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  1. #1551
    In the Pain Cave thechemist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
    It's tough to say. For example if you're just extending your arms out a bit more, then no, not really. If your torso moves relative to the front wheel then yes. Generally speaking, on the frame, usually not, since a longer/lower stem really means you're just reaching more (assuming you fit properly before doing the longer/lower stem). With a smaller frame with a shorter top tube the front wheel is closer to the BB so given the same saddle setback the front wheel is tucked under your body more.
    Sigh.thank you so much cdr,i wish you were wrong but that makes perfect sense and explains why i sont like a longer stem on my current rig

  2. #1552
    In the Pain Cave thechemist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
    It's tough to say. For example if you're just extending your arms out a bit more, then no, not really. If your torso moves relative to the front wheel then yes. Generally speaking, on the frame, usually not, since a longer/lower stem really means you're just reaching more (assuming you fit properly before doing the longer/lower stem). With a smaller frame with a shorter top tube the front wheel is closer to the BB so given the same saddle setback the front wheel is tucked under your body more.
    Ok...what about a zero setback seatpost and a longer stem ? Would this still be a bandage for ultimately wanting a smaller frame or could this work. Read something about KOPS and moving my hips to far forward but in theory I like the idea.

  3. #1553
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    Quote Originally Posted by thechemist View Post
    Ok...what about a zero setback seatpost and a longer stem ? Would this still be a bandage for ultimately wanting a smaller frame or could this work. Read something about KOPS and moving my hips to far forward but in theory I like the idea.
    That's sort of what I do, but my knee is pretty much over the pedal spindle, not in front of it. I do slide forward on the saddle though. I run a 75.5 deg seat tube angle, zero set back, and saddle is pretty far forward. I'll sit further back on the saddle if I'm JRA or climbing but in any hard efforts I'm pretty far forward on the saddle, almost sliding off the tip. At that point my knee is way forward of the pedal axle.

    Jens Voigt is sort of like that (but not as far forward under duress), of the current pros. Not sure who else, but I noticed he's pretty far forward. He has substantially less set back than Boonen, for example, even though they're similar in height.

    Voigt: saddle height 845mm, set back 85mm.
    Boonen: saddle height 815mm, set back 115mm.

    When I experimented with frame size (prior to ordering a custom frame) i sat on a trainer and used plastic storage totes as hand rests. This way I could move my hands independent of any "normal" constraints (stem or bar sizes). I used books and such to fine tune the tote height, and I just slide my hands more forward or backward on the tote. Then when something seemed good I noted where I was, measured what the various dimensions would be if it were a bike. I based it on a 12 cm stem with my current stem as I found that puts enough weight on the front wheel but not too much weight. I've run as long as a 14.5 cm stem with the same bars and that was too much weight. Any shorter and it feels too light (like a 10 cm stem on a longer frame).

    As a sanity check I plugged my findings into an LBS's fit bike and sat on the bike and tried it. It was longer than I planned (by 2 cm due to a 14 cm stem - I should have brought my own 12 cm stem) but it seemed good. It's basically the fit I've been riding (I had a second frame, same size, built for me), albeit adjusted for a new bar that has less reach and drop. I got a custom stem to place the drops correctly, now they're in the same spot as before. I haven't converted the other bike to the new bars because I haven't ordered a second stem yet.
    "...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson

  4. #1554
    Senior Member abhirama's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
    ...

    Jens Voigt is sort of like that (but not as far forward under duress), of the current pros. Not sure who else, but I noticed he's pretty far forward. He has substantially less set back than Boonen, for example, even though they're similar in height.

    Voigt: saddle height 845mm, set back 85mm.
    Boonen: saddle height 815mm, set back 115mm.
    Checkout Adam Hansen. And this video.

  5. #1555
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    Quote Originally Posted by abhirama View Post
    Checkout Adam Hansen. And this video.
    Of course, Adam Hansen, he's the epitome of that forward position, I totally forgot about him. Voigt is a bit more under the radar, no one talks about the fact that he has a forward/high position.

    I like the video - he explains that with the longer cranks he needs the saddle more forward, although he does move it forward more than the 5 mm or so that the cranks probably grew. I have short legs and I've used 175s since 2003 (and have tried very hard to use 170s without success in 2008 and then again in 2011). The longer cranks exaggerates the forward seat position since my cranks are longer than people expect, by 5-10 mm.
    "...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson

  6. #1556
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Ygduf's Avatar
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    ooh. Imma get me one of those -30 130mm deda pista stems!

    to

    I am SO doing that.
    Last edited by Ygduf; 07-01-14 at 11:16 AM.

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  7. #1557
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    seems like i've got a tricky one here--i grabbed the scicon élan and the arundel uno (i have one of the duos and love it) to test. i was optimistic but neither one works on my TT bike. i thought i might be able to orient them more vertically than horizontally, or perhaps to fit them under the saddle but above the rails; no go. i'm open to other thoughts.

    both are nice bags.

    here's a picture of what i'm trying to fit it on:
    IMG_2975.jpg

    Quote Originally Posted by hack View Post
    I use the Scicon Elan. Plenty small, but I carry a tube, a CO2 cartridge and chuck, and a lever with ease:
    it was tricky for me to fit in a tube w/ 80mm valve due to the length of the valve, and to also get in a small multi-tool, in addition to what you listed. it worked, but long-term i'm not sure i trust the zipper with that. the arundel uno seemed no more roomy but a little more beefy at the seam for the zipper.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hida Yanra View Post
    FWIW- anything that Arundel makes, I'll buy- I've had nothing but stellar experiences with their take on "buy it once and forget about it for years" bike parts.
    they make great stuff. have some mandible cages, a duo, and a couple side loader cages (awesome for MTBs with tight clearance in the front triangle). none are cheap and deals are few, but they are built to last.
    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    Same here, and you can call me Twiggy.

  8. #1558
    Senior Member rankin116's Avatar
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    Damn man, do you use all those skis? Your garage looks like a ski shop!

  9. #1559
    Senior Member hack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tetonrider View Post


    it was tricky for me to fit in a tube w/ 80mm valve due to the length of the valve, and to also get in a small multi-tool, in addition to what you listed. it worked, but long-term i'm not sure i trust the zipper with that. the arundel uno seemed no more roomy but a little more beefy at the seam for the zipper.
    The zipper has been fine for me, but what has developed over the last two or three rides is the velcro strap is becoming less and less secure. So much so, that I now thrown a bungee around it just in case. I may check out the Arundel as well.
    Cat 2 upgrade status: never

  10. #1560
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    C'mon Teton summon your inner trigeek. Get a bento box.

  11. #1561
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    Quote Originally Posted by rankin116 View Post
    Damn man, do you use all those skis? Your garage looks like a ski shop!
    a few pair are my wife's...but that's only showing part of it. i've been skiing 120-200 days/year for a long time... so, there's that.

    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    C'mon Teton summon your inner trigeek. Get a bento box.
    i would if i could! i'm not above it, but my TT bike has a steerer/stem that are inline with the top tube.

    i'm thinking maybe i could clip the saddle bag to the underside of the extensions. hm.

  12. #1562
    VeloSIRraptor
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    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    Teton ... inner trigeek
    HA!
    come on, we all had our suspicions- right?

  13. #1563
    VeloSIRraptor
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    get one of these, there- fixed it for ya'
    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    If it comes down to a field sprint, you probably won't win, so don't let it.

  14. #1564
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    I want to buy this Cervelo on ebay... talk me down

    Cervelo S3 Size 48cm Ultegra Di2 | eBay
    ...

  15. #1565
    Senior Member hack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by valygrl View Post
    I want to buy this Cervelo on ebay... talk me down

    Cervelo S3 Size 48cm Ultegra Di2 | eBay
    Don't buy it!!

    Especially if you already have a decent bike. I went through the same thing last week. Saw a cool bike on ebay, put in a low bid and won. I didn't realize it was a shop on the other side of town sell, so got lucky by being able to drive over and pick it up. Pretty bittersweet otherwise. I have a bike I really like and now I have this new one, too (which is a really nice bike). I really have no need for 2 and needed to get another of pedals, saddle, etc.
    Cat 2 upgrade status: never

  16. #1566
    Making a kilometer blurry waterrockets's Avatar
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    My kids aren't allowed to buy anything over $5 unless they write down what they want, then still want it two weeks later (some exceptions on travel...)

  17. #1567
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    I think my natural tendency to procrastinate will work in my favor, here, but it's the right size bike, with the right group, for what I've been looking for. I'm going to let it expire and hope they repost with a lower opening bid.
    ...

  18. #1568
    Packfodding 3 caloso's Avatar
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    Good idea. Seems a bit high to me.
    Cyclists of the world, unite! You have nothing to lube but your chains!

  19. #1569
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    They relisted it, same price. I visited that bike in a different size at a local store today. Looks pretty sweet.
    ...

  20. #1570
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Ygduf's Avatar
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    that video from specialized aero guys re shaved legs... real or late april fools?

    If real, do you dudes shave your arms? I mean, I lost a 10mi tt by 1 second earlier this year. If you're telling me arms is 3-4-5+ seconds over that distance, I'm not above it. Not to mention I can use the same "it's for crashing" line.

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  21. #1571
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Ygduf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hack View Post
    Don't buy it!!

    Especially if you already have a decent bike. I went through the same thing last week. Saw a cool bike on ebay, put in a low bid and won. I didn't realize it was a shop on the other side of town sell, so got lucky by being able to drive over and pick it up. Pretty bittersweet otherwise. I have a bike I really like and now I have this new one, too (which is a really nice bike). I really have no need for 2 and needed to get another of pedals, saddle, etc.

    everyone should have 2 bikes for when the first is out of order! what did you buy, and what size?

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  22. #1572
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ygduf View Post
    everyone should have 2 bikes for when the first is out of order! what did you buy, and what size?
    Yeah I'm shopping for di2, I effed up my wrist in a crash in May and I can barely upshift. I would just pick up a new drive train for my current frame, but I would have to drill the frame or stick the wires on the outside which just seems ugly.
    ...

  23. #1573
    Senior Member hack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ygduf View Post
    everyone should have 2 bikes for when the first is out of order! what did you buy, and what size?
    Two bikes can be nice. I was racing a Leopard earlier this year, but crashed and cracked it. Having a backup bike (Giant TCR) was great since I could keep riding while the Leopard was off for repair. However, I haven't built the Leopard back up since getting it back and it's still sitting under the coffee table or sofa or something like that. I just picked up a Foil and am bouncing back and forth between the TCR and Foil. It's fun to tinker and I may check out a Caad SuperSix or BMC RaceMachine to have checked all the boxes. These would just be riding at the shop to see how they feel instead of buying then trying.

    I suppose when all things are going well, a second bike isn't necessary, but they're quite handy when things don't go so well.
    Cat 2 upgrade status: never

  24. #1574
    Packfodding 3 caloso's Avatar
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    +1

    when I took my Ridley to the shop to ask about the cracked dropout, I wasn't expecting that they would need to keep it, and I had to build my Gazelle back up that night.
    Cyclists of the world, unite! You have nothing to lube but your chains!

  25. #1575
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    ^^You kept that steel bike 'cause you knew the carbon one was gonna 'splode.
    Regards,
    Chuck

    Demain, on roule!

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