Trev Doyle

Greg may yet have the last laugh if (when) Lance is caught doping.

I agree with Doghair, I am sick of every issue of every bike mag I buy has LA on the cover. Enough already!!! I know what a yellow jersey looks like.

oldspark

I just don't understand this whole Lance versus Greg thing, it has been blown way out of whack by a lot of people. Both great cyclists (both American by the way) in there own right, seems like every little thing they say about each other is taken out of context.

Trev Doyle

Well, the Lance versus Greg seems to be a very popular theme on this forum. Even if the thread began talking about something else, everyone seems to be taking sides (with a vengeance). I like them both, neither are my favorites though, but I am a little tired of seeing Lance EVERYWHERE. Now if you'll excuse me I'm going to pop over to the Mixed Martial Arts forum and add my 2 cents to the many Randy Coutoure vs. Chuck Liddell threads!

Grasschopper

Actually that was me that said they had the pump. It did work fine until it broke but it shouldn't have broken so soon IMO. It didn't last long but again I didn't pay much for it. I believe the same pump is being sold by Performace with their brand on it pretty cheap as well. I am not sure about the whole contract dispute. The Lemond stuff hasn't been in our Target for at least 2 years now and has been replaced by a line of similar level of quality products with the Schwinn name on them. Did Koffee say that the company that owns the Schwinn name the same one that had the contract with Lemond? If so I guess I can see him sueing but still the comments about his current celebrity are clearly overblown. Outside of serious cyclists I, like others have stated, think it would be hard to find someone that knew who he was or what he did.

LordOpie

Often.

Do women think Greg's a great looking guy?

Cuz Anna wasn't choosen for her tennis skillz. If she was selling $10 bottles of lemonade in her tennis outfit, I'd buy. $15 if she grunts.

blaine

Any pro cyclist these days has a hard time disassociating themselves with doping...

qmsdc15

My mom who knows nothing about cycling brought up Greg Lemond's name in conversation today. I think everybody over 40 knows who he is.

jkoman

Just because someone is of " High Moral Character " doesn't make them right....nor does it make them wrong. It should just have an effect on how we view their statements. History shows that good people are still flawed....I believe that applies to both Lemond and LA.

If you believe Lemond to be a bitter ex champion then that skews your view...ditto if you see LA a drug user....or clean champion.

Some like Koffee and a few others try to see both sides and offer a little insight. I see LA and Lemond as great champions and good people. Time may reveal some more of their flaws or it may not....history and human nature assure you that they are still human and flawed.

I believe Lemond to be very principled...to a fault. I see LA driven beyond our imagination to both do good and achieve whatever the goal is...at what price?

bac

NeoBinary

Amen to that brother.

Flaneur

Back in the day, Lemond helped make Oakley a household name in cycling, not the other way around. He also boosted the sales of hard shell helmets, funny handlebars and clipless pedals. Guy was a marketer's prayer answered.

Since when were Agassi or the Red Hot Chilipeppers cool? At least if you had a bunch of Manilow cd's, people would consider you 'out there' and ironic;-)

Guest

I happen to like Manilow! I hope to see him live in Vegas when I go back for Interbike 2005. Don't knock him if you haven't tried him out. "Oh Mandy" is da bomb. Seriously.

Koffee

bandaidman

the greg lemond suit is about breach of contract, not whether or not he is the "most popular"

he signed a 10 year contract with a $500k/yr minimum. it still has 7 or 8 years to go i believe. the marketing company has offered $1.1M to buy him out (with the present value of money that offer is not as bad as it seems, although still low)

key issues are whether or not there is a buyout or performance clause in the contract. also i believe i recall that the $500k figure was a minimum. if the company made representations that the contract might be worth millions per year when they signed greg, that could represent a potential award orders of magnitude greater than even the face $5m the deal was worth. remember, all it takes is a preponderance of the evidence in a civil trial to lead to a jury award, not the "beyond a shadow of doubt" required in many criminal proceedings.


as far as Greg Lemond goes, he was the true innovator among American cyclists...not only for technical achievements...but the fact he changed the way contracts were made in cycling...bringing a sharp business acumen to the table. top level pros in europe have clearly benefited from that...no one more so than lance...do you think he would have received a million dollar contract from cofidis if it wasn't for the pioneering work of lemond...no way.

who will have the greatest long term legacy...who knows. greg is much more likeable and is "clean". he had 3 tour victories plus the one he had to cede to hinault on team orders. the fact he came back and won a tour despite being critically injured in a hunting accident is just as remarkable to me as a physician as lance's recovery from cancer. the "what ifs" if he had not been shot are very intruiging but will always remain that.

lance on the other hand has the victories and a remarkable and very appealing story in his recovery from cancer. he is a tremendous athlete, but is not that likeable a guy. he is extraordinarily selfish and not very admirable in his personable (he dumped the woman who nursed through cancer for the woman who became his wife later dumping her for one of prince's old dancers/lovers). if he gets busted for doping his endorsement career will go in the dumper, cancer survivor or not.

not that subaru will be paying him the big bucks once he retires anyway

roadbuzz

Naw, Greg was a lot like Lance. Greg was not only the first American to win the tour (beating the likes of Hinault, no less), he was ostensibly well liked in the peloton and a PR mans dream. The stuff sponsorships are made of. Like LA, he as selected as athlete of the year by that bastion of stick and ball, Sports Illustrated. His fame and recognition went well beyond that "1% or 2%" of avid cyclists.

rich007

Just an update (didn't see it posted here yet):

Greg won the lawsuit... See it here (excerpt below, click on the headline, linked to the article):

LeMond wins $3.46 million in lawsuit

By Tim Maloney, European Editor

On Friday, February 4, a jury in a St. Paul, Minnesota (USA) federal court ruled in favour of three-time Tour de France winner Greg LeMond in his breech of contract suit against PTI Holdings Inc. of New York. 43 year-old LeMond of Medina, was awarded $3.46 million dollars. According to LeMond's attorney Bill Pentelovitch, the award was based on an estimate of royalties LeMond would have received if the contract had been honoured by PTI.

In 2002, PTI dropped LeMond before his 10 year contract expired, and LeMond subsequently filed suit in 2003 for breach of contract. In court proceedings, LeMond introduced evidence of an e-mail from PTI, sent in March 2003 saying PTI wanted to end LeMond's contract with a $1.1 million buyout because of Lance Armstrong's "emergence as the dominant American cyclist."

At press time, there was no word whether PTI Holdings would appeal the award.

oldspark

Justice was served.

Guest

Damn straight. Don't enter a contract with someone and NOT market them, then basically accuse them of being an unmarketable has-been.

Koffee

The Rob

Breaking with proper form here, to add nothing to the topic other than...

Crack'n'fail

here's another link:

https://www.velonews.com/news/fea/7529.0.html

jkoman

It seems that Lemond has a very clear and realistic understanding of his influence and how it compares to that of LA at this time...based on the article above

nick burns

Ha, it's not just today's riders that he trashes. I have a video tape of an interview Lemond did in 1991 or so where he puts down Merckx ( ) by stating there are at least a dozen Merckx's in today's ('91) peloton.

I believe at the time there was some sort of court battle going on between him & Merckx about the sale of their respective bike lines.

Despite his controversies I still have a ton of respect for the guy as one of the greats of pro cycling.

oneradtec

Greg Lemond has always been the 'John McEnroe' of cycling!