[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]2min Peak
[/td]
[td]371[/td]
[td]379[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]5min Peak
[/td]
[td]295[/td]
[td]301[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]10 min Peak
[/td]
[td]276[/td]
[td]275[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]20 min Peak
[/td]
[td]262[/td]
[td]259[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]30 min Peak
[/td]
[td]256[/td]
[td]252[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]60 min Peak

[/td]
[td]226[/td]
[td]221[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
[td]First 15min of Ride

[/td]
[td]180[/td]
[td]187[/td]
[/tr]

[tr]
[td]Average Power


[/td]
[td]208[/td]
[td]203[/td]
[/tr]

[tr]
[td]Normalized Power


[/td]
[td]258[/td]
[td]254[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]
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Old 04-10-14, 10:13 AM   #6034
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if any guru's could figure some of this data out for me it would be great I am confused.
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Old 04-10-14, 10:19 AM   #6035
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clones2 View Post
yesterday - warmed up and a 20min FTP test into a headwind at 290 watts.

Question for you Golden Cheetah users... my power meter drops signals here and there, once for 10 seconds during that test. I can Edit the ride and delete those rows, and the interval itself seems to update in GC with new Average and XWatts for that period. But the CP graph and chart doesn't seem to be affected. Is there anything to do there to remove data points where the meter drops and update the whole ride?
Ten seconds won't affect CP much. The bigger issue is why your power meter is dropping.
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Old 04-10-14, 10:41 AM   #6036
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if any guru's could figure some of this data out for me it would be great I am confused.
I can't remember how to do it in WKO, but in GC, you can search for intervals. So I can say find my six best 3' intervals, and it will return that part of my workout for me.
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Old 04-10-14, 11:04 AM   #6037
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I can't remember how to do it in WKO, but in GC, you can search for intervals. So I can say find my six best 3' intervals, and it will return that part of my workout for me.
I'll install GC shortly, how does one accomplish this?
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Old 04-10-14, 11:09 AM   #6038
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Is that the exact same ride Oleg?
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Old 04-10-14, 11:10 AM   #6039
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there's a fast find function in WKO+. google it if you cant find it using the words fast find
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Old 04-10-14, 11:15 AM   #6040
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Figured it out, it was easy:

For the Quarq(3min intervals)
367, 366, 365, 365, 357, 347

For the Powertap( 3 min intervals)
373, 362, 356, 350, 349, 345

Hey GC is actually kind of neat~!

Avg of 3x6 intervals: Quarq: 361.167 W
Avg of 3x6 intervals: Powertap: 355.833 W

Last edited by ovoleg; 04-10-14 at 11:19 AM.
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Old 04-10-14, 11:16 AM   #6041
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Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
Is that the exact same ride Oleg?
exactly same ride. I had the Quarq and Powertap both mounted on the same bike and I borrowed my friends Garmin 810 which I had in my back pocket.
Here is a display from both

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Old 04-10-14, 11:27 AM   #6042
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What I notice from looking at the 3min data of each interval is that the powertap is either dead-nuts on or high/low relative to the Quarq. I'd like to assume the Quarq is more consistent, it jives with my RPE
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Old 04-10-14, 11:44 AM   #6043
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Based on my experience, don't.
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Old 04-10-14, 11:57 AM   #6044
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovoleg View Post
Figured it out, it was easy:

For the Quarq(3min intervals)
367, 366, 365, 365, 357, 347

For the Powertap( 3 min intervals)
373, 362, 356, 350, 349, 345

Hey GC is actually kind of neat~!

Avg of 3x6 intervals: Quarq: 361.167 W
Avg of 3x6 intervals: Powertap: 355.833 W
So...1.5% RPD, seems like good data agreement to me. You can either view that 1.5% as instrument variability/drift or loss via drivetrain.
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Old 04-10-14, 12:21 PM   #6045
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So...1.5% RPD, seems like good data agreement to me. You can either view that 1.5% as instrument variability/drift or loss via drivetrain.
that's what i was going to say. you're comparing two totally different platforms measuring two different things, that data seems to be pretty good. what's more important is that powertap today = powertap tomorrow.
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Old 04-10-14, 12:26 PM   #6046
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That's vey good data. When my Quarqs were failing peak power was off by hundreds of watts and FTP by double digits.
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Old 04-10-14, 01:04 PM   #6047
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovoleg View Post
Figured it out, it was easy:

For the Quarq(3min intervals)
367, 366, 365, 365, 357, 347

For the Powertap( 3 min intervals)
373, 362, 356, 350, 349, 345

Hey GC is actually kind of neat~!

Avg of 3x6 intervals: Quarq: 361.167 W
Avg of 3x6 intervals: Powertap: 355.833 W
I find it useful to compare the ave power of each interval to the NP of the interval along with HR for each, variation in NP and ave power allows me to adjust the following interval starting power numbers to help with pacing, HR indicates my current aerobic state along with a second measure of how hard I went. I also like to see how my HR to power ratios change during the session. I like to store those numbers in a spreadsheet so I can see trends during training blocks to see how my training is effecting my times. The number one thing I am looking for is how my body responds during various phases of training so that I can use that to "peak" for top events. Number 2 thing I am looking for is fatigue so that I don't over train. After that I will be using the numbers to help ensure that when I move to the track I can ensure that I am not hurting my power numbers too much with my TT position. More data = more better.
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Old 04-10-14, 01:05 PM   #6048
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
Based on my experience, don't.
don't assume the Quarq is more consistent or ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by hack View Post
So...1.5% RPD, seems like good data agreement to me. You can either view that 1.5% as instrument variability/drift or loss via drivetrain.
I was looking at each individual interval more closely, sometimes its off by almost 10%
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike868y View Post
that's what i was going to say. you're comparing two totally different platforms measuring two different things, that data seems to be pretty good. what's more important is that powertap today = powertap tomorrow.
what do you mean powertap today = powertap tomorrow?
Quote:
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That's vey good data. When my Quarqs were failing peak power was off by hundreds of watts and FTP by double digits.
I hope mine never becomes this way , but I wouldn't know because it's going to be dedicated to the track bike and I doubt I'd be doing any FTP testing, the peak power might screw with me tho.
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Old 04-10-14, 01:09 PM   #6049
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The 1.5% overall difference to me, is not worrisome. I'd consider that within spec.

On the up to 10% difference, I would also trust the powertap over the quarq based on my personal experience. Even if it's not what you want to hear.

Overall though, it looks to me like both power meters are performing up to spec and are pretty closely matched.
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Old 04-10-14, 01:14 PM   #6050
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what do you mean powertap today = powertap tomorrow?
I am pretty sure he was just saying pick one and use that. Trends between two different power meters are not as important as picking one and using it to see you how you trend with just the one.

However it seems that you are starting to doubt the powertap repeatably which is the point of your testing different ways to measure power. As has already been mentioned you should ignore your one outlier dataset and only worry about it if it continues. Trends are what people look for with power ... along with their PR, because we all like to PR, but trends and repeatability are what really matter.

I too have two different systems, one for road and one for track ... makes for a very difficult comparison between the two workouts, as if I already didn't have enough issues with that.
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