Here's that video...I didn't want you guys to waste valuable brain cells looking things up.
I also found a video of Needmoreair and Aaron's aero testing:
So your wind tunnel numbers didn't, but the speeds and wattages did?
Because that's the issue I have; that 35 and 40 mph requires far greater watts what you've postulated. Especially since we're talking about a road bike on a road and not a full-on tt setup in a velodrome or something.
(hey, you walked into that)
Postulation is a guess without factual proof. That's not what I posted. What I posted were numbers from engineering formulas based on physics, test data from the"real" world, and from the "test" world. The latter two would be facts, the former a working hypothesis, not a postulation. Some of that on a road bike. On the road. With me on it. Not you.
You are postulating. You have not done any controlled testing, produced any test parameters, protocol, and formula or other basic hypothetical underpinning to your claim.
You rode your bike and couldn't do a wheelie. You asked a bunch of Cat 4's to do a wheelie and they couldn't. Same with some Cat 3's. Some guy said he did a wheelie and you cried BS.
I can still wheelie BTW. I looped out my new Madone in the parking lot before a crit. You'd think at my age I'd stop being a kid.
You keep letting the midget dunk on you because you fail to grasp the concept of outliers, and have embraced a philosophy that your experience constitutes the totality of reality.
Your dogma can't hunt.
My preference however is to use some other leadout guy, then yell up up up as loud as I can to get their leadout guy to jump early and usually their sprinter jumps early too. Then I can have my cake and eat it too. Of course I am currently sand bagging in the 3s as I use to be a cat 1 rider 10 years ago, but becoming an old fat dad took a bit out of my legs and I decided to start over again. But it is fun and I look forward to upgrading and racing the 1/2 races again this summer.
oh, and as we have all said many times, not all or even most races end with a 40 mph sprint, but the ones with good leadouts on flat courses do and not just in the cat 1/2 races.
Exhibit B: he doesn't realize that all his sprinting success makes him an outlier compared to the slowtwitchers. Therefore, all cat-4's should sit and sprint it out as opposed to learn how to attack and get in a break that stays away.
I'm glad RX chimed in with the wind-tunnel testing post. I almost posted it for him. It doesn't stop there, he makes his own extensions, pad supports, numerous other bits on his rigs to get results. It's not all intervals and FTP out there.
Anyone who wants to make at least some aero improvements but doesn't have the time or budget for the tunnel might take a look at this thread, and while you're there, improve on the technique and post up about it there.
Last edited by waterrockets; 04-01-14 at 08:34 AM.
I don't get to watch the pros very often, whether the Euro level or the domestic ones. I used to make the pilgrimage to Philly for a while and watched Yates win solo among other years, Somerville is pretty amazing, and I got to watch the Worlds in Hamilton. I only started appreciating the speed after I was racing for a few years - the first race I ever watched was the Crit Nationals and the whole experience just overwhelmed me so I didn't walk away with the sensations of extraordinary speed. I simply couldn't relate to it, sort of like watching (in 3rd person) a motorcycle race but never having ridden a motorcycle.
I'm always amazed at how fast they go, how fast they're turning the big gears. It's just incredible. It's hard to capture that sensation of effortless speed at a local race because no one can go that fast that effortlessly. The few times a rider does that they look like they're riding a motorcycle (and I read about them getting a contract later).
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
This can obviously introduce inconsistencies based on the quality & quantity of that GPS data. Phone GPS < Garmin GPS, 1s GPS interval > 5s GPS interval, loss of GPS signal, etc...
So for any segment, especially short ones, there are bound to be outliers in the results.
On the other hand Strava is a great repository of large amounts of data from multiple riders over many years. So, by looking at the leaderboard (and ignoring the outliers) you can get a general idea of what is possible (given the ideal conditions) for that stretch of road.
soooo expensive. I'm reasonably certain that with my head position, i'd benefit from one of those kask bambino helmets over my giro since I wouldn't have the tail of a helmet sticking up in the air, but for the 4 or 5 TTs I do in a year, and the bottom 3rd portion of the results sheet I typically reside in, I cant justify plunking down $499 for one.
Oh, right, but you're talking about outliers. Doh! Glad too see you're keeping it relevant.
But I do enjoy your cliches. You dumped a ton of them in there.
Can you crank out 440 watts for a couple of minutes? Or at least long enough for you to realize that you're not going to go 35 miles per hour?
Because I can. And much higher. And I'm not going anywhere near that 35 unless I'm pushing way more.
That's the point, here, and apparently racer ex is all gung ho on throwing out numbers that are flat out ridiculous for most everyone as if he's somehow proving a point.
But my point is it's an easily verifiable crock by most anyone else with a power meter. I just don't have a well-oiled cliche to go along with it.
You realize you're throwing that in with my posts concerning wholly unrealistic correlations between speed and wattage, right?
Can you go out and drop 40 mph at 550 watts? No.
Can I? No.
Can absolutely anyone I've ever raced with? Not that I've ever seen.
Can anyone in the history of the world? I don't know, but Cancellara and Sagan and Martin and guys like that aren't doing it, so it's probably not hard to guess which direction I'm leaning.
And I'm not a "sprinter". I've never cracked 1350 watts in my whole life. And only cracked 1300 once in my whole life. So all of my "sprinting success" wasn't exactly "sprinting success" as one may traditionally define sprinting success. I win only a handful of races a year, and virtually never in a full-on field sprint.
The point about sitting in and sprinting, though, is that it is consistently possible to do so for placings and if upgrading is a goal, then placings get those points. Like I said, I've gone through the ranks and had lots of friends and teammates that I've watched through the years. To me, it seems like there's a lot of wasted energy and opportunity with these "attacks" and whatnot. But hey, if every race you do ends in a break, by all means go with a break. That's not the case where I race, so disregard if it's not your cup of tea.
Last edited by needmoreair; 04-01-14 at 03:10 PM.