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Old 03-14-10, 09:49 AM   #1
Smallguy
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Training rides keeping the speed up when your up front...tips wanted

I went out yesterday on a training ride and did 58.75 km I finished feeling strong and I've improved my times from last season on the same loop and my average speed.

I was off the front the entire ride breaking the headwind with a friend of mine being 4 mins behind me most of the ride.

my average heart rate was 144 which is low zone 2 for me so I could have gone harder, I was in Zone 5a on the climbs

so when your out front but quite a bit with no one on your wheel to push you or no one in front to chance down how do you keep up the pace ?

I looked down at times on the flats and had settled in at 20kmph and was able to immediately push it to 31 kmph once I realized I wasn't pushing hard enough.

I train most of thew time solo occasionally with friends but I'm stronger than most of them so having someone beat me up and drop me is not a common occurrence unfortunately

besides finding some stronger riders to kick my ass regularly are there other ways or ticks to keep your speed up on rides ?
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Old 03-14-10, 09:53 AM   #2
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get a stopwatch and do some 20 minute intervals where you maintain the high pace. treat the rest period afterward with reverence.

learn how to get low and aero when you are doing it.
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Old 03-14-10, 10:21 AM   #3
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...
I was off the front the entire ride breaking the headwind with a friend of mine being 4 mins behind me most of the ride.

...
That sounds like one helluva vortex you create there.




You've got you HRM on, use it to keep the effort up.
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Old 03-14-10, 10:38 AM   #4
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You've got you HRM on, use it to keep the effort up.
makes perfect sense

what is a reasonable zone to stay in for a longer ride ? high Zone 2 and low Zone 3 seems reasonable?

I remember seeing a post somewhere where they rated the amount of time one could spend in a zone and their fitness

edit: here is the article I was looking for

http://www.trainingpeaks.com/trainin...gintensity.asp

so it appears higher in Zone 2 is achievable where holding Zone 3 unless your more advanced (I'm not) is going to make me blow up. could do some Zone 3 intervals though for 2-30 mins at a time

Last edited by Smallguy; 03-14-10 at 10:53 AM.
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Old 03-14-10, 11:28 AM   #5
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I train most of thew time solo occasionally with friends but I'm stronger than most of them so having someone beat me up and drop me is not a common occurrence unfortunately

besides finding some stronger riders to kick my ass regularly are there other ways or ticks to keep your speed up on rides ?
This is really what you need to do. Find some people who race & try to hang on to their wheel.
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Old 03-14-10, 11:50 AM   #6
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This is really what you need to do. Find some people who race & try to hang on to their wheel.
This. If you want to get faster, ride with the fast people.
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Old 03-14-10, 01:23 PM   #7
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I'll do some asking around for a faster group that won't completely decimate me in 10 minutes
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Old 03-14-10, 01:42 PM   #8
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makes perfect sense

what is a reasonable zone to stay in for a longer ride ? high Zone 2 and low Zone 3 seems reasonable?

I remember seeing a post somewhere where they rated the amount of time one could spend in a zone and their fitness

edit: here is the article I was looking for

http://www.trainingpeaks.com/trainin...gintensity.asp

so it appears higher in Zone 2 is achievable where holding Zone 3 unless your more advanced (I'm not) is going to make me blow up. could do some Zone 3 intervals though for 2-30 mins at a time
from reading that article I'd say you need to do intervals in Zone 4-5
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Old 03-14-10, 02:57 PM   #9
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This. If you want to get faster, ride with the fast people.
Yes, yes. It's completely demoralizing - it's what I'm doing right now - just waiting to reap some rewards from it...
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Old 03-14-10, 03:11 PM   #10
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What the hell is kmph ?
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Old 03-14-10, 03:16 PM   #11
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What the hell is kmph ?
I'm thinking it's kilometers (km) per hour. It took me a minute too...
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Old 03-14-10, 03:47 PM   #12
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I'll do some asking around for a faster group that won't completely decimate me in 10 minutes
You might have to get dropped over & over & over. I spent a whole season getting dropped on A rides. Some of them regrouped, some didn't. If you're not willing to get dropped, then you're not willing to get faster, IMO.
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Old 03-14-10, 03:58 PM   #13
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I'll do some asking around for a faster group that won't completely decimate me in 10 minutes
incorrect

You want the group that will kill you. Just keep coming back.

After a while it will take them 15 minutes to kill you. Then 20. Etc.
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Old 03-14-10, 06:01 PM   #14
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incorrect

You want the group that will kill you. Just keep coming back.

After a while it will take them 15 minutes to kill you. Then 20. Etc.
this
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Old 03-14-10, 06:47 PM   #15
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you're going between 20kph and 31kph on the flats and dropping your group ride?
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Old 03-14-10, 09:26 PM   #16
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you should be able to hold a low to mid z4 effort for more or less the entirity of a a 60k effort.
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Old 03-14-10, 09:42 PM   #17
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you should be able to hold a low to mid z4 effort for more or less the entirity of a a 60k effort.
I hate the z# terminology. What does that work out to in human? Tempo? Threshold?
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Old 03-14-10, 09:54 PM   #18
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dunno. I think the referenced article was using some frakked up newfangled zones from the land of unicorns
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Old 03-14-10, 09:55 PM   #19
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I hate the z# terminology. What does that work out to in human? Tempo? Threshold?
I believe that it is subthreshold to threshold, and I agree. A zone 2 (endurance) pace is not stressing anything when "your [sic] off the front." Don't be afraid to push harder.
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Old 03-14-10, 09:55 PM   #20
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but I should mention that from the article, I inferred that zone 4-5 was the same as L4 or LT or TT or CP60
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Old 03-14-10, 10:01 PM   #21
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zone 5 is lactate threshhold heart rate which is an HR training apx. of FTP
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Old 03-14-10, 10:02 PM   #22
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that is to say:the bottom of z5/top of z4 is your LTHR, which is where you start to determine hr zones
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Old 03-15-10, 11:38 AM   #23
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what is a reasonable zone to stay in for a longer ride ? high Zone 2 and low Zone 3 seems reasonable?
I guess this is a fairly common wonderment, but not a puzzle I've ever been vexed about. Just go as hard as you can. If you frequently test and exceed your limits then you will know what they are, and you will no longer be guessing.

And using HR to gauge anything is a waste of time, IMO.
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Old 03-15-10, 11:45 AM   #24
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zone 5 is lactate threshhold heart rate which is an HR training apx. of FTP
My HR zones never really lined up well with my power zones.
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Old 03-15-10, 11:48 AM   #25
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My suggestions:

1. get aero
2. get to your optimal cadence @ threshold
3. get into a rhythm and GO !
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