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-   -   Coffee/Caffeine status. (http://www.bikeforums.net/33-road-bike-racing/626273-coffee-caffeine-status.html)

Creakyknees 11-19-13 08:48 AM

seems relevant:

http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/page/l...ews/?id=113578

robabeatle 11-19-13 08:50 AM

A lot of well known research oriented nutrition/training gurus claim that adrenal fatigue is bunk.

Thoughts?

Ygduf 11-19-13 10:38 AM

seems like something that could theoretically happen, but if blood tests don't show it and you can't really know if it's fixed, it smells of nutritionist selling points.

Just eat well and sleep more and enjoy your morning coffee.

mike868y 11-19-13 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ygduf (Post 16259345)
seems like something that could theoretically happen, but if blood tests don't show it and you can't really know if it's fixed, it smells of nutritionist selling points.

Just eat well and sleep more and enjoy your morning coffee.


enjoying your morning coffee is a lot different than having to basically have an IV caffeine drip at all times, though. i'm surrounded by kids every day who are basically dependent on caffeine/adderall/cocaine to get through the day and that definitely messes up your system. i've gotten pretty dependent on caffeine in the past (avg 5 hours sleep a night for a few weeks + 14-18 hours of riding + a full class schedule + 15-20 hrs/week of lab work) and it's not a fun place. if i get to the point where i'm drinking more than two french presses a day (basically 4 "mugs" worth of coffee) I try to chill. three a day and i'm in the danger zone.

Ygduf 11-19-13 11:40 AM

Hey, the only bit of Mandarin I learned in Taiwan was that which enabled me to order coffees at 7-11. Addiction is a powerful motivator.

Wesley36 11-19-13 12:44 PM

3 Attachment(s)
lol, not "ka- fay" is not much of a stretch for coffee (basically pronounce "cafe" and try to add a Chinese accent).

And re: adrenal fatigue, I guess it seems harder for me to believe that the adrenals CANNOT be fatigued, than to believe that they can be - seems plausible to me. That said, I am sure that it is much less common than often suggested. For example, the author of the Pez article suggests that adrenal fatigue can lead to depression, anxiety and difficulty concentrating. In some individuals that she has consulted with, I am sure that is true. However, on a population basis, the data suggests that moderate caffeine consumption (3 -5 cups a day) has a protective effect in regards to depression.

Part of the problem is that we know that different people respond differently to caffeine, but we are not quite sure why (much like beets...).

For my part, this is my team next season, and I fit in well:
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=351538

I roast my own beans:
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=351539
And pull my own shots of espresso:
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=351540

It is one of my other favorite hobbies, but it makes it difficult to go out for coffee. Espresso in North America, in my experience, is almost always burnt and/or over-extracted. I still drink coffee when I go out, but I know *exactly* how I like it when I make it.

Ygduf 11-19-13 01:16 PM

da hei kafay !

I am sure they had no idea wtf I was saying, but the Mr. Brown is always near enough the register to point.

thechemist 11-19-13 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wesley36 (Post 16259779)
lol, not "ka- fay" is not much of a stretch for coffee (basically pronounce "cafe" and try to add a Chinese accent).

And re: adrenal fatigue, I guess it seems harder for me to believe that the adrenals CANNOT be fatigued, than to believe that they can be - seems plausible to me. That said, I am sure that it is much less common than often suggested. For example, the author of the Pez article suggests that adrenal fatigue can lead to depression, anxiety and difficulty concentrating. In some individuals that she has consulted with, I am sure that is true. However, on a population basis, the data suggests that moderate caffeine consumption (3 -5 cups a day) has a protective effect in regards to depression.

Part of the problem is that we know that different people respond differently to caffeine, but we are not quite sure why (much like beets...).

For my part, this is my team next season, and I fit in well:
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=351538

I roast my own beans:
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=351539
And pull my own shots of espresso:
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=351540

It is one of my other favorite hobbies, but it makes it difficult to go out for coffee. Espresso in North America, in my experience, is almost always burnt and/or over-extracted. I still drink coffee when I go out, but I know *exactly* how I like it when I make it.

I used to pull shots/own a pasquini livia. I am back to a simple press/drip with good beans and grind but I feel your pain

cmh 11-19-13 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ygduf (Post 16259866)
da hei kafay !

I am sure they had no idea wtf I was saying, but the Mr. Brown is always near enough the register to point.

Back when I started going to Taiwan a lot (about '95) Mr. Brown saved me from the horrid stuff they called coffee - always instant and so weak you could read a newspaper through a cup of it. Then Starbucks came in and a lot of places learned to make coffee.

mike868y 11-19-13 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmh (Post 16260263)
Then Starbucks came in and a lot of places learned to make coffee.

wut

Ygduf 11-19-13 04:01 PM

again with the ignorance for effect. he didn't say starbucks was the best ever, he said starbucks came around and other places tried to at least produce actual coffee.

I erred before, it wasn't Mr. Browns, I think it was City Coffee. Most of it looked to be made from a keurig-type machine where they would pick the size and any cream/sugar pre-mix.

Wesley36 11-20-13 07:53 AM

Seems germane:

http://cyclingtips.com.au/2013/11/ca...ance-enhancer/

Quote:

One of the things that you need to be aware of when interpreting study results is that the average tells you nothing about the responses of individuals within the study. In some cases everyone follows the same pattern and is close to the average, but in others the variation between individuals is massive.

And with caffeine there does seem to be a large variation in how people respond. Whilst the average benefit seems to be around 2-5% in most studies, there are some athletes that have shown no improvement or even performed worse when taking caffeine compared to placebo.

No-one knows exactly why the performance response to caffeine is so individual (it’s not related to whether you’re a regular coffee drinker or not, see below), but one reason is probably that the rate at which caffeine enters your bloodstream varies greatly between people, as shown in the graph below.

So whilst one athlete may benefit from taking caffeine one hour before a race, others may need to take it two hours before for it to work. Like almost everything in sports nutrition, it highlights the need to try caffeine in training before you load up on it for an important race.

It’s also important to note that some people experience side-effects from caffeine at the doses that have been shown to improve performance. These include increased heart rate, anxiety and reduced ability to perform precision type tasks, as well as difficulty sleeping after training or competition.

Bronze Potato 12-13-13 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike868y (Post 16260268)
wut

Hopefully the inference isn't that Starbucks makes excellent coffee but more that they helped the current coffee craze get some legs.

echappist 08-21-15 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by echappist (Post 12836584)
Quote:

Originally Posted by sherpakid (Post 12836459)
Good entry level machine - Rancilio Silva.

Gaggia's are decent too - http://www.wholelattelove.com/Gaggia/classic.cfm

too rich for me.

I have a $200 Saeco (bought before i heard about their cycling sponsorship) and a $150 Baratzza Grinder. Has worked well for the past three years.

how things change. Just took delivery of the Rancilio Silvia with PID ($200 more than the regular) on Wednesday. First order of business was to figure out how to load the portafilter as the clearance was too tight to turn the portafilter once i get it to the brew group. After 5-6 attempts (basically two dollars worth of beans), i think i've dialed in a good setting for single shots. It's perhaps the smoothest espresso i've had in a long time

Next order of business is to buy a whole bunch of decaf beans and a lot of 2% milk and learn to steam properly and make latte art.

Wylde06 08-21-15 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by echappist (Post 18098344)
decaf beans.

:crash::troll::crash:

spdntrxi 08-22-15 07:20 AM

For practice

echappist 08-22-15 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdntrxi (Post 18099195)
For practice

yes, this.

i hear you could also practice using soy sauce (for the espresso) and soap water (for the milk), and that would obviate the need to waste good beans and milk for practice

echappist 09-20-15 08:36 PM

well, after 3 gallons (or is it 4, i lost count) of milk, i got something like this

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-K...2/IMG_0361.JPG

Doge 09-21-15 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wesley36 (Post 16259779)
...
And pull my own shots of espresso:
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=351540

It is one of my other favorite hobbies, but it makes it difficult to go out for coffee. Espresso in North America, in my experience, is almost always burnt and/or over-extracted. I still drink coffee when I go out, but I know *exactly* how I like it when I make it.

My La Pavoni is in the box ready to get the gaskets replaced. I leave it on too much. I would appreciate knowing about your bean roasting equipment/where you get your beans.

To the topic - for junior we do use caffeine as a ergogenic drug - ONLY for events (he may have a Coke every few weeks). It appears it is more effective when used for events only. 50-100mg in a latte seems quite effective with the fat, sugar and caffeine taken 45min before a crit, or right before a RR. During the race a gel with 25mg / hour. I have enough power/performance data on him to have seen a difference between with / without. It may just make him less timid / passive - but we noticed it. I also think that not using it casually makes it much more effective, but I wouldn't know as he has never been a regular user.

Wesley36 09-21-15 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doge (Post 18181778)
I would appreciate knowing about your bean roasting equipment/where you get your beans.

I use an iRoast2 home roaster, basically a modified hot-air popcorn popper with fancy electronics and temperature controls.
i-ROAST

The last few times I have bought beans it has been:
Nicaragua PRODECOOP Green Coffee Beans from Nicaragua PRODECOOP - $4.75 : Gen-X Coffee, Taste The Bean Not The Brand

But Sweet Marias is a good place to start looking, they are also quite a good resource on home roasting
https://www.sweetmarias.com/category/green-coffee

DannoXYZ 09-23-15 08:08 PM

Some coffee pron...

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...pressoPorn.jpg

CliffordK 09-23-15 08:28 PM

I just love a good cappuccino, or espresso.

But, I think caffeine gives me a cardiac arrhythmia. And, so I decided I have a choice of rat poison or no caffeine.

Well, to me, the choice was pretty obvious. I'll take an occasional decaf, but that is rare (and decaf does have quite a bit of caffeine).

I do still like hot chocolate (which may have just a little caffeine, as well as theobromine, but certainly isn't as strong as the coffee).

Oh, and no coffee headaches either. :eek::

globecanvas 09-24-15 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CliffordK (Post 18189537)
But, I think caffeine gives me a cardiac arrhythmia


I gave up caffeine for about 2 years because of a cardiac issue. The cardiac issue did not improve, so I went back on coffee about a year ago.


It was very hard to quit coffee; I was only a 1-2 cup a day coffee drinker, but it took at least 2-3 weeks before I didn't just feel stupid and ugly all the time. Once I was through the withdrawal, I discovered a lot of positive aspects to not being addicted. My overall mood was more even throughout the day and day-to-day. Everything just felt much more level and calm. Overall in terms of quality of life, it was clearly a net positive, for me, to be off caffeine.

But, once I realized there was no cardiac benefit, for me, I started drinking coffee again. There really isn't anything like that feeling of well-being and on-top-of-it-ness you get from a cup of coffee at the right time. But I think that looking at all 24 hours of the day, you end up more than paying for that feeling, it's really a classic credit/debit system where the house always takes a percentage.

longe 09-26-15 05:48 AM

I forgot what "regular" means at dunkin donut, don't go often. So when the coffee lady asked me if I wanted regular, I tiredly assumed regular was neutral sounding and I could fix it how I wanted. Woops. i don't know how much cream and sugar they use to transform perfectly fine coffee into this weird substance, but regular is in fact not neutral at all. Regular in dunkin's land is very not regular in my world, or probably anywhere else. For better or for worse, dunkin's world is largely meshed with the mainstream "real" "what's readily available in the northeast" world. So I'm sitting in the couch on dunkin's today.

hubcyclist 09-26-15 06:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by longe (Post 18195480)
I forgot what "regular" means at dunkin donut, don't go often. So when the coffee lady asked me if I wanted regular, I tiredly assumed regular was neutral sounding and I could fix it how I wanted. Woops. i don't know how much cream and sugar they use to transform perfectly fine coffee into this weird substance, but regular is in fact not neutral at all. Regular in dunkin's land is very not regular in my world, or probably anywhere else. For better or for worse, dunkin's world is largely meshed with the mainstream "real" "what's readily available in the northeast" world. So I'm sitting in the couch on dunkin's today.

Ha, I didnt know that either when I moved back home a few years back, it blew my mind. Apparently it's a regional thing, once you go into CT regular starts to take on its real meaning


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