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  1. #10801
    **** that mattm's Avatar
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    50 squats.

    after two weeks on the couch it felt pretty hard!
    cat 1.

    blog

  2. #10802
    Senior Member hack's Avatar
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    30ish miles of easy riding with a few hills tossed in (moderate to light effort up hill).
    Cat 2 upgrade status: never

  3. #10803
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rideaz View Post
    Great insight and ideas WR! My kids would be taken care of and no problem to get time off work. My issue is finding someone to do the 11-12 hour drive with me. I don't feel comfortable driving there by myself. I think I might have it figured out though. Going to keep trying
    You're Cat3 or higher, right?

    I think you're in a no lose situation. You are still recovering from injury which could be a factor. If you win or podium what a tremendous accomplishment that would be. Others may disagree but I found Nats to be the hardest most aggressive racing I have seen in my fields. The motivation for stripes is very high. The field is culled pretty early, so you end up racing against all the household names from around the country. It's crazy hard, but it shows you where you fit in at the National level. The run up in your training in July and August is obviously difficult physically but mentally I found it easy. Just think about the stripes. It's all about the stripes.

    Good luck and have fun.

  4. #10804
    Senior Member rideaz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    You're Cat3 or higher, right?

    I think you're in a no lose situation. You are still recovering from injury which could be a factor. If you win or podium what a tremendous accomplishment that would be. Others may disagree but I found Nats to be the hardest most aggressive racing I have seen in my fields. The motivation for stripes is very high. The field is culled pretty early, so you end up racing against all the household names from around the country. It's crazy hard, but it shows you where you fit in at the National level. The run up in your training in July and August is obviously difficult physically but mentally I found it easy. Just think about the stripes. It's all about the stripes.

    Good luck and have fun.
    Thanks! I'm Cat 2. I haven't been injured, I've been a bit MIA from the forum because of life stuff. It's been a pretty good year on the bike so far, I did the state road race last month and took a short break after that but have been otherwise riding consistently. My challenge at Nats will be my inexperience. I just started racing this year, did my first crit in January. I've raced a lot but I realize I'm in way over my head with the household names and that caliber of rider. At the same time I love challenges like that. When you start bike racing at age 40...you don't have the luxury of slowly working your way up the ranks. Or at least, that's how I see it. I'm kind of an all or nothing person anyways lol. And if I do get there, I'll remember It's all about the stripes!

  5. #10805
    avatar by Sean Powers mike868y's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ridethecliche View Post
    I've seen this.

    (It isn't a pretty sight)
    lol. the best part about riding that thing around is that the same dbag roadies who suck my wheel without asking won't even acknowledge me. i rode out to woburn after work yesterday and tried to ride up waltham/ridge street (super steep climb) and had to walk up part of it, first time that's happened to me in years.

    fwiw, being forced to ride that thing around has totally made me fall in love with urban fixed gear riding. just gotta get those wide ass bars trimmed and some toe clips again (the ones I had before were like toe straps and were super annoying to get in/out of), which means getting a crank with the right pedal size (stupid bmx cranks). all in due time...
    Quote Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
    it depends

  6. #10806
    \_(ツ)_/ Ygduf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattm View Post
    50 squats.

    after two weeks on the couch it felt pretty hard!
    Gotta start somewhere. I'm not sure I wouldn't be a quivering mess at 50 bw squats.

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  7. #10807
    \_(ツ)_/ Ygduf's Avatar
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    Bike Ride Profile | TNR Corte Madera near Stanford | Times and Records | Strava

    Now that I race I am generally too cool for strava racing, but sometimes... 3 separate group rides go over that 1' bump and I'm back on top.

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  8. #10808
    Elite Fred mollusk's Avatar
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    A bit over two hours easy today. Earlier I had a dental appointment (one filling with no numbing and after that a really good cleaning/scraping) and every time I get dental work I feel like ass when riding. Same as it ever was as far as that goes.

    Or it could be the 90+ F temps and high humidity when I finally got out to ride in the middle of the afternoon like we get in Florida made it a horrible ride.

    Today it felt like both the dentist and the weather were kicking my ass.
    I'm the world's forgotten boy. The one who's searchin', searchin' to destroy.

  9. #10809
    \_(ツ)_/ Ygduf's Avatar
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    a filling with no numbing? I'd feel worse than ass.

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  10. #10810
    Elite Fred mollusk's Avatar
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    It was pretty superficial and I didn't feel any pain.
    I'm the world's forgotten boy. The one who's searchin', searchin' to destroy.

  11. #10811
    Senior Member shovelhd's Avatar
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    Badass.

  12. #10812
    Making a kilometer blurry waterrockets's Avatar
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    Yeah, I've requested not to numb for a couple fillings. Much better in my opinion. If it's a shallow drilling, there's really not too much discomfort. One time it got a little rough for about 5 seconds, but that goes away REALLY quickly, and the rest of my day is much more normal without the numbing.

  13. #10813
    **** that mattm's Avatar
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    50 squats.
    cat 1.

    blog

  14. #10814
    Senior Member Wylde06's Avatar
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    Just broke through 1200 watts last night...new peak power (1204) and pr'ed through 7 seconds

  15. #10815
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    Here's a question for the strength enthusiasts. The past couple of months I've been doing some new things.

    First, a strength workout once a week, 3x per week on bike rest weeks. It's mostly a core workout (essentially the P90X "ab ripper") with some upper body as well.

    Second, way more protein, about 1 g/lb.


    The effects have been good. I feel great. Increased core strength feels better even just walking around. Power on the bike has ticked up across the board, I've set power PRs practically every day.

    Overall weight has not increased, but I am noticeably bulkier. I take this to mean that I've lost fat and added muscle, which I can't complain about. My question is about the relationship between the protein and the bulk. Without all the extra protein, would I still be gaining strength without the added muscle bulk (and presumably losing weight)? Maybe this is a dumb question, but is the added muscle mass required to significantly increase strength?

  16. #10816
    \_(ツ)_/ Ygduf's Avatar
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    muscle is denser than fat, so if you weigh the same you are not bulkier. if you're cutting fat, you will look more muscular.

    overall weight is the same, look different => just body comp changes.

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  17. #10817
    These Guys Eat Oreos Creatre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by globecanvas View Post
    Here's a question for the strength enthusiasts. The past couple of months I've been doing some new things.

    First, a strength workout once a week, 3x per week on bike rest weeks. It's mostly a core workout (essentially the P90X "ab ripper") with some upper body as well.

    Second, way more protein, about 1 g/lb.


    The effects have been good. I feel great. Increased core strength feels better even just walking around. Power on the bike has ticked up across the board, I've set power PRs practically every day.

    Overall weight has not increased, but I am noticeably bulkier. I take this to mean that I've lost fat and added muscle, which I can't complain about. My question is about the relationship between the protein and the bulk. Without all the extra protein, would I still be gaining strength without the added muscle bulk (and presumably losing weight)? Maybe this is a dumb question, but is the added muscle mass required to significantly increase strength?
    Bulk is not required for strength. Protein is also not required for muscle gains. Therefore protein doesn't necessarily mean strength gains.

    It's all about calories in/calories out for bulk. You've likely gone through many little cut/bulk cycles where you put on a very small amount of muscle, and lost a very small amount of fat, and over time you've maintained roughly the same weight, but look better for it. You've also gotten some "newb gains" from just utilizing the muscles in the first place, which just makes everything look a bit more lean and defined as the muscles store a bit more of the carbohydrates in your system to be used without really putting on bulk.

    Now, strength can be increased without bulk, however it is often times slow. Think about any time you've lost weight while cycling, and how hard it was to get any gains at the same time. Then think about any time you've put on a little weight or maintained, and you'll usually see a corresponding easier time to gain fitness. Same thing is going to go for any core/strength work. If you add the calories, you'll make larger gains. Here's where you can add additional protein to try and make up for the caloric difference. Instead of adding calories you can add a bit of protein and sometimes get away with the ability to maintain or add strength at a quicker rate.

    However, the core/strength gains you want in cycling are not always the overall raw strength. The extra weight on the body and the extra stress of working out harder in the gym in order to lift 10 or 20 pounds more isn't always worth it. It's not going to coincide with higher watts directly, especially if you are lifting so heavy you are carrying fatigue to cycling and it's causing your on the bike training sessions to be lower quality. I find it more important to have overall good body health. If it takes you a month to lift an extra 5lbs or add another set to whatever exercise, that's okay. The important part is that you are using a variety of muscles that aren't usually used in cycling, which helps bone health, injury prevention, and sometimes can show a slight performance increase on the bike over time.

    I'm no scientific expert, this is just what I've experienced lifting and cycling the past couple years and then being a gym rat the last 8 months.
    Category 2 | | Velogames BikeForums Leagues: 1st - 2012 Veulta, 1st - 2011 Vuelta, 2nd - 2013 Vuelta, 3rd - 2012 Giro, 4th - 2012 TdF

  18. #10818
    Ninny globecanvas's Avatar
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    That's all valuable information, thanks.

    To be clear, I'm not lifting at all, these are entirely equipment-less exercises. I absolutely feel stronger on the bike as a result, especially when in the drops, sprinting, or out of the saddle. Out of the saddle almost feels like a secret weapon or power boost now, as opposed to just a way to use some different muscle groups.

  19. #10819
    These Guys Eat Oreos Creatre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by globecanvas View Post
    Out of the saddle almost feels like a secret weapon or power boost now, as opposed to just a way to use some different muscle groups.
    That's the exact same feeling I had after starting strength and core work.
    Category 2 | | Velogames BikeForums Leagues: 1st - 2012 Veulta, 1st - 2011 Vuelta, 2nd - 2013 Vuelta, 3rd - 2012 Giro, 4th - 2012 TdF

  20. #10820
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creatre View Post
    Bulk is not required for strength. Protein is also not required for muscle gains.
    Solely eating more protein will not cause muscle growth, but without protein you will go into a catabolic state which will not build muscle.

  21. #10821
    These Guys Eat Oreos Creatre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by misterwaterfall View Post
    Solely eating more protein will not cause muscle growth, but without protein you will go into a catabolic state which will not build muscle.
    I should have stated additional protein. I didn't mean to suggest a non protein diet.
    Category 2 | | Velogames BikeForums Leagues: 1st - 2012 Veulta, 1st - 2011 Vuelta, 2nd - 2013 Vuelta, 3rd - 2012 Giro, 4th - 2012 TdF

  22. #10822
    Senior Member hack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by globecanvas View Post
    That's all valuable information, thanks.

    To be clear, I'm not lifting at all, these are entirely equipment-less exercises. I absolutely feel stronger on the bike as a result, especially when in the drops, sprinting, or out of the saddle. Out of the saddle almost feels like a secret weapon or power boost now, as opposed to just a way to use some different muscle groups.
    Are these changes isolated to flats or are you feeling better on climbs, too?
    Cat 2 upgrade status: never

  23. #10823
    **** that mattm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wylde06 View Post
    Just broke through 1200 watts last night...new peak power (1204) and pr'ed through 7 seconds
    nice - now see if u can break it out when u really need it.
    cat 1.

    blog

  24. #10824
    Senior Member jsutkeepspining's Avatar
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    4 hours of z2 w/ 6x4x4s @110% in the last hour. I'm a tiny bit tired.
    cat 1-o-meter: wtf am i doing??????
    Quote Originally Posted by Racer Ex View Post
    You're not dumb. You're just less smart.

  25. #10825
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    Quote Originally Posted by globecanvas View Post
    Here's a question for the strength enthusiasts. The past couple of months I've been doing some new things.

    First, a strength workout once a week, 3x per week on bike rest weeks. It's mostly a core workout (essentially the P90X "ab ripper") with some upper body as well.

    Second, way more protein, about 1 g/lb.


    The effects have been good. I feel great. Increased core strength feels better even just walking around. Power on the bike has ticked up across the board, I've set power PRs practically every day.

    Overall weight has not increased, but I am noticeably bulkier. I take this to mean that I've lost fat and added muscle, which I can't complain about. My question is about the relationship between the protein and the bulk. Without all the extra protein, would I still be gaining strength without the added muscle bulk (and presumably losing weight)? Maybe this is a dumb question, but is the added muscle mass required to significantly increase strength?
    Several layers to this:

    1) Can I get stronger without gaining muscle?
    -Yes, to a point. Improved technique can improve weight lifted/moved so with that in mind you can. That caps off though, at which point you will need to gain some muscle to increase strength. Given that cycling is about power to weight, it's up to you to figure out that balance for you.

    2) I don't know what you mean by bulkier. Muscle is more dense than fat and you end up with the same weight if you have less of it than fat, so if you feel more muscular, then kudos, but 'bulkier' would make me think you gained fat.

    Point is, you'll need more muscle to get stronger. So yes, you'll need to gain some weight if you want to keep making progress in the gym.

    Quote Originally Posted by misterwaterfall View Post
    Solely eating more protein will not cause muscle growth, but without protein you will go into a catabolic state which will not build muscle.
    I mean... Are you saying catabolic without protein supplements or protein at all? It would be idiotic to go to a protein-less diet, but your body can synthesis proteins pretty with carbs (see: krebs cycle/transamination)
    Last edited by ridethecliche; 07-23-14 at 12:35 PM.
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