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  1. #1
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    1st LOTOJA Race, which wheels.

    Ok competing in my first LOTAJA and not sure which wheels to use. I have a pair of Kinlin 270 rimmed wheels that come in right over 1400 grams with the rim tape. So these are a 27mm wheel. The other set weighs in around 1600 with rim tape and are a 30mm wheel. I am wondering which one would be the better choice for this race? I will be running 23c Conti GP 4000s on them. I can get up any climb but am by no means fast on them. I train solo so don't really know how to figure in the dynamics of group riding into the equation.

    I also have a 38mm set of tubulars that are several hundred grams lighter but am still not comfortable with changing a flat on these so hesitant to use them.

    Here is a description of the course:

    Elevation gain of over 9700 feet over the first 110 miles. Then just minor upgrade with possible windy conditions to the 206 mile finish. Any insight is appreciated.
    Steel is real.... cheap and comfy!
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  2. #2
    ride lots be safe Creakyknees's Avatar
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    I would run the tubies and have a pre-stretched spare tire under my saddle with a couple of co2's.
    "have fun and be kind"
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  3. #3
    RacingBear UmneyDurak's Avatar
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    Unless there is a good support I wouldn't run tubular tires. Plus descending on them if it's raining sucks. Not sure what the weather is like there, but something to take in to consideration.
    I see hills.... Bring them on!!!
    Stay calm and bring a towel.

  4. #4
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UmneyDurak View Post
    Plus descending on them if it's raining sucks
    wut?

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    The lighter ones. the aero difference between the 27s and the 30s has got to be tiny. Why do you even have those 2 sets, they are practically the same!
    ...

  6. #6
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    The clinchers don't seem to be significantly different. Take the one that's lighter if you're not hard on equipment.

    Tubulars in the are good. Descending on them is good. I think the comment is directed at the fact that you probably have carbon rims. Braking in the wet is less certain on carbon rims.

    If I was to set out on a long ride I'd bring strong wheels, reliable ones, ones that I can service. On my longest rides I generally take heavier, more reliable equipment, i.e. clinchers.

    This is your first one. If you get bitten by the bug I think you'll have a lot of ideas on what to do differently for the next one.

    Good luck out there.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by valygrl View Post
    The lighter ones. the aero difference between the 27s and the 30s has got to be tiny. Why do you even have those 2 sets, they are practically the same!
    Ignorance but I do run multiple bikes.
    Steel is real.... cheap and comfy!
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  8. #8
    shut up and ride
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creakyknees View Post
    I would run the tubies and have a pre-stretched spare tire under my saddle with a couple of co2's.
    as would i, but i'm old so i never call them 'tubies'. 'sew-ups' is the old school terminology

  9. #9
    RacingBear UmneyDurak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    wut?
    Braking in to a corner in the wet on carbon rims is just not as good as on aluminum. Eats up the pads like no tomorrow also.
    I see hills.... Bring them on!!!
    Stay calm and bring a towel.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by UmneyDurak View Post
    Braking in to a corner in the wet on carbon rims is just not as good as on aluminum. Eats up the pads like no tomorrow also.
    I had the same reaction as shovel the first time I read the reply.

    "Unless there is a good support I wouldn't run tubular tires. Plus descending on them if it's raining sucks."

    No mention of carbon or braking, just of descending and tubulars, which is fine. Braking on carbon in the rain, less so.

  11. #11
    Resident Alien Racer Ex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UmneyDurak View Post
    Braking in to a corner in the wet on carbon rims is just not as good as on aluminum. Eats up the pads like no tomorrow also.
    All carbon rims are not the same. Neither are aluminum. Best wet braking I've had are on some Reynolds DV46's.

  12. #12
    RacingBear UmneyDurak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
    I had the same reaction as shovel the first time I read the reply.

    "Unless there is a good support I wouldn't run tubular tires. Plus descending on them if it's raining sucks."

    No mention of carbon or braking, just of descending and tubulars, which is fine. Braking on carbon in the rain, less so.
    Well braking comes with descending, but yeah should have been more explicit.


    Quote Originally Posted by Racer Ex View Post
    All carbon rims are not the same. Neither are aluminum. Best wet braking I've had are on some Reynolds DV46's.
    Never had any issue with any aluminum ones, even the cheap ones. My carbon ritchey are damn scary thought.
    I see hills.... Bring them on!!!
    Stay calm and bring a towel.

  13. #13
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post

    "Unless there is a good support I wouldn't run tubular tires. Plus descending on them if it's raining sucks."

    No mention of carbon or braking, just of descending and tubulars, which is fine. Braking on carbon in the rain, less so.
    Hence my reaction. I'd ride tubulars in any race I could, hands down.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    Hence my reaction. I'd ride tubulars in any race I could, hands down.
    I really would like to but logistically it is a problem. I'd have to check replacement wheels in the night before and right now I won't even be in town the night before the race. I just recently picked up the tubulars already glued up and since I have never had to fix a flat yet am hesitant to risk having to do it myself in this race. Especially since if it happens early on I'll could be doing high-speed descents on the first tubular I have ever replaces. Don't like the idea of that. Haven't even put them on for a training ride because I don't have the spare glued up yet.
    Steel is real.... cheap and comfy!
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  15. #15
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    Then run the Kinlins.

  16. #16
    RacingBear UmneyDurak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    Hence my reaction. I'd ride tubulars in any race I could, hands down.
    Me too, if weather is good and there is a good support. For something like this, I would rather ride clinchers where I can just change the tube, instead of waiting on the side of a road for who knows how long, or risking riding and descending on a replacement tubular tire that wasn't glued on.
    I see hills.... Bring them on!!!
    Stay calm and bring a towel.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by UmneyDurak View Post
    Me too, if weather is good and there is a good support. For something like this, I would rather ride clinchers where I can just change the tube, instead of waiting on the side of a road for who knows how long, or risking riding and descending on a replacement tubular tire that wasn't glued on.
    +1

  18. #18
    ride lots be safe Creakyknees's Avatar
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    oh. in that case, run the clinchers.
    "have fun and be kind"
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  19. #19
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    For my 3 LOTOJAs, I packed two tubes and 4 CO2 cartridges because I didn't want to get stranded between food stops waiting for a sag wagon.

    I rode Ultremos of some variety each of the years (Ultremo, Ultremo R.1 and Ultremo EVO probably). The roads were in good, clean shape. Your tires should be fine, but just in case.

    I was fortunate enough to never flat during LOTOJA. Same went for all but one of my teammates who flatted once in three years.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Rad View Post
    For my 3 LOTOJAs, I packed two tubes and 4 CO2 cartridges because I didn't want to get stranded between food stops waiting for a sag wagon.

    I rode Ultremos of some variety each of the years (Ultremo, Ultremo R.1 and Ultremo EVO probably). The roads were in good, clean shape. Your tires should be fine, but just in case.

    I was fortunate enough to never flat during LOTOJA. Same went for all but one of my teammates who flatted once in three years.
    Yep, I don't normally get flats either using the Conti GP 4000s. That is what has me so tempted to run the tubular setup. But I will play it safe and use the lighter Zen clinchers with the GP 4000s mounted. Now I have to decide which bike which will dictate tire size. I normally run 700 x 25c for a bit more comfort with no noticable loss in speed. But the CR1 Pro looks to tight in the rear to mount 25C tires so according to my decision I maybe forced to the 23s. May do it anyway for a tad less weight to spin up the hills. Sure I'm going to be hurting after 200 miles anyway so...
    Steel is real.... cheap and comfy!
    2000 LeMond Zurich, 2003 Kona Jake The Snake, 2008 Raleigh Mojave 8.0, 2009 Scott CR1 Pro, 2011 Trek 5.9,

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesdak View Post
    Ignorance but I do run multiple bikes.
    Ah that makes much more sense now. I have several similar sets like that too, come to think of it.
    ...

  22. #22
    Senior Member zonatandem's Avatar
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    Clincher tires are a bit easier to fix when you flatten.
    Suggest taking the lighter wheelset.
    Just returned from Logan, UT where we spent 3 months riding our tandem and racing bike.
    Have ridden a half dozen double centuries (but not Lotoja).
    Pace yourself and enjoy the ride!

  23. #23
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    Good luck next week.

    What is your start time?

    As for neutral support, your start pack will begin to come apart at the first stop. The fastest, strongest riders won't stop there - just continuing on. The remainder of whatever pack you are in will come completely come apart up the first mountain pass (Emigration?). From there it's a crap shoot as to what neutral support car will be anywhere near you at any one time. In other words, don't count on them being close!

    Strangely enough, there's loads of riders who have no biz riding LOTOJA. As the ride progresses through the day, note how many cars have bikes on the racks - those are the DNF riders for the most part, some relay riders, but mainly DNF. It's a long ride (duh) and some didn't log many training miles.

  24. #24
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    Did you flat?! I read they had a ton of flats on the course this year.

  25. #25
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    How strong are you?

    If you flat, you're probably out of contention anyway. Might as well have a spare set of wheels in the follow car if you can have them and carry a tube/patch kit/pump so you can be on your way and claw your way back.

    Flats happen and they suck. On a road race where you might not have support they usually mean bye bye if the pack decides to go and you can't muscle back.
    If you can, then more power to you.

    Edit: Oops. Race is over.
    Last edited by ridethecliche; 09-11-12 at 10:30 PM.
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