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  1. #1
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    What is Cavendish's cadence in a sprint?

    It seems to be really low. From my observations, my estimate is that he has a cadence of between 90 and a 100, a fairly low cadence for a sprint, but I guess after going over 100 miles, your legs are not to have that much snap.

    So assuming he's riding a 53/11, that means his speed is about 35 to 40 mph.

    Does that seem right?
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  2. #2
    pan y agua merlinextraligh's Avatar
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    Don't think so. I'd bet you're 5mph or more light on the speed.
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    Banned. El Diablo Rojo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by San Rensho View Post
    It seems to be really low. From my observations, my estimate is that he has a cadence of between 90 and a 100, a fairly low cadence for a sprint, but I guess after going over 100 miles, your legs are not to have that much snap.

    So assuming he's riding a 53/11, that means his speed is about 35 to 40 mph.

    Does that seem right?

    35mph is pretty light for these guys, I hit 34.5 on Sat for the city limits on a flat road with slight head wind. The two guys in front of me were probably about .5-1mph faster. It looks like all three, Cav, Thor, and Tyler look like they are turning a low cadence though.

  4. #4
    powered by Racer Ex gsteinb's Avatar
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    I hit 38 and change last sunday in the 53x11. I'm pretty sure Cav can beat me.

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    gmt Grumpy McTrumpy's Avatar
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    I think the leadouts are over 40

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    gmt Grumpy McTrumpy's Avatar
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWGWJw4WwBA

    metronome says around 115rpm. Probably low-to-mid 40s for speed.

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    Banned. El Diablo Rojo's Avatar
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    What I'd love to see is his SRM downloads...

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    if you get cavendish's SRM downloads, dont go to europe

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    On the #4, the uphill sprint, he said he was in the 13 or 14. He was turning them over quicker then Thor. That's why he was able to come around him.

    Remember, kids a trackie.

    The 11 is not always the choice. Gotta have the strength to turn over a bigger, not necessarily the biggest gear, faster and longer than who you're sprinting against.

  10. #10
    abandoning fly:yes/land:no's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grumpy McTrumpy View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWGWJw4WwBA

    metronome says around 115rpm. Probably low-to-mid 40s for speed.
    according to my stop watch (the youtube clock), it took the lead group about 55 seconds to get from 1k to the finish. that works out to 40.39 mph average over the final 1k.

  11. #11
    abandoning fly:yes/land:no's Avatar
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    here is andre greipel's final 1000m at the tour of germany a few years ago (he won the sprint). it isn't cavendish, but a good look at a pro's power data in a sprint.

    earlier in the stage, he hit 1626 watts. average power for the last 30 seconds was 1061 watts.

  12. #12
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    Remember that just 4 rpm or so is 1 mph in the big gears.

    I should have emailed myself the little spreadsheet I made to calculate speed based on gear and cadence.

    cdr

  13. #13
    Banned. El Diablo Rojo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
    Remember that just 4 rpm or so is 1 mph in the big gears.

    I should have emailed myself the little spreadsheet I made to calculate speed based on gear and cadence.

    cdr

    Try this one

    http://home.earthlink.net/~mike.sherman/shift.html

    According to this chart 53x11@115rpm is 43.2mph based on a 23mm 700c tubular tire with 172.5mm crank arms.
    Last edited by El Diablo Rojo; 07-17-09 at 11:22 AM.

  14. #14
    Cat 666 fatallightning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fly:yes/land:no View Post
    here is andre greipel's final 1000m at the tour of germany a few years ago (he won the sprint). it isn't cavendish, but a good look at a pro's power data in a sprint.

    earlier in the stage, he hit 1626 watts. average power for the last 30 seconds was 1061 watts.
    Hm, low cadence, 110 or so in the final kick. Interesting.
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  15. #15
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    I think the final sprints are right around 45 mph. The leadouts are at about 40 - 41mph before they go. Extremely impressive.

  16. #16
    Trying to keep up ericcox's Avatar
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    I wonder if he is using a 53, or if he's running something a little bigger. I've nothing to go off, just curious.

  17. #17
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    On stage 11 I timed his last 7 strokes at just over 4 seconds which would be 102 RPM. Roughly 49kph in a 53x14. It looks like they gained about 30m of elevation in the final 500m so a 6% slope which would take a little over 1100W according to kreuzotter.

    My question is: why is it recommended to do spinups in the little ring if the pro sprinters aren't turning more than 110 or 120 in the final sprint?

  18. #18
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    Well, most of us are amateurs. Why would we try to copy pros, who are freaks of nature? What works for them shouldn't be what works for us.

    Also, I can all but guarantee that pro sprinters also do low-gear sprints. Just not when they're racing.
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  19. #19
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    I like that gear speed calculator. I plugged in 52, 53, 54 to get common chainrings vs speed.

    52x11 - going from 100 to 104 rpm is just over 1 mph difference (that's what I was referring to in my previous post). Miscounting just a few rpm (or varying cadence just a touch over a couple seconds) is significant.

    At 100 rpm, 52 vs 54 is 1.5 mph difference in speed. I guess when I ran a 54, it was worth either -3 rpm or forcing guys to pedal just a bit faster. Jeez 120 rpm.

    I think guys will run slightly larger rings (54 for example) to hone their sprint. I felt it was helpful at the very top end. I used to run 51, 53, then 54 as the season progressed. Now I can't turn over the 53 even so a 54 would be useless. And I don't have my 51 anymore so I just run a 53 all the time.

    cdr

  20. #20
    Senior Member Dubbayoo's Avatar
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    Thor seems to have the lowest cadence of any sprinter I've seen, and he always sits well before the line. He sprints like he's out of gas.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregf83 View Post
    My question is: why is it recommended to do spinups in the little ring if the pro sprinters aren't turning more than 110 or 120 in the final sprint?
    Keep in mind that the pros were amateurs once. They've done a lot of various training, miles, etc. Hincapie is the only Tour guy I've raced against (meaning we entered the same race - that's about the closest I got to beating him), and he cleaned up around here as a 15 year old. He rode the Jr gear limits (49x15 or 53x16 as an Intermediate, then one tooth smaller as a full fledged Junior), learned to spin those little gears, etc etc etc.

    Spinups and other high cadence drills help accelerate learning pedaling efficiency. This efficiency takes a long time to hone, lots of hours, lots of muscle memory, and drills and such help accelerate the process. That's why guys do fixed gear work, lots of LSD, spin ups, etc etc etc. Doing 15k or 20k miles a year for 3 or 5 or whatever years goes a long way towards honing pedaling efficiency. Or you could just do fewer miles for more years. I took the latter approach since I've never exceeded 10k miles, and usually am below 3k for the year.

    Another way to hone pedaling efficiency is to do long, long, long hours, even for riders like me. You learn to pedal more efficiently when you have almost no gas left but enough to keep your wits about you. Suddenly you'll realize that sitting "just so" will help, or standing "just so", etc. I learned the hard way about saving energy - bonk 30 miles from home will teach you how to ride using as close to zero wasted energy as possible. Or doing 100 mile rides in Feb. Or ride (not as many miles as a pro, but also drill) for 20 or 30 years.

    cdr

  22. #22
    Banned. El Diablo Rojo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dubbayoo View Post
    Thor seems to have the lowest cadence of any sprinter I've seen, and he always sits well before the line. He sprints like he's out of gas.
    That's why I'd love to see his SRM downloads, he's kinda mashing the gears so his watts must be pretty high. Honestly it wouldn't matter if he was turning 80 or 180 the dude has a vicious kick and he can hold it.

  23. #23
    Senior Member Dubbayoo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo View Post
    That's why I'd love to see his SRM downloads, he's kinda mashing the gears so his watts must be pretty high. Honestly it wouldn't matter if he was turning 80 or 180 the dude has a vicious kick and he can hold it.
    In the past he's held it but he just doesn't seem to be doing it this year. I have wondered why he just doesn't take it out from 250-300m. If you watch almost as soon as he pulls out from behind Cav he starts to sit after just a few revs, almost like he can't get on top of the gear.

    I think Farrar should go while Cav is still on his leadout wheel. In most of the sprints Cav jumps first and holds the same gap, it never increases. There was one where he dropped everyone bad but not usually. So far he who jumps first wins.

  24. #24
    Banned. El Diablo Rojo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dubbayoo View Post
    In the past he's held it but he just doesn't seem to be doing it this year. I have wondered why he just doesn't take it out from 250-300m. If you watch almost as soon as he pulls out from behind Cav he starts to sit after just a few revs, almost like he can't get on top of the gear.

    I think Farrar should go while Cav is still on his leadout wheel. In most of the sprints Cav jumps first and holds the same gap, it never increases. There was one where he dropped everyone bad but not usually. So far he who jumps first wins.
    I was referring to Cav's kick. But yeah I see your point...I think at this juncture you might as well go early cause you aren't going to come around him.

  25. #25
    Edificating dmotoguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Diablo Rojo View Post
    he's kinda mashing the gears so his watts must be pretty high.
    mashing a big gear slow can have the same net wattage as spinning a smaller gear.. the only way you know his watts are high is his placing in every friggin field sprint.
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