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-   -   Training Status??? (III) (http://www.bikeforums.net/33-road-bike-racing/857147-training-status-iii.html)

johnybutts 12-06-12 12:20 PM

Sorry to hear kensuf! =( I've been there. I spent 4 months in a cast in 2007. Foot still ain't right.

waterrockets 12-06-12 01:17 PM

45' of BrBa trainer time this morning. Enjoyable. They bought a car wash in a corrupt fashion.

Nice 5' hill repeats in the 60F sunshine. Power was encouraging. On the way back to work, I rode with some Bissel and Elbowz pros for a bit. They were actually taking it a bit too slow for my "gotta get back to work," so I dialed it up to 400, and, well, you know (let's just say they had to ride around the hamer I droped).

Fat Boy 12-06-12 01:53 PM

I trust you gave them 'The Look' as you rode off.

TMonk 12-06-12 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shovelhd (Post 15022069)
Agree on the first point, disagree on the second. If you're OTF solo, power is very valuable. You have no way of knowing the speed of the field.

i was talking about speed, not power

what REALLY matters here is w/kg and/or w/cda, depending on the terrain and conditions. speed follows.

TMonk 12-06-12 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterrockets (Post 15022406)
45' of BrBa trainer time this morning.

:lol:

at first I was like, what kind of interval is that???

JandersUF 12-06-12 07:25 PM

short warm up, then 60 min @ 92% FTP on the trainer, watching Game of Thrones. My new favorite trainer workup... 88-92% sweet spot for 50-80 minutes straight with good shows to watch. I feel good and tired at the end, but I feel fully recovered the next morning. I guess that is how sweet spot should work.

Add in a couple days of real FTP work a week and this threshold block is good so far.

Fat Boy 12-06-12 07:35 PM

55 minutes strength work. Could barely walk afterwards. It's gotta be helping....right?

shovelhd 12-06-12 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TMonk (Post 15022558)
i was talking about speed, not power

what REALLY matters here is w/kg and/or w/cda, depending on the terrain and conditions. speed follows.

So was I. So what if I know what my speed is. I have no idea what the speed of the field is. It's a useless metric in this case. What I do know is how long I can expect to go at a certain wattage before exploding.

And what really matters is heart, determination, confidence, and the ability to ignore pain, not some number on a screen.

johnybutts 12-06-12 07:59 PM

2 hrs, 32 miles, trash workout, but fun group ride.

rbart4506 12-06-12 08:07 PM

Almost 2hrs on the trainer with 2x20's thrown in for some fun :)

TMonk 12-06-12 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shovelhd (Post 15023970)
So was I. So what if I know what my speed is. I have no idea what the speed of the field is. It's a useless metric in this case. What I do know is how long I can expect to go at a certain wattage before exploding.

And what really matters is heart, determination, confidence, and the ability to ignore pain, not some number on a screen.

oic. we agree then.

Fat Boy 12-06-12 09:13 PM

Speed, like distance, is a 'fall out' number. Power and time is really all we care about. Speed changes based on weather, road profile and 1000 other things. With speed, when you have the wind at your back there is an 'easy' day. When you're climbing, it's a tough (or impossible) day. Measuring your fitness on a bike by speed on an arbitrary stretch of road is like measuring someone's IQ base on the money in their wallet. While there may be some correlation, it's a poor metric to use.

HR is better than nothing, at least you can get an idea of how your body is responding to the effort you're making it produce. RPE is OK as well, but it's _very_ easy to fool yourself, especially as you get tired. Cadence is interesting, but really tells you nothing of the actual force on the pedals. Power is the only real measure of effort. Time at that effort gives you work load.

The problem with power is that there are no easy days. They all suck.

johnybutts 12-06-12 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Boy (Post 15024279)
Speed, like distance, is a 'fall out' number. Power and time is really all we care about. Speed changes based on weather, road profile and 1000 other things. With speed, when you have the wind at your back there is an 'easy' day. When you're climbing, it's a tough (or impossible) day. Measuring your fitness on a bike by speed on an arbitrary stretch of road is like measuring someone's IQ base on the money in their wallet. While there may be some correlation, it's a poor metric to use.

HR is better than nothing, at least you can get an idea of how your body is responding to the effort you're making it produce. RPE is OK as well, but it's _very_ easy to fool yourself, especially as you get tired. Cadence is interesting, but really tells you nothing of the actual force on the pedals. Power is the only real measure of effort. Time at that effort gives you work load.

The problem with power is that there are no easy days. They all suck.


FWIW, I use a 1.2 mi tree-protected loop for all my intervals. same road, same bike, same tire pressure, same kit, same position, same barometric pressure, etc... It's also the same course for our weekday crits if they ever happen again. So to say the speed isn't comparable day to day is not exactly true.

Speed might be a "fallout" number, but it's also directly what wins or loses races. If the winning sprint is 32 mph and you do 30mph, it really doesn't matter if it was 2000W. Likewise, if the breakaway can do 27mph for the last 15 minutes when the field does 26.5... doesn't matter if it's 200W or 400W.

As for "fooling" myself, since it's the same course, i can directly see if my speed falls off.

I'm fully aware the most accurate way to do this is to use a power meter... I used one for 3 years. The simple truth is I don't want to. I'm trying a new system for myself. One which doesn't force guilt on me for not recording power when half my rides are on my mountain bike. CTL/ATL/TSB etc... Also one where I can use any wheels I want without any regret of either not having aero-ness or power.


http://i.imgur.com/xzPki.gif

http://thechive.files.wordpress.com/...al-with-it.gif

http://i.imgur.com/aoQkW.gif

http://i.imgur.com/6DdDc.gif

http://meta.filesmelt.com/downloader.php?file=dwi12.gif

kindablue 12-06-12 10:09 PM

Base 1 week 1 Gym
Low Bar squat 5x10 @ 105#
Bench 3x10 @ 105#
Deadlift 5x10 @ 90#
Leg press 5x10 @ 270#

My squat form is shaky but coming along. It's gonna be nice having a squat number higher than a bench number, looks a bit less odd for a cyclist. Or a human.

jsutkeepspining 12-06-12 10:12 PM

1.5 hours w/ a 1 hour tempo interval. feels nice brah

Fat Boy 12-06-12 10:54 PM

jb, if you don't want to use your powermeter, just say so. If you think I care one way or another, you're mistaken. I was just trying to help you out. Have a good one.

miwoodar 12-06-12 11:31 PM

In pursuit of FTP. Back to digging a hole.

TMonk 12-07-12 12:53 AM

overslept and got 2 hrs today instead of 3. off tomorrow.

I think I may make saturday slightly more intense and/or longer

shovelhd 12-07-12 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Boy (Post 15024527)
jb, if you don't want to use your powermeter, just say so. If you think I care one way or another, you're mistaken. I was just trying to help you out. Have a good one.

+1

johnybutts 12-07-12 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shovelhd (Post 15025041)
+1

To be fair, I did. I'm just updating here. And it's not that I expect everyone to track me down with everythign I'm doing. I just felt like arguing.

thechemist 12-07-12 08:36 AM

Woke at 3:30 to commute 33mi to work...trying to HTFU

TMonk 12-07-12 08:45 AM

holy crap that sounds horrible

im a chemist too but i can start work at 10:30 or even 11 if i want
by the same token i can also start at 6:30 or 7

Creatre 12-07-12 08:58 AM

3hr high endurance, pretty much low tempo after work yesterday. Makes for a long day.

Legs have felt superb this week and I think after the power numbers of tuesday and yesterday's workout I'm finally getting to the next level with this base work. Another two months should really put me there!

thechemist 12-07-12 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TMonk (Post 15025319)
holy crap that sounds horrible

im a chemist too but i can start work at 10:30 or even 11 if i want
by the same token i can also start at 6:30 or 7

uplc/ms and gc/mc stuff that does give me a flexible schedule somewhat but I get home early for other obligations.

Creakyknees 12-07-12 09:56 AM

just stopping by to drop these off:

1) “If you are not serious in the winter then you have a bad season"
- Philip Gilbert
http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/12/news/gilbert-locked-in-legal-case-with-omega-pharma-ceo_267837

2) "National Weather Service: Expect A Warm, Dry Winter, North Texas"
http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/unfa...vice_expec.php


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