i had my nieghbore ( whos like 12 and i'm 14) come to my mtn biking course. ( this all happend yesterday too...) so he loves to jump off of my dinky x factor with his Trek 4300. so i've gotten him over like 3' 1/2 foot high sticks with just the x factor and he clears them so well. so anyway, we set up a 3 1/2 foot high stick resting on cinder blocks and big rocks on top of the cinder blocks....since my run way for my jump is only about 200 ft, in order for him to get enough air to pop over it the jump only has like 30 ft runway after the jump.... lol so he gets all ready to jump over it when his FRONT tire nails the stick and of course hes leaning forward so his front tire aims for the ground and he lands with both tires, but then he sumersalts holding on to the bike....all in a 30 ft runway....he gets up goes " aw man! that sucked!" lol. not me, but my nieghbors experience i witnessed yesterday.... sry for it being so long.