genec

Whoa, never said it was easy... just said at a minimum you'd be expected to know COLREGs... but not to have memorized Admiralty law. I would think you should be familiar with this set of regs: https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/pdf/navrules/navrules.pdf I am a recreational boater and I am at least familiar with these rules... much as I would expect a motorist to be familiar with the drivers handbook. I would expect someone acting in a professional capacity to know these regs better than I.

I am sure there are all sorts of procedures you also have to learn and become proficient at... That said, I recall being boarded by CG on my boat while in SD sometime after 9-11... the first thing the boarding PO said was "stop the boat." I tried to explain that sailboats don't exactly "stop" unless I drop an anchor, and at best I could "hove to." Beyond that, the crew was professional and cordial. They did a quick inspection of the boat and all holds, and an ID verification of my crew. They were armed and seemed to be no nonsense, but not rude or abusive in any way.

Again at a minimum, I would expect a land based LEO to know the contents of the drivers handbook... (the same thing we expect of motorists, to get a license) these are the laws that they are enforcing daily. The cop in the OP went into the area of rude and smarmy... neither of which are a job requirement. The prosecuting attorney threatened the other cyclists... well outside the aspects of the law. And the judge just went along for the ride... rather than at least scan the laws in question.

bakes1

Why am I not surprised that based upon your own words you fall into one of the two categories I referenced...

mconlonx

This is how I see it, too. Except it seems to me more outright extortion than merely obstruction of justice...

Unfortunately, barring radical changes in the justice system, I assume this happens all the time, in all kinds of cases, and is perfectly legal and normal.

Digital_Cowboy

And any reprimand that he drew was the cyclists fault and not his for his very unprofessional behavior. And I'd still would like to know what happened to the prosecutor who threatened the cyclists witnesses with "if you testify you'll be charged too." As I said he needs to be punished if not disbarred, because if he's going to do that for a "simple traffic violation" what other cases has he done that in?

Digital_Cowboy

Genec,

I've got to agree with you. If a LEO doesn't have at the very least a basic understanding of the law, then how can they enforce it? And if they're driving a patrol car then they should at least know what the drivers license handbook says.

Exactly, the cop was looking for any excuse to make the cyclist's day miserable. Fortunately the cyclist didn't take the bait.

dksix

I can't see the cyclist being at fault for anything here. As was decided in court, the cyclist was in the right and any reprimand the trooper drew was his own doing. I said in my first post that I think the prosecutor should be charged with whatever crime strong arming witnesses carries.

Digital_Cowboy

Watching the video again (and as the first time I watched the embedded video there is no audio) for the first several seconds of the video it does not appear to me that there they are doing anything more than riding two abreast. And for the first 30 or so seconds there is no audio and the cop is well behind the cyclists. So when is he supposed to have told them to ride single file?

And as was commented on, I guess according to this wonderful example of Michigan's state troopers that cyclists are not permitted to pass each other.

I love his response about poor road conditions. Hell all he as to do is to look down at his bloody feet. And pretty much all the way up to where the stop occurred I saw a road surface that was in need of repair as there appears to be more than a few patches on that stretch of roadway. And he is aware is he not that in most if not all states that the roadway is defined as the area between the white lines NOT the area that is outside of the white lines.

I'd be interested in knowing what happened with this state trooper, the prosecutor for threatening witnesses, and the judge for allowing all of this to happen. As they all deserve to be punished with possibly the prosecutor being disbarred and the judge being sanctioned in some manner. And the trooper having to go for some sort of remedial training both in the law as it applies to cyclists and for his attitude because as many have noted this guy came out with a chip on his shoulder.

Digital_Cowboy

No, at about the 2:30 or so mark what the cyclist was doing was putting his wallet BACK into his pocket. At about the 3:30 or so mark it looks as if he's adjusting said wallet, and is just barely reaching into his jersey pocket when his wallet falls out. He bends over picks it and looks through it, and eventually puts it back into his jersey pocket. Yes, towards the end he bends over and does something with his saddlebag, but again given how small his saddlebag is other than a knife what can he have hidden in it?

And sadly, I think that this trooper always intended to give him a ticket no matter what he said.

Digital_Cowboy

I agree that the cyclist wasn't at fault for anything there. And that the trooper obviously had a HUGH chip on his shoulder for whatever reason. What I'm saying is that in the trooper's mind whatever reprimand that he drew was the "fault" of the cyclists.

Exactly, I'd say that at the very least it was witness intimidation and/or witness tampering, and maybe a little blackmail thrown in for good measures.

Digital_Cowboy

I suspect that there may be some footage missing. As it appears to me that the cyclist who was issued the ticket was always in the front. So unless the trooper is talking about something that had happened earlier the cyclist that he issued the ticket to didn't pass anyone. The cyclist in green presumably the female cyclist falls back into the rear position, but I do not in this video see where the cyclist that was ticketed passed anyone.

And it appears that when the trooper pulls away that his dashcam was still rolling. So where is the footage of the cyclist passing someone? Where is the footage/audio of the trooper instructing the cyclists to ride single file? Why isn't that in the video?

dksix

I was saying that had the trooper been looking for a reason he would have pounded on the cyclist's digging in his pockets. I don't think the trooper's intent was to escalate this to a physical confirmation, I think up until it hit the second court it was going exactly as he wanted. I can only imagine how satisfied he was after winning the court case. I've dealt with cops who were looking to crack someones head and I didn't get that impression this time but I think we completely agree on everything else.

Digital_Cowboy

I think that it seriously p!$$ed the trooper off that the cyclist was willing to stand up for his rights. I'd also be curious to know what the cyclist as saying when the audio is missing. As well as I'd like to know just when the cyclist who was issued the ticket is supposed to have passed someone. And I'd like to know how and why the trooper couldn't see the obvious poor road conditions.

And I feel sorry for the next cyclist that this trooper stops. As I think that it is safe to presume that whatever reprimand that he drew he would have blamed on this cyclist, again NOT that the cyclist(s) did anything wrong. But I'm sure that in the mind of the trooper any reprimand that he drew he'd blame on them.

I'd also like to know just where it is that they were riding four abreast as I did not see it in the video that is both embedded or linked to, nor is there any audio from when he supposedly told them ride single file.

And I'd like to know what happened to the prosecutor who threatened the witnesses that would have strengthened the cyclists case as well as what happened to the judge who heard the case at the first level. As he should have thrown the whole thing out.

FeParamount

DG By my reckoning the ticketed cyclist was third in line when the cop rolled up on them and he tries to wave him through. Notice he has white bar tape. The cop then passes the lead Michigan kitted rider who has black bar tape. Rider with white bar tape reappears in the frame after passing rider 2 and 1 out of frame. Cop references this when he got the impression that the guy was being a "smart aleck"

noglider 

I looked and didn't see the bad road conditions. Help?

AlmostTrick

As far as I can tell road condition never should have been mentioned, since they were already riding as far right as practicable on the roadway, only a foot or 2 from the fog line. Maybe parts of the shoulder were poor, and the cyclist was referring to that, but it shouldn't matter since they are not required to ride there.

FeParamount

Watch it in widescreen mode. Also notice the video shaking as he rolls through the light.

Chris0516

I was wondering the same thing.

CrippledKonaBoy

Only a self-important walking sphincter makes judgmental statements like that, deciding on his/her own that ALL riders MUST ride as he/she does, or is a lesser rider and human being, unworthy of any respect. Such a person would best serve society by riding off the side of a bridge.

Add Indiana to the list of states that allow sidewalk riding; my town specifies it, and since only about eight people WALK anywhere, it's just like a MUP. I can personally ride 4-5 miles and encounter fewer pedestrians than I would drivers in ONE RESIDENTIAL BLOCK.

40+ years on the bike, so not inexperienced; IQ likely equal to your WEIGHT, and (painfully) aware of increased limitations, so not an idiot. What I AM is intolerant of intolerance.

bakes1

Please explain what you mean when you say your town 'specifies' it?
Is it illegal to ride on the road in your town?
You generally do not 'encounter' drivers when on the road btw. You share the road with them.
You do however 'encounter' and potentially harm pedestrians when on the sidewalk. Nothing like walking out a shop door into a cyclist. That is an unexpected and unavoidable encounter.

Indiana town with a total of about 8 pedestrians. Very quaint.
Reminds me of a Ned Beatty/Burt Reynolds movie that featured a river and a banjo...

dpeters11

There are towns like this. I don't know about Indiana, but at one point in Ohio there was a town that required cyclists to use the sidewalk, walking their bikes across crosswalks. This was in conflict with Ohio law, but could have been defended by the city as a home rule issue.

Digital_Cowboy

Okay, I've gone back and re-watched it. The pass wasn't in the video. And as has been said before I guess that sadly in the troopers mind cyclists aren't ever allowed to pass each other. One can only wonder what other laws that he has gotten wrong in the past.

Both the road and the shoulder where this trooper thinks that cyclists are supposed to operate are not in the best of shape. When I went to full screen mode I could see patches and cracks in the road.

Except that in most if not every state the roadway is defined as the surface between the fog lines and NOT the area that is outside or to the right of the fog lines. It just sounds as if this trooper either had a chip on his shoulder or an ax to grind, and wanted to make a point to the cyclists.

Here's a question, given that at one point in the video we can hear one of his brothers or sisters in blue go screaming by with sirens and lights a blazing and given that if I am not mistaken that they LEOs do have a certain amount of discretion in the writing of tickets. Shouldn't the trooper have "abandoned" the ticket and gone to assist his brother or sister in blue?!?!

Digital_Cowboy

+100

Thank you Crippled Kona Boy. He does appear to be rather judgmental doesn't he? Not often, but when I deem it to be the prudent course of action will take to the sidewalk AS allowed by Florida law. And as with you I've easily have 40+ years under my belt on a bike and I am again like you hardly an idiot. I also have a road "in my backyard" that has a sidewalk that a number of years ago that was converted into a MUP. It runs from 1st St. N and 78th Ave. N. south to 1st St. N. and 30th Ave. N. Where it goes around/through Coffeepot Park and continues along Coffeepot Blvd. south into and through North Shore Park and on down through the downtown area where one can turn on 1st Ave. N. and pick up the Pinellas Trial.

But I guess according to that "world authority" on cycling that's still a "sidewalk" and cyclists shouldn't use it.

Digital_Cowboy

Hmm, it sounds as if he thinks that the only places where sidewalks are routed are in front of businesses. Around where I live I can travel less than a block in any area and NOT encounter a business where a cyclist operating on the sidewalk would endanger a patron exiting a business. Most if not all of the sidewalks are in front of homes with a full front yard between the sidewalk and the house. So no danger to anyone stepping out of their home.

With the possible exception of the downtown area there are very few areas where the sidewalks are "right" in front of a business putting a patron in risk of being hit by a cyclist operating on the sidewalk.

So again he is making assumptions and broad statements that in no way reflect the conditions that a lot of us are familiar with. Now if we wanted we could make certain presumptions about him based on both his screen name and his avatar. . .

AlmostTrick

You grossly underestimate the importance some drivers and law officers give to the "not impeding traffic" rules... even when the delay is minimal or non existent AND the supposed "impeders" are behaving within the law.

Besides, aren't officers called or dispatched for backup duty?

Digital_Cowboy

And the irony is that several states have had court cases settled in favor of a cyclists and other naturally "slow moving" vehicles that have clearly stated that a vehicle traveling at a speed that is reasonable for it's type cannot be cited for impeding traffic. Yet, sadly that doesn't stop LEOs from harassing cyclists for "impeding" traffic.

And as just about everyone here has said and agreed with this trooper had some sort of grudge or ax to grind with cyclists. And I don't know if the call that came over his radio was related to his brother or sister in blue going past him, but it did sound as if he received some sort of call while he was writing the ticket.

It'd still be nice to learn what happened to him, the prosecutor and the judge from the original court hearing. As he deserves a reprimand, the prosecutor needs to be disciplined and possibly being disbarred, and the judge needs to also be disciplined and/or voted off of the bench if he's an elected official.