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  1. #1
    Cat WTF
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    Suggestions for minimal daily riding

    Fact 1 - I only have so much time per day to ride
    Fact 2 - I only care about time trials

    I only intend to race my bike no longer than 54 minutes at a time. This bodes well since I really only have an hour per day to ride. I'm looking for suggestions from those who race against the clock with minimal time to train.

    Would you:
    1 - do long intervals above my one hour power
    2 - sst for the entire ride
    3 - short intervals way above one hour power
    4 - ride the estimated power requirement for as long as possible
    5 - all the above

    Regarding #4, has anyone tried progressively doing longer intervals at a given wattage over the course of several months? How many times per week can a person pull that off without death?

  2. #2
    Senior Member dmb2786's Avatar
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    i don't race against the clock and don't have minimal time to train, but I'd be doing #3 right now.
    Quote Originally Posted by zeleuo View Post
    Slamdancing would probably define my style of riding best.

  3. #3
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    ^5

  4. #4
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    Pacing intervals! My favorite!

    I can do this three times a week. I did a lot of 2x20's at 95-98% in the winter time. Work out your power at threshold. I don't think you need to work out VO2 much, except when you hit a plateau and need to pull it up some.

    You need to be able to put yourself in pain mode and stay there. So workout in that area as much as possible.

    How many hours a week do you have? 6? 8?
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmb2786 View Post
    i don't race against the clock and don't have minimal time to train, but I'd be doing #3 right now.
    why?

  6. #6
    Cat WTF
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apus^2 View Post

    How many hours a week do you have? 6? 8?

    5 days per week and 1 to 1.5 hours per day is what reality is giving me.

  7. #7
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    You have plenty of time then, for TTs. It would be nice to have a 2-2.5 hour ride on the weekend, but for the most part, I'd go with pacing intervals, 2x20s and SST. 15 minute warmup, start your workout, 10 minute cool down.
    EOL Ra Ra F
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apus^2 View Post
    Pacing intervals! My favorite!

    I can do this three times a week. I did a lot of 2x20's at 95-98% in the winter time. Work out your power at threshold. I don't think you need to work out VO2 much, except when you hit a plateau and need to pull it up some.

    You need to be able to put yourself in pain mode and stay there. So workout in that area as much as possible.

    How many hours a week do you have? 6? 8?
    i really like the the pacing workout and did a bunch this year. higher avg. wattage for the cumulative work portion was always higher than i can do for a 20 minute or longer interval. I suspect it's due to having some nm power or anaerobic component to each rep. therefore, I considered the pacing workout to be more along the lines of a vo2max interval workout, and while valuable to incorporating into a program like cat4evers, I dont think it's a "substitute" for longer duration aerobic work (sst, 20+ minute intervals, ...).

  9. #9
    powered by Racer Ex gsteinb's Avatar
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    without defining fact one further this thread is a waste of time

  10. #10
    Ho-Jahm Hocam's Avatar
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    You'll eventually need to work on VO2 power when you start plateauing.
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by cat4ever View Post
    5 days per week and 1 to 1.5 hours per day is what reality is giving me.
    Quote Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
    without defining fact one further this thread is a waste of time
    ...

  12. #12
    powered by Racer Ex gsteinb's Avatar
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    got it, thanks.

    2x20s
    3x30s
    1x60s

    hate your life for the time you're on the bike 3x a week. go easy the other two days.

  13. #13
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    The thing about the pacing workout is that it puts your body into a higher wattage area for a longer cumulative period of time, hence triggering adaptation. I could do similar wattages for 2x20s, but the mental fatigue was far worse.

    I do believe that 2x20's, 1x30's, 1x40's etc at ftp would be great for TTs to help with mental strength (in addition to physical adaptation).
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  14. #14
    部門ニ/自転車オタク NomadVW's Avatar
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    Also depends on what days off you're being restricted to. Is it Sat/Sun off? Can you pick your days off? If so, I'd block train M-W, Thurs off, train Fri/Sat, Sun off.

    If it's M-F training, I'd block train threshold M-W, Thurs 1.5 hr endurance, Friday 4-5x5 minutes, Sat/Sun off.

    IMO, 1-1.5 hrs per day, 5 days a week doth not require active recovery days.
    Envision, Energize, Enable

  15. #15
    部門ニ/自転車オタク NomadVW's Avatar
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    Adding - at 5 days/wk, 1-1.5 hrs per day, you have to maximize effort to get your desired adaptation. That's a reality.

    Fact #3 - You'll need to suffer lots to get lots.
    Envision, Energize, Enable

  16. #16
    powered by Racer Ex gsteinb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NomadVW View Post
    Also depends on what days off you're being restricted to. Is it Sat/Sun off? Can you pick your days off? If so, I'd block train M-W, Thurs off, train Fri/Sat, Sun off.

    If it's M-F training, I'd block train threshold M-W, Thurs 1.5 hr endurance, Friday 4-5x5 minutes, Sat/Sun off.

    IMO, 1-1.5 hrs per day, 5 days a week doth not require active recovery days.
    Could depends on age. I couldn't go hard that many days no matter the duration.

  17. #17
    部門ニ/自転車オタク NomadVW's Avatar
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    Aye... the challenges of seeking coaching advice from the masses.
    Envision, Energize, Enable

  18. #18
    Cat WTF
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    I'm just asking for suggestions, not specific coaching advice. The "days off" will vary due to a haphazard schedule (last week, I rode zero miles in zero hours). This week I had two and a half hours so far.

    I am still curious if anyone has ever tried to hit a wattage number for as many minutes as possible and tried to increase the time and NOT the wattage over a period of xx weeks/months. I'm leaning toward trying this as I guesstimate xxx watts over xx minutes at a weight of xxx will yield a time of xx:xx. Seems like if I know that 350 watts (or insert obtuse number here) will lead me to the promised land, should I not shoot to hit that for 54 minutes (for example)? That's not saying that 350 watts will give me an average of 27+. More like 28+, but I'm rambling now....

  19. #19
    starting pistol means war YMCA's Avatar
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    are you sure you'll be out there for 54'?
    maybe you meant 49'?
    that would make all the difference in how much you should train.

  20. #20
    carbon is too light procrit's Avatar
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    Don't forget 2 to 5 minute intervals. They build slow twitch muscles a lot more efficiently than long intervals. I'd throw in those at least once a week for 3 to 4 weeks at a time.
    Cat 2+*--------------+Cat 1

  21. #21
    Senior Member JohnKScott's Avatar
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    Interesting thread. I'm not specifically training for TTs but have the same time limitations. And considering how bad I suck getting my FTP up is probably my best bang for time spent. So I have kept and interested eye on this thread as well.

  22. #22
    部門ニ/自転車オタク NomadVW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cat4ever View Post
    I'm just asking for suggestions, not specific coaching advice. The "days off" will vary due to a haphazard schedule (last week, I rode zero miles in zero hours). This week I had two and a half hours so far.

    I am still curious if anyone has ever tried to hit a wattage number for as many minutes as possible and tried to increase the time and NOT the wattage over a period of xx weeks/months. I'm leaning toward trying this as I guesstimate xxx watts over xx minutes at a weight of xxx will yield a time of xx:xx. Seems like if I know that 350 watts (or insert obtuse number here) will lead me to the promised land, should I not shoot to hit that for 54 minutes (for example)? That's not saying that 350 watts will give me an average of 27+. More like 28+, but I'm rambling now....
    I don't believe it will work, but only based on my limited knowledge of the way the physiological systems adapt - though I think it also depends on how close you are to that number. If you're at 300 now, and 350 is the goal, then 350 is probably only ~5-10 minutes at best for a single interval, not necessarily long enough to build the aerobic engine to do 350 for 54'. I think you're better off spending time at 300-310.

    If you're at 335-340, then spending the time at 350 may be 20-25 minutes of interval time, which is then in the right ballpark for building FTP.
    Envision, Energize, Enable

  23. #23
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    I think you told me that you'd be coming into my age group next year. If that's the case, you should spend all your riding time in the little ring, keeping your HR as low as possible. You'll need to save everything for race day. Yep, that's what you need to do.

  24. #24
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    Greg Lemond is an advocate of an hour a day training. But, it has to be at such a high level of intensity that you need a basterd coach to push you the whole time.

  25. #25
    Making a kilometer blurry waterrockets's Avatar
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    I follow a pretty normal workout plan, just shorter durations. I'm getting about 6 hrs/week right now. I start most cycles with steady SST for a few weeks, then add in the Friel pace intervals (I call them STUCI -- same time until can't improve). Afer a few weeks of SST + STUCI, I add in the VO2Max once/week. Then to top it off, a 1125211 interval pyramid once/week. About a month after that starts, my fitness is crazy. A few weeks later, I'm pretty toasted, take some time off, and start over with nothing but steady SST.

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