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  1. #6676
    Elite Fred mollusk's Avatar
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    2.5 hours with 1 hour 45 minutes at the lower end of SST. Temps in the mid 60's F. It felt great.
    I'm the world's forgotten boy. The one who's searchin', searchin' to destroy.

  2. #6677
    Senior Member aaronmcd's Avatar
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    Today I realized my ability to put out power varies tremendously between weekday commute and weekend group ride. Even commutes can vary quite a bit. Is this much variation normal or what?

    5 minutes of my commute today (after some warm up + spinning drills) at ~80% hurt and sucked.
    4 hours at > 0.8 IF two days ago hurt, but didn't suck (yesterday was easy recovery ~40%).

    A) not warmed up
    B) not motivated because solo or backpack or clothes or...
    C) still beat from the weekend even after really easy recovery day
    D) something else...

  3. #6678
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    I go through periods like that. If it's not rest/nutrition related I find that it's typically mental. Some days I will hop on the bike and feel like putting out power is easy. Other days my legs hate me and it seems like a struggle. Either way I can almost always hit my numbers

  4. #6679
    Packfodding 3 caloso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronmcd View Post
    Today I realized my ability to put out power varies tremendously between weekday commute and weekend group ride. Even commutes can vary quite a bit. Is this much variation normal or what?

    5 minutes of my commute today (after some warm up + spinning drills) at ~80% hurt and sucked.
    4 hours at > 0.8 IF two days ago hurt, but didn't suck (yesterday was easy recovery ~40%).

    A) not warmed up
    B) not motivated because solo or backpack or clothes or...
    C) still beat from the weekend even after really easy recovery day
    D) something else...
    This was me this morning. I swear I must have looked 5 times to see if my tire was flat or the brakes were rubbing. No such luck. Just suck.
    Cyclists of the world, unite! You have nothing to lube but your chains!

  5. #6680
    Senior Member aaronmcd's Avatar
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    Short commute may have a bit of an effect due to lack of warm up.
    Or today could have been especially worse due to a fire in a nearby metal management yard.

  6. #6681
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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronmcd View Post
    A-ride. 75 miles with a ton above 90% threshold (280 TSS). Felt great even after fast paced ride yesterday - definitely seeing improvement from these 225 mile weeks! 2 more weeks in the block. Hope to ride myself half to death during christmas vacation
    Quote Originally Posted by aaronmcd View Post
    Active recovery planned for my commutes today as well. Don't let me go over 200 watts. It'll be tough

    Swim this morning was a pretty good workout though. I'm usually in the slow lane (2:10 cruise) but today the slowest lane was 1:50. All I remember is "make it stop! make it stop!"
    Quote Originally Posted by aaronmcd View Post
    Today I realized my ability to put out power varies tremendously between weekday commute and weekend group ride. Even commutes can vary quite a bit. Is this much variation normal or what?

    5 minutes of my commute today (after some warm up + spinning drills) at ~80% hurt and sucked.
    4 hours at > 0.8 IF two days ago hurt, but didn't suck (yesterday was easy recovery ~40%).

    A) not warmed up
    B) not motivated because solo or backpack or clothes or...
    C) still beat from the weekend even after really easy recovery day
    D) something else...
    Quote Originally Posted by aaronmcd View Post
    Short commute may have a bit of an effect due to lack of warm up.
    Or today could have been especially worse due to a fire in a nearby metal management yard.
    i dont think it's the metal management yard fire.

    i think it's fatigue from "4 hrs. at >0.8 IF" + whatever the A ride is + 225 mile weeks + swimming + haphazard training that is more riding than training and lacks big picture focus or clear structure (this is my opinion from reading a few of your posts).

  7. #6682
    Making a kilometer blurry waterrockets's Avatar
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    +1 MDcatV

    Yeah, swimming faster than you planned is not going to allow "active recovery" to recover jack squat. (Re-)read Friel, esp. the part about how training makes you weaker, and only recovery makes you stronger. Recover as hard as you train, or harder.

  8. #6683
    Senior Member aaronmcd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MDcatV View Post
    i dont think it's the metal management yard fire.

    i think it's fatigue from "4 hrs. at >0.8 IF" + whatever the A ride is + 225 mile weeks + swimming + haphazard training that is more riding than training and lacks big picture focus or clear structure (this is my opinion from reading a few of your posts).
    Could be. Not sure 3 hours of swimming has a noticeable impact. The swimming is kind of a compulsive thing - I've been slow to pick it up, therefore I must do it to prove I can.

    On the hard weekend: Does it usually take more than one easy day to recover? I managed to average as low as 130 watts for yesterday's recovery.

    The A ride was the 4 hour intense ride, more steady/smaller group. It was the day after saturday fast paced group ride more spikes/large group, hence the Monday recovery. I try to get "big" (for me) weekends in because M-F is mostly commuting only 100 miles total. I don't want to do 5 easy days in a row though, so I try to keep the power up mid-week (Friday and Monday recovery before and after weekend). I hate Tuesday to be kinda-sorta-hardish-but-not-really. Maybe start going easy on Tuesday as well and really utilize my longer commuting on Wednesday?

    Quote Originally Posted by waterrockets View Post
    +1 MDcatV

    Yeah, swimming faster than you planned is not going to allow "active recovery" to recover jack squat. (Re-)read Friel, esp. the part about how training makes you weaker, and only recovery makes you stronger. Recover as hard as you train, or harder.
    I guess I've been assuming that swimming has almost zero impact on cycling - not using the same muscles. Guess it could impact whatever is going on in the body to repair those muscles though. Thinking about it - I guess it's similar to weight lifting. You can alternate muscle groups all you wan't but still don't want to lift 7 days a week.
    Last edited by aaronmcd; 12-17-13 at 03:34 PM.

  9. #6684
    Senior Member furiousferret's Avatar
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    30 minute lunch ride. Felt blah but went out there and crushed it. PR'ed my climb by a long shot, still a lot of work to do though. I have a poor habit of comparing where I am at to the local legends, which is really doesn't do anything but bring in negativity about my progress (which is actually really good). My W/Kg has gone from 2.4 to 3.2 which isn't too bad for a 3 month span.

    Some of my cycling jerseys look like football jerseys now

  10. #6685
    soon to be gsteinc... rkwaki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by furiousferret View Post
    30 minute lunch ride. Felt blah but went out there and crushed it. PR'ed my climb by a long shot, still a lot of work to do though. I have a poor habit of comparing where I am at to the local legends, which is really doesn't do anything but bring in negativity about my progress (which is actually really good). My W/Kg has gone from 2.4 to 3.2 which isn't too bad for a 3 month span.

    Some of my cycling jerseys look like football jerseys now
    Dangerous game comparing yourself to others...
    More difficult on the head than the body...
    "if you ride it the way it's meant to be ridden there's no way any wife is less of a ***** than a bicycle." - gstein

  11. #6686
    Senior Member aaronmcd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rkwaki View Post
    Dangerous game comparing yourself to others...
    More difficult on the head than the body...
    Why would people who race ever want to compare themselves with others?

  12. #6687
    soon to be gsteinc... rkwaki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronmcd View Post
    Why would people who race ever want to compare themselves with others?
    No it's not that, it's comparing yourself against 'local legends'
    Can be disheartening.
    "if you ride it the way it's meant to be ridden there's no way any wife is less of a ***** than a bicycle." - gstein

  13. #6688
    Making a kilometer blurry waterrockets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronmcd View Post
    I guess I've been assuming that swimming has almost zero impact on cycling - not using the same muscles. Guess it could impact whatever is going on in the body to repair those muscles though. Thinking about it - I guess it's similar to weight lifting. You can alternate muscle groups all you wan't but still don't want to lift 7 days a week.
    Yep. If something feels like a lot of work, that's your body telling you that it was a lot of work. Swimming is going to be working endurance, threshold, and VO2Max systems, and not all of that stress is in the limb muscles. Heart, lung/diaphragm, mitochondrial, RBCs, fat stores, metabolism, hormones, etc. lots of stuff going on with both sports. Significant core work is present in both.

    I really try to take it easier on my recovery days. Housework, but probably not re-landscaping or framing kind of stuff.

  14. #6689
    \_(ツ)_/ Ygduf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rkwaki View Post
    No it's not that, it's comparing yourself against 'local legends'
    Can be disheartening.
    until you beat them, then you feel good.

    aaron, for me, it's mental. my commutes are easy. My brain and legs expect a certain level of effort, when I try to go near threshold or something silly on my commute, it's a shock to the system. When I'm out on some weekend ride, it's NBD.

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  15. #6690
    **** that mattm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rkwaki View Post
    Dangerous game comparing yourself to others...
    More difficult on the head than the body...
    This is what I keep telling myself after finding out that I race against a few people with an FTP in the 380w range..

    (and they weigh just as much as I do!)
    cat 1.

    blog

  16. #6691
    Senior Member rideaz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by furiousferret View Post
    30 minute lunch ride. Felt blah but went out there and crushed it. PR'ed my climb by a long shot, still a lot of work to do though. I have a poor habit of comparing where I am at to the local legends, which is really doesn't do anything but bring in negativity about my progress (which is actually really good). My W/Kg has gone from 2.4 to 3.2 which isn't too bad for a 3 month span.

    Some of my cycling jerseys look like football jerseys now
    Nice! I love those rides when you surprise yourself!
    Luckily there's not too many local legends in my area!

  17. #6692
    Powered by Borscht ovoleg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattm View Post
    This is what I keep telling myself after finding out that I race against a few people with an FTP in the 380w range..

    (and they weigh just as much as I do!)
    You're making me sad bro
    -Cat-3-o-meter: TBD :/

  18. #6693
    Senior Member jsutkeepspining's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattm View Post
    This is what I keep telling myself after finding out that I race against a few people with an FTP in the 380w range..

    (and they weigh just as much as I do!)
    Wait is that not normal...
    cat 1-o-meter: wtf am i doing??????
    Quote Originally Posted by Racer Ex View Post
    You're not dumb. You're just less smart.

  19. #6694
    **** that mattm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsutkeepspining View Post
    Wait is that not normal...
    It probably is, for cat 1's. You'll fit in fine!
    cat 1.

    blog

  20. #6695
    Senior Member jsutkeepspining's Avatar
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    First i need to race again, then i need to win, then i need to upgrade, then eventually i'll profit (barely, but at least it will be something)
    cat 1-o-meter: wtf am i doing??????
    Quote Originally Posted by Racer Ex View Post
    You're not dumb. You're just less smart.

  21. #6696
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MDcatV View Post
    i dont think it's the metal management yard fire.

    i think it's fatigue from "4 hrs. at >0.8 IF" + whatever the A ride is + 225 mile weeks + swimming + haphazard training that is more riding than training and lacks big picture focus or clear structure (this is my opinion from reading a few of your posts).
    Bingo.
    My 10 speed Shimano sell-off is in the Classifieds-For Sale section.

  22. #6697
    Riding the bike I love. sstang13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rideaz View Post
    Nice! I love those rides when you surprise yourself!
    Luckily there's not too many local legends in my area!
    Maybe you are the local legend
    "You lack motivation because cycling is a stupid sport with no upside that takes way too much time out of your life to be mediocre at." - Racer Ex

  23. #6698
    Senior Member rideaz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sstang13 View Post
    Maybe you are the local legend
    If I am...it's not for cycling

  24. #6699
    Senior Member jsutkeepspining's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    Bingo.
    I don't know about you, but even my hard races that are that long are rarely >.8 IF. That's a lot of tss. I also don't know how helpful a ride like that is.
    cat 1-o-meter: wtf am i doing??????
    Quote Originally Posted by Racer Ex View Post
    You're not dumb. You're just less smart.

  25. #6700
    \_(ツ)_/ Ygduf's Avatar
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    he's new, working on endurance, and in the middle of the off-season. hard rides will stimulate mitochondria growth. just need to balance hard rides with good rest and diet.

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