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Is amateur bike racing taken more seriously by it's participants than other sports?

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Is amateur bike racing taken more seriously by it's participants than other sports?

Old 06-01-14, 03:02 PM
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I think part of it also comes from the nature of it, i.e. the danger and risk of injury. If you're doing motorsports or cycling, you're much more likely to be intense about it and take it more seriously than say running, because you're not subjecting yourself to risk from others in the same way.

There are other factors too, obviously, but I've always thought that this was a decent part of it.
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Old 06-01-14, 05:02 PM
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In my experience, at least for me,it takes more commitment to be a mediocre bike racer, than it does to be mediocre in other endeavors.

I can participate, and be moderately competitive,at least at a low level, on not much effort in golf, tennis, basketball for example.

To even be at a level to be in the game, bike racing takes a much greater commitment for me.

At an elite level, most any sport takes tremendous effort and commitment.

But for bike racing, it seems to me the anty to just get in the game is higher than most others.
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Old 06-02-14, 02:01 PM
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I think we're no different than any other sport, really, when it comes to taking things more/less seriously.

But I think cycling has more of its population in the middle-serious range, if that makes any sense. For instance, I'm a middle-range cyclist and I'm also middle-range in a couple other sports. The work habits I developed as a cyclist were not present in those sports. Nobody watches what they eat or when they eat. Nobody stays off their feet between games. Nobody practices the fundamentals outside of competition. Nobody hydrates during games. Yet if you were to ask them about their level of dedication, they would all claim to be serious about the game. And for many of them, that was the only sport they play and they play it 4 or 5 nights per week.
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Old 06-02-14, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
In my experience, at least for me,it takes more commitment to be a mediocre bike racer, than it does to be mediocre in other endeavors.

I can participate, and be moderately competitive,at least at a low level, on not much effort in golf, tennis, basketball for example.

To even be at a level to be in the game, bike racing takes a much greater commitment for me.

At an elite level, most any sport takes tremendous effort and commitment.

But for bike racing, it seems to me the anty to just get in the game is higher than most others.
This makes a lot of sense to me.
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Old 06-02-14, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
In my experience, at least for me,it takes more commitment to be a mediocre bike racer, than it does to be mediocre in other endeavors.

I can participate, and be moderately competitive,at least at a low level, on not much effort in golf, tennis, basketball for example.

To even be at a level to be in the game, bike racing takes a much greater commitment for me.

At an elite level, most any sport takes tremendous effort and commitment.

But for bike racing, it seems to me the anty to just get in the game is higher than most others.
But, are you just out playing golf or are you competing in a tournament? I've done both (bike race and tournament golf) and both are equally demanding in my experience. Prior to cycling, I'd be at the range for 3-5 hours a week on top of the 3-6 hours of rounds on the weekends. I'd liken going out to play golf and being moderately competitive to going out on a local fun group ride. You can hang in both, but it's not quite the same as a race or a tournament.

With that, I'd say the fanaticism is equal across all hobbies, sports, etc. If people have the $ and the time, they will obsess.
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Old 06-02-14, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by hack
But, are you just out playing golf or are you competing in a tournament? I've done both (bike race and tournament golf) and both are equally demanding in my experience. Prior to cycling, I'd be at the range for 3-5 hours a week on top of the 3-6 hours of rounds on the weekends. I'd liken going out to play golf and being moderately competitive to going out on a local fun group ride. You can hang in both, but it's not quite the same as a race or a tournament.

With that, I'd say the fanaticism is equal across all hobbies, sports, etc. If people have the $ and the time, they will obsess.
Competitive Golf in High School.

Obviously playing competitive tournament golf takes either a lot of time or a lot of talent.

But there are a number of ways to play golf competitively that would be roughly analagous to the Cat 5 bike racing, i.e. Member Guest tournaments, all sorts of handicapped local tournaments.

I can go out and play to a 15 handicap, and compete in handicapped events , playing 3-4 rounds a year, have fun, and be competitive with others at my level.

If I tried to race, even Cat 5 only riding 3-4 times a year that wouldn't work so well.

My point is that in many other sports, there's a level of competition that allows you to play the game with less effort than it takes to get in the game of bike racing.

Same thing in Tennis, I used to play local tournaments and league tennis at 4.0 level (probably analagous to being a Cat 3). I worked pretty hard at that. But I could go out and play tennis competitively on an hour a week by just slotting down to to 3.0.
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Old 06-02-14, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by hack
But, are you just out playing golf or are you competing in a tournament? I've done both (bike race and tournament golf) and both are equally demanding in my experience. Prior to cycling, I'd be at the range for 3-5 hours a week on top of the 3-6 hours of rounds on the weekends. I'd liken going out to play golf and being moderately competitive to going out on a local fun group ride. You can hang in both, but it's not quite the same as a race or a tournament.

With that, I'd say the fanaticism is equal across all hobbies, sports, etc. If people have the $ and the time, they will obsess.
With golf, you also compete with a handicap. I wish we had the same thing in cycling, that way I could start climbs a couple minutes ahead of the fast guys, but we don't have those. I'm not saying it makes it easier to be at the top as I think golf is probably one of the hardest and most frustrating games, but you can "compete" in a weekly league with a 20 handicap and still be competitive after that's factored in. Not so in bike racing.
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Old 06-02-14, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by hack
But, are you just out playing golf or are you competing in a tournament? I've done both (bike race and tournament golf) and both are equally demanding in my experience. Prior to cycling, I'd be at the range for 3-5 hours a week on top of the 3-6 hours of rounds on the weekends. I'd liken going out to play golf and being moderately competitive to going out on a local fun group ride. You can hang in both, but it's not quite the same as a race or a tournament.

With that, I'd say the fanaticism is equal across all hobbies, sports, etc. If people have the $ and the time, they will obsess.
I think Merlin is right on this one along with the OP. To be OK you have to be pretty serious. I would guess that those who are discounting the level of dedication either are ignoring the amount of work they've put in or are taking for granted their natural talent for racing, which a lot of us don't have.

The comparison to golf is just inaccurate. When have you vomited from the effort of training/playing golf? Having played golf, I just don't buy that 11 hour weeks of training/playing golf are as taxing as 11 weeks of training for racing on a bike. Having said all that, maybe the difference in effort isn't the point.
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Old 06-02-14, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Yep
I think Merlin is right on this one along with the OP. To be OK you have to be pretty serious. I would guess that those who are discounting the level of dedication either are ignoring the amount of work they've put in or are taking for granted their natural talent for racing, which a lot of us don't have.

The comparison to golf is just inaccurate. When have you vomited from the effort of training/playing golf? Having played golf, I just don't buy that 11 hour weeks of training/playing golf are as taxing as 11 weeks of training for racing on a bike. Having said all that, maybe the difference in effort isn't the point.
As taxing? No, not at all, but as demanding or challenging to be good, yes, 100%. I presented golf as an example of a non-cycling activity that requires extensive dedication to be "good".

Also, yes, you have to put in time and effort to be good at racing, but that requirement isn't limited to cycling, but is a common theme among pretty much any competitive endeavor.

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Old 06-02-14, 10:30 PM
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A few years ago I played on a world champion online FPS team and we put in crazy hours for that. It took us two years to hit the top and during that time we probably averaged 12 hours a day, but it was a video game. If I played any less than that, it was noticeable. For me its apples to oranges, because although I love cycling, I have to do things I don't really want to do to be good at it (cycling on a trainer, in the rain, sub 50 degree temps, etc). That isn't even counting the nights I go to sleep hungry (although fatties seem to have no issue winning crits).

Some people can get on their bikes and do well, especially if they are athletically gifted or coming from another sport. If someone who just got off the couch asked me what they needed to do to win a Cat 5 race, it would be a pretty tall order. Cycle 10-20 hours a week, $3,000 on equipment, lose weight, group rides at least once a week, and call me after you hit 10,000 miles.
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Old 06-03-14, 06:44 AM
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Originally Posted by misterwaterfall
With golf, you also compete with a handicap. I wish we had the same thing in cycling.
The Category system is essentially handicapping. It's separating guys out by strength and skill to even out the playing field. Sure, there are going to be exceptions, but it kind of works the same way.

And I too played golf in high school - four years on the varsity team. Now, I play a couple times a year. I can usually play well for the first nine holes, but the back nine is a disaster largely because I get tired. It may not seem like much, but it does take conditioning to swing a golf club consistently for a full 18 holes. Even more if you want to do it multiple days in a row.

I'll also add that my brother was a scratch golfer before he got married and had kids. Now that he only plays about once a week, instead of 3-7 times, he has fallen to an 8-10 handicap.
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Old 06-03-14, 07:21 AM
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Originally Posted by topflightpro
The Category system is essentially handicapping. It's separating guys out by strength and skill to even out the playing field. Sure, there are going to be exceptions, but it kind of works the same way.

.
I think that's a reasonable analogy. However I think the handicap system in Golf goes deeper. 20 handicap in Golf can compete against other 20 handicaps in actual tournaments.

20 handicap bike rider is doing the club B ride, and doesn't have a prayer actually racing.
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Old 06-03-14, 07:25 AM
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so in cycling I'm a +2 and I can do races with guys who are +15 to -5? (p,1,2,3)

uh
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Old 06-03-14, 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by grolby
"Takes racing too seriously" is how bike racers call each other dicks.
+1
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Old 06-03-14, 09:01 AM
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The demanding thing with cycling (or endurance sports) isn't the amount of hours you do per week. It's two things really that kind of separate it from other sports: 1) Consistency. If you miss an extra day or two each week, that will show up in races. The biggest way to gain fitness is just to be consistent. And to be consistent with that many hours a week, means you have to make sacrifices. And those sacrifices make it seem like we take it very seriously, because to us, those sacrifices are worth the price to be "good" at bike racing. 2) Off the bike. Our training doesn't end when we are off the bike. We can't take the time we spent on training or racing from sleeping. Matter of fact, we have to sleep more than the average person, to recover. We also have to eat like crazy. If you skip a meal, or eat improperly, at some point, you'll feel that on the bike. There's even more sacrifices you have to make here, which again, makes it seem like things are very serious.

I personally took cycling way too serious. Realized it wasn't getting me anything. And I decided those sacrifices I were making were not longer worth it. So I just ride when I feel like it now. But I know I can't race, even for fun. Because I'll suck. And if I suck, I'll want to do better. And if I want to do better, I'll take everything serious again. It's an endless cycle (pun intended).
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Old 06-03-14, 09:39 AM
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If all that sounds like an addiction, that's because it is.
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Old 06-03-14, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by shovelhd
If all that sounds like an addiction, that's because it is.
We (VeloPress and I) are actually exploring this as a topic for a book. Though I'm not sure my writing style is best suited. Mark Johnson would be a better fit.
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Old 06-03-14, 10:55 AM
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Michael Hutchinson (sp?) has a similar sounding book coming out in the autumn.
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Old 06-03-14, 11:22 AM
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It's definitely an addiction. When did I become someone who, when hanging out with friends on Saturday night, drinks mostly water, leaves at 10 pm and limits alcohol to 2 beers all nig- I mean evening?
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Old 06-03-14, 11:30 AM
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You're doing it wrong.
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Old 06-03-14, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by shovelhd
If all that sounds like an addiction, that's because it is.
Yup.

I made a thread about this on slowtwitch when I put a halt to training, if anyone wants to read it (it's kinda long, and no one really responded, just kinda needed to put that out somewhere at the time lol): Exercise Addiction: Triathlon Forum: Slowtwitch Forums
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Old 06-03-14, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by aaronmcd
It's definitely an addiction. When did I become someone who, when hanging out with friends on Saturday night, drinks mostly water, leaves at 10 pm and limits alcohol to 2 beers all nig- I mean evening?
You went out with friends at stayed up until 10pm. That's a step above where I was at when I was training haha.
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Old 06-03-14, 11:47 AM
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I go out with my friends at 8am, unless we're racing, then it's like 6am meetup.
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Old 06-03-14, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by YMCA
not at all
go to any b-ball court in da USA and you'll find fights breaking out over every wrong look
I agree with you, however, I don't think that is taking the "sport" serious, it is being serious about being a thug.
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Old 06-03-14, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by shovelhd
You're doing it wrong.
Classic Shovel line! I think someone needs this in their sig.

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