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  1. #1376
    Fly on the wall
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    Have a question about wheels.

    I have a set of specialized fusee SLX (2012) wheels, used for two months only (basically DT swiss 240 hubs, aerolite spokes 20/24, and spec rims) weighing in just below 1500g and a set of fulcrum 7s weighing in at whatever the hell they do. I also have a middle of the line set of DT swiss wheels on the commuter, 404s for racing.

    Seems like a bit of overkill so I was planning on selling one set. I'm leaning towards selling the Fusee wheels. I'm 170# at race weight, and sub 1500g clinchers do not seem that necessary. Opinions/suggestions? I was hoping to get at least 500 selling the wheels with 2 month old spec tires as well.
    Nothing should come between you and your chamois -- lawkd

  2. #1377
    Senior Member rankin116's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TMonk View Post
    Not to open this can of worms full bore (too late), but now I'm thinking of purchasing a new rear PT hub! I've been ballparking my training with heart rate for years and have always been intrigued by power.

    I'd probably just ride with it for a year or so before implementing more structured training.


    I'm gonna spend some time browsing for economical packages that include a wireless hub, head unit, software suite and all accompanying hardware.
    This is what I'm doing.

  3. #1378
    In the Pain Cave thechemist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rankin116 View Post
    This is what I'm doing.
    Why do this?

  4. #1379
    Senior Member rankin116's Avatar
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    Well this is my second year of serious riding and training. I still want to get most of my time in with group rides, for both the experience of riding with a group and the social side of things. I also work 2 jobs and right now my training time is less than ideal. I don't know what I should be working on, targeting, etc. so for me just riding and collecting data at this point is about as much effort as I can put into it.

  5. #1380
    Not actually Tmonk TMonk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thechemist View Post
    Why do this?
    I want to gain some practical experience and intuition from the instrument before I begin applying it more strictly.

    I'm in no rush.

    EDIT: Now that I think about it, I really just want to understand the way my body works and responds to things, on a quantitative level.
    Last edited by TMonk; 02-28-14 at 09:05 AM.
    "Your beauty is an aeroplane;
    so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste

  6. #1381
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    Quote Originally Posted by rankin116 View Post
    I still want to get most of my time in with group rides,....my training time is less than ideal. I don't know what I should be working on, targeting, etc. so for me just riding and collecting data at this point is about as much effort as I can put into it.
    This is exactly where you can leverage a *good* coach's expertise.


    Quote Originally Posted by TMonk View Post
    I really just want to understand the way my body works and responds to things, on a quantitative level.
    This is exactly what a *good* coach can teach you.

  7. #1382
    Not actually Tmonk TMonk's Avatar
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    A coach would certainly expedite and optimize that process (understanding my body), but again I'm not in a rush.

    I should clarify that I want a power meter for personal gratification purposes, not anything else. I'm a data geek for sure.

    Also I probably couldn't afford one anyway; I have too many expenses.
    "Your beauty is an aeroplane;
    so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste

  8. #1383
    Senior Member rankin116's Avatar
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    I have no doubts nor arguments against that but I have no interest in paying for a coach.

  9. #1384
    In the Pain Cave thechemist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rankin116 View Post
    I have no doubts nor arguments against that but I have no interest in paying for a coach.
    times money

  10. #1385
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    Quote Originally Posted by TMonk View Post
    I should clarify that I want a power meter for personal gratification purposes, not anything else. I'm a data geek for sure.
    That's why I got my power meter (first a PT then quickly sold that due to many wheels and got an SRM). Then a second SRM when I realized I'd be moving between bikes somewhat regularly.

    To put things in perspective I also got a similar device for the car (Gtech RR) simply for the commute to/from work. It's a data logger that records Gs and such. I don't race cars, I barely mod them, but I wanted to see the data. I'd still use it except it was clunky and ultimately I dropped it one too many times.

    I still don't train using power, generally do whatever JRA I want to or think I need to do. It's more of a history record for me.
    "...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson

  11. #1386
    Senior Member furiousferret's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TMonk View Post
    A coach would certainly expedite and optimize that process (understanding my body), but again I'm not in a rush.

    I should clarify that I want a power meter for personal gratification purposes, not anything else. I'm a data geek for sure.

    Also I probably couldn't afford one anyway; I have too many expenses.
    It doesn't take too long to get on par with what the power meter is showing you and how it can help. I obsess over numbers to the point of near banishment, that may be why I'm one of the few baseball fans around. In the end you actually have to get on the bike and put in the work, the pm just helps you where and how to direct it.

    Its like one of the guys in our Saturday ride says, "Bro, I don't need some hub to tell me I'm pro."

  12. #1387
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kindablue View Post
    Have a question about wheels.

    I have a set of specialized fusee SLX (2012) wheels, used for two months only (basically DT swiss 240 hubs, aerolite spokes 20/24, and spec rims) weighing in just below 1500g and a set of fulcrum 7s weighing in at whatever the hell they do. I also have a middle of the line set of DT swiss wheels on the commuter, 404s for racing.

    Seems like a bit of overkill so I was planning on selling one set. I'm leaning towards selling the Fusee wheels. I'm 170# at race weight, and sub 1500g clinchers do not seem that necessary. Opinions/suggestions? I was hoping to get at least 500 selling the wheels with 2 month old spec tires as well.
    I'd sell both sets of aluminum clinchers and buy a decent set of carbon clinchers.

  13. #1388
    Senior Member topflightpro's Avatar
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    I went out for a mountains ride this weekend and struggled quite a bit. My gearing was not great - 53/39 and 12/27.

    As I intend to get out there more this year, I now am debating which route to go for improving my gearing. Here are my options:

    1. Keep 53/39 (Quarq) with new Sram Apex Wifli RD and 12-32 cassette.
    2. 50/34 (non-PM) with my existing RD and 12-27 cassette.

    These two options give me the same gearing when in the 39-32 or 34-27.

    Option 1 gives me power and cadence, which I find useful for training, but requires me to purchase a new RD and cassette to swap out when going out there.
    Option 2 leaves me without power and cadence, but does not cost anything as I have a compact crank I could pull off another bike. I'd also have to adjust the FD.

    I am leaning toward option 1, as I find adjusting a RD to be much easier than fidgeting with a FD. And I also would get to keep power.

    What are your thoughts, or do you have any other suggestions?

  14. #1389
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Ygduf's Avatar
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    changing a rear derailleur is a 5 minute job if you have enough cable to work with.

    twitter.com/ygduf
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  15. #1390
    Senior Member furiousferret's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by topflightpro View Post
    I went out for a mountains ride this weekend and struggled quite a bit. My gearing was not great - 53/39 and 12/27.

    As I intend to get out there more this year, I now am debating which route to go for improving my gearing. Here are my options:

    1. Keep 53/39 (Quarq) with new Sram Apex Wifli RD and 12-32 cassette.
    2. 50/34 (non-PM) with my existing RD and 12-27 cassette.

    These two options give me the same gearing when in the 39-32 or 34-27.

    Option 1 gives me power and cadence, which I find useful for training, but requires me to purchase a new RD and cassette to swap out when going out there.
    Option 2 leaves me without power and cadence, but does not cost anything as I have a compact crank I could pull off another bike. I'd also have to adjust the FD.

    I am leaning toward option 1, as I find adjusting a RD to be much easier than fidgeting with a FD. And I also would get to keep power.

    What are your thoughts, or do you have any other suggestions?
    I'd go with 1 and keep the power.

    I run a 50/34 up front and a 12-27 which is swapped out for 11-25's in crits, unless you are a really strong rider its a great setup.

  16. #1391
    Senior Member Wesley36's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by furiousferret View Post
    I run a 50/34 up front and a 12-27 which is swapped out for 11-25's in crits, unless you are a really strong rider its a great setup.
    If one has a 110 BDC crankset, I am a big fan of the 52-36 crank.

  17. #1392
    Powered by Borscht ovoleg's Avatar
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    I can mostly go by feel now that I'm used to my power meter. I can tell when its 300W vs 200 vs 400. That said I still look at it throughout the interval to make sure I'm staying within the zone.

    1 year to "learn" a power meter is a little extreme. It took me 1 ride to get used to it...
    -Cat-3-o-meter: TBD :/

  18. #1393
    Senior Member rankin116's Avatar
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    I used a 50-34 for the longest time and recently switched to a 53-39. I used a 12-27 or 25 cassette. I can barely tell the difference between the two cranksets, and I'm fat.

  19. #1394
    Senior Member Inquisitor.'s Avatar
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    I've been riding an aluminum Specialized S-Works with DA 7800 for the past 10 years. I'm finally ready to break down and buy a new bike. I can get a pretty nice team deal, and am looking at getting a Felt AR. I've been trying to decide if I want to set it up with Ultegra Di2, Ultegra 11 speed, or SRAM 22.


    Last weekend I rode a couple miles on a Cervelo S3 with Ultegra Di2. I was impressed how smooth it shifted, but the lack of feel/feedback bothered me. However, satellite sprint shifters could be cool. Also, I read that electronic shifters save about 75g of drag compared to mechanical shifters on a Felt AR (about 8w at 25mph).


    I've never taken a bike with SRAM 22 for a real ride, but one of my friends is happy with it. I like the idea of shift paddles you can pull in while sprinting.


    I would imagine that even Ultegra 11 speed would be an upgrade over my old DA 7800.


    My priorities are Performance>Aero>Weight. I'd appreciate some input/experiences with these options. Thanks.

  20. #1395
    RacingBear UmneyDurak's Avatar
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    Anyone racing on Specialized Romin or Avatar? I think my ass bones just don't like Toupe or Gel Toupe. I thought I raced on the Toupe last year, but now I think I switched to it after racing season from some other specialized saddle with more padding (relatively speaking).
    Does Romin has more padding then Toupe?
    I see hills.... Bring them on!!!
    Stay calm and bring a towel.

  21. #1396
    Senior Member Wesley36's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UmneyDurak View Post
    Anyone racing on Specialized Romin or Avatar? I think my ass bones just don't like Toupe or Gel Toupe. I thought I raced on the Toupe last year, but now I think I switched to it after racing season from some other specialized saddle with more padding (relatively speaking).
    Does Romin has more padding then Toupe?
    The difference between the Romin and Toupe is shape, not padding. Romin and Toupe saddles come in a variety of rail materials, amount of padding, and a couple of different materials composing the body of the seat. The lower the price of the saddle, the more padding.

  22. #1397
    Senior Member Wesley36's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inquisitor. View Post
    Last weekend I rode a couple miles on a Cervelo S3 with Ultegra Di2. I was impressed how smooth it shifted, but the lack of feel/feedback bothered me. However, satellite sprint shifters could be cool. Also, I read that electronic shifters save about 75g of drag compared to mechanical shifters on a Felt AR (about 8w at 25mph).
    ...

    My priorities are Performance>Aero>Weight. I'd appreciate some input/experiences with these options. Thanks.
    As a bike mechanic, I was pretty ambivalent about electronic shifting, until I worked on it. While a test by Peloton magazine found that mechanical actually still shifts faster, I have not found anybody who concludes that mechanical shifts better. The fact that the FD moves in sync with the RD (automatic trim) is just plain cool when one is adjusting shifting.

    Lack of feel/ feedback is a common complaint, but everyone seems to get used to it in a few weeks. It mostly seems to be a matter of getting used to a different feel.

  23. #1398
    Senior Member topflightpro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inquisitor. View Post
    Also, I read that electronic shifters save about 75g of drag compared to mechanical shifters on a Felt AR (about 8w at 25mph).
    So, not having shifter cables will save 8w at 25mph? I don't know much about aerodynamics, but I have a hard time believing that.

    As for the rest of your question, my experience has been that I get used to whatever I have. For example, when I switched from Shimano to Sram, it took a little while, but I got used to it. Now I like Sram and don't really want to ride Shimano. I'm sure if I switched back, I'd hate it for a little while, then get used to it. Also, after years of riding Cannondales, I got an Argon. At first, I didn't really like it. Now, I don't really like going back to the Cannondale.

  24. #1399
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    With electronic shifting wouldn't the rear shift the same? The mechanism is the same, the chain, the cassette. Under pressure the shifts are determined by where the ramps are on the cogs along with the chain design/shape. How the pulley moves from cog to cog won't alter the rest of it. A well set up mechanical rear derailleur shifts as quickly as an electronic one, from what I can tell.

    On the other hand the front derailleur is different. I was amazed at how well the front shifted on electric, even slow rpm and high pressure. This is definitely different from a mechanical front derailleur because under such conditions you have to exert quite a bit of force on the mechanical shifter to move the chain over firmly. It compromises control etc. Electronic is just a touch-shift thing.
    "...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson

  25. #1400
    Senior Member Wesley36's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
    With electronic shifting wouldn't the rear shift the same? The mechanism is the same, the chain, the cassette. Under pressure the shifts are determined by where the ramps are on the cogs along with the chain design/shape. How the pulley moves from cog to cog won't alter the rest of it. A well set up mechanical rear derailleur shifts as quickly as an electronic one, from what I can tell.
    I hear what you are saying, but pretty much everyone says the same thing - it makes the shifts cleanly, so cleanly that one does not get the same "feedback" that most of us are used to. That little "thunk" feeling as the cable releases a bit and moves to its new position - even with Shimano, you are dealing with a spring and ratchet mechanism - it works by making small jumps. Shifting smoothly is largely about being able to match one's pedaling to that jump. With electronic, the servo sweeps smoothly - there is no little jump as tension is either released or increased, and no little catch at the end as the ratchet mechanism engages.

    My boss described it this way after this first race - he would make a shift, and then the bike would just be in the new gear. Lacking the feedback, however, he would generally look down after the shift to make sure it had happened - he was so used to feeling and hearing the shift, that when that feedback was lacking, he doubted that the shift had been made.

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