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Old 02-28-05, 02:06 PM   #1
Smoothie104
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Tyler Hamilton's

Court Hearing begins today, I hope he confesses.....


On a directly related note, although one that know one seems to care about. Santiago Perez, his Phonak teamate, was suspeded for 2 years yesterday.
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Old 02-28-05, 02:17 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by Smoothie104
Court Hearing begins today, I hope he confesses.....
I'd respect him so much more if he did. I would have even more if he had stepped up at the beginning and said, "Yeah I did it, it was wrong, I'm sorry to the cycling community." And taken his punishment.

That's one thing that's lacking in much of our society- Honor and Personal Responsibility. If you screw up, man up and admit it and take your punishment then come back stronger and better from it.
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Old 02-28-05, 02:39 PM   #3
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[QUOTE=B10Cycle][QUOTE=Smoothie104]Court Hearing begins today, I hope he confesses.....
Quote:

I'd respect him so much more if he did. I would have even more if he had stepped up at the beginning and said, "Yeah I did it, it was wrong, I'm sorry to the cycling community." And taken his punishment.

That's one thing that's lacking in much of our society- Honor and Personal Responsibility. If you screw up, man up and admit it and take your punishment then come back stronger and better from it.
So I guess he's guilty before the court hearing even starts? You know he could be telling the truth, stranger things have happened.
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Old 02-28-05, 02:58 PM   #4
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Actually, it would be nice if it turned out the whole thing was a big mistake. "Sorry...our new testing procedure is faulty...you and your team mate were accused by mistake".

But, yes, if he is guilty, he ought to tell the truth. And, he ought to tell the truth about every other form of drug abuse, blood transfusions, EPO, HGH...lay out everything he knows. About himself. And about any active rider that Tyler knows from personal observation has been cheating.

Telling the truth might end his racing career, but might help the effort to clean up the sport. And earn him back the respect that his courage on his bike had won for him.
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Old 02-28-05, 03:18 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoothie104
On a directly related note, although one that know one seems to care about. Santiago Perez, his Phonak teamate, was suspeded for 2 years yesterday.
Yes no one cares becauses he's not AMERICAN.


Last edited by fight or flight; 02-28-05 at 03:43 PM.
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Old 02-28-05, 03:29 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by alanbikehouston
But, yes, if he is guilty, he ought to tell the truth. And, he ought to tell the truth about every other form of drug abuse, blood transfusions, EPO, HGH...lay out everything he knows. About himself. And about any active rider that Tyler knows from personal observation has been cheating.

Telling the truth might end his racing career, but might help the effort to clean up the sport. And earn him back the respect that his courage on his bike had won for him.
I totally agree! One of the things about this whole Jose Canseco thing the constant refference by the media wags that he's a rat. So if your teamate is cheating and you tell someone you are a bad person. What kind of message does that send to kid coming up through the ranks? The only way professional sport is going to rid itself of drugs is from the inside. The player (riders) need to speak out and tell the truth. Unfortunately I believe these guys want to keep the drugs in the sport becuase they like how it makes them feel.

In this months CycleSport Peter Winnin makes a pretty compelling case for the legalization of most drugs. His claim is that for the most part the list of banned substances do nothing to enhance your performance. He does however say the EPO should be banned as it does enhance a riders ability to perform. He states that the arrival of EPO in the late 80's and early 90's completely changed the peleton. This also give some creadence to LeMonds gripe about how the arrival of EPO drove him out of the sport.
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Old 02-28-05, 03:37 PM   #7
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Did anyone think that about David Miller when he confessed? Granted he was pretty much caught red-handed, but he didn't put up much of a fight. Having said that, I can't say that I respected Miller for rolling over any more than I would have respected him for arguing his innocence. It's just plain pathetic no matter how you look at it ... same goes for Tyler.

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Old 02-28-05, 03:40 PM   #8
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How about we let Tyler plead his case before we throw the ol' guilty until proven innocent book at him?
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Old 02-28-05, 03:45 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by geneman
Did anyone think that about David Miller when he confessed? Granted he was pretty much caught red-handed, but he didn't put up much of a fight. Having said that, I can't say that I respected Miller for rolling over any more than I would have respected him for arguing his innocence. It's just plain pathetic no matter how you look at it ... same goes for Tyler.

-mark
Well good ole David was pretty adiment that he was drug free untill they caught him. During the whole Cofidas affair he claimed that he had no part in it. Then when caught and confronted with overwhelming evidence he confessed. Not as bad as Veranque but still he's no saint.
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Old 02-28-05, 04:05 PM   #10
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I still think he has Down syndrome. Santi too.
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Old 02-28-05, 04:12 PM   #11
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Google's "news" search function led to a good article at the Denverpost.com. The hearing is being held in Denver, and it looks as if the Denver paper will cover the hearing closely.

Tyler's lawyer has done a good job of getting the cycling press to talk about this as being "a brand new test...new procedures....new technology".

The Denver Post reports that this technology is used in hospitals every day for organ transplants, and other medical procedures. This is a testing process with a long history, and is highly accurate when correctly used.

Based on the likelihood that the testing process and "science" will be shown to be reliable, Tyler's best chance might be to argue that his samples got switched with another rider, or that someone tampered with his samples. That argument would be more convincing if he had failed one test in one country, rather than failing three tests in two countries. That's a lot of sample switching, and a lot of tampering.


One story reported that his team spent $800,000 researching ways the test might have been faulty. After spending all of that money, they fired Hamilton...so what did their $800,000 in research tell them about the chances of a faulty test?

I don't think the hearing will resolve anything. If he is found "guilty", Tyler is likely to continue to say "I wuz framed", and his wife, family, friends, and fans will believe him or pretend to believe him. Like Barry Bonds, if it is proven that he cheated, he could become a "professional victim" and whine about the unfairness of it all, blame the press, blame his team, and then say "There is no proof that using blood transfusions affected the outcome of any race".

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Old 02-28-05, 04:29 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by alanbikehouston
One story reported that his team spent $800,000 researcing ways the test might have been faulty. After spending all of that money, they fired Hamilton...so what did their $800,000 in research tell them about the chances of a faulty test?
Not quite, Hamilton was put on suspension pending the outcome of his case. If convicted, he WILL be fired.

http://www.velonews.com/news/fea/6992.0.html

LINK TO THE DENVER POST ARTICLE:
http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,...734449,00.html
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Old 02-28-05, 04:38 PM   #13
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My LBS has a Phonak jersey that's been there forever. I'm tempted to buy it and see what kind of feedback I get wearing it around town. Sort of a conversation piece.
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Old 02-28-05, 04:40 PM   #14
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Man thats how that little guy was amazing at Time Trialing

any way, the only thing i liked about him was his attitude in the 03 TDF, when he won that stage i really thought that was cool, other than that I really dont like him!
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Old 02-28-05, 05:13 PM   #15
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and your from Wayland? Barring the recent doping this guy was a saint in the peleton, maybe even too nice.
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Old 02-28-05, 05:14 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoothie104
Court Hearing begins today, I hope he confesses.....
What did you want him to confess, Smoothie 10-4? Or should I say, what do you know him to be guilty of and how do you know these things? Please enlighten us.
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Old 02-28-05, 06:31 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by 2Rodies
So I guess he's guilty before the court hearing even starts? You know he could be telling the truth, stranger things have happened.
yeah! everyone knows he was attacked by a reverse vampire!
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Old 02-28-05, 06:35 PM   #18
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and your from Wayland? Barring the recent doping this guy was a saint in the peleton, maybe even too nice.
Whats it got to do with wayland?

anyway, I can understand that i just had a bad feeling about him.
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Old 02-28-05, 06:46 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Devil
I still think he has Down syndrome. Santi too.
Hey, OJ Simpson was innocent
THamilton must be innocent too
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Old 02-28-05, 07:09 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by B10Cycle
I'd respect him so much more if he did. I would have even more if he had stepped up at the beginning and said, "Yeah I did it, it was wrong, I'm sorry to the cycling community." And taken his punishment.

That's one thing that's lacking in much of our society- Honor and Personal Responsibility. If you screw up, man up and admit it and take your punishment then come back stronger and better from it.
David Millar did that and has been tarred and feathered in the cycling reviews. Millar will be back for 2006 Tour. But Felip Meurenghue(?) of Specialized -- former world Cup champion mountain biker. Don't think he's coming back anytime soon. Most never return to their past glories. Richard Virenque is an exception but he wasnt' too well liked in the pro peloton.
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Old 02-28-05, 07:24 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by squeegy200
David Millar did that and has been tarred and feathered in the cycling reviews. Millar will be back for 2006 Tour. But Felip Meurenghue(?) of Specialized -- former world Cup champion mountain biker. Don't think he's coming back anytime soon. Most never return to their past glories. Richard Virenque is an exception but he wasnt' too well liked in the pro peloton.
David Millar did not fess up from the start. He only spilled his guts after the French police arrested him and found his stash. From the begining of the whole Cofidas affair he denied any involvement he only came clean after the arrest.
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Old 02-28-05, 07:43 PM   #22
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You guys do realize that there is a guy in jail, now, for extortion...who'd he extort? Phonak. Called twice just before both tests came back positive...the second one was that unless they paid up, a third rider would test positive.
hmmmmm.....

I'm thinking that unless you think wrestling's real and the moon shot's were faked, you'd await the facts...

I know a person who knows Tyler very well...from Massachusetts...HE thinks he's inocent.

I guess we will see....
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Old 02-28-05, 08:26 PM   #23
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Everyone that knows Tyler thinks he's innocent. I ride with his original club from time to time and talk with his first coach now and then, my boss is the guy who always interviewed Tyler on OLN's Road to the Tour. Hell if you went to a bike shop in MA for a week or two after the test results came out, you'd have thought that some died. They all think he's innocent. But all that means jack, the trial will help decide things one way or another.
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Old 02-28-05, 09:32 PM   #24
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okay... i'm going to ask the obvious question... does anyone really think that three positive tests and the fact that a teammate got busted for the same thing are just coincidence?

he might be legally innocent until proven guilty [i don't know what the usada presumption of innocence is] but it's pretty clear that he cheated.

as far as i'm concerned, that's okay. if he'd just admit it and face the music, i'd be all for giving the guy a second chance [after he served his suspension]. i think zulle, virenque and others redeemed themselves by doing their time and coming back. but his paranoid accusations and holier-than-all posturing is pretty unseemly.

be a man, tyler. give it up. it's getting sad.
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Old 02-28-05, 09:59 PM   #25
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All I can say is that if Horner ever gets caught juicing, I'm going to get well upset. I hope the dude scores some major wins this year. Tyler's got funky ears and that's just too damn suspicious to me.
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