Is too much safety concern holding back biking?
06-19-16, 06:07 AM
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No, it's not the safety factor, but many will use this as an excuse.
Laziness is what holds back cycling. That's been my experience with all the people I've tried to get into cycling. They start out really strong, but it fades over time.
Really no different than all those gym memberships that start up after a New Year's resolution, they start out strong and motivated, but within six months very few of them are still at it.
Laziness is what holds back cycling. That's been my experience with all the people I've tried to get into cycling. They start out really strong, but it fades over time.
Really no different than all those gym memberships that start up after a New Year's resolution, they start out strong and motivated, but within six months very few of them are still at it.
06-19-16, 06:29 AM
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I stopped reading right there. You're one of those people that think it's OK that white males are not allowed in some college diversity meeting groups, etc...or carry some amount of 'white guilt' for something. I shouldn't have even responded, and I don't intend to check back to see if I'm responded to.
Go vote for Hillary and enjoy your gender-neutral bathrooms while you sip your frapachino at Starbucks.
Go vote for Hillary and enjoy your gender-neutral bathrooms while you sip your frapachino at Starbucks.
06-19-16, 07:22 AM
#29
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?
if a scene gets too narrow it doesn't last
if it gets too serious it loses appeal
no matter what, it has to recruit and replace itself or it certainly won't last
if a scene gets too narrow it doesn't last
if it gets too serious it loses appeal
no matter what, it has to recruit and replace itself or it certainly won't last
06-19-16, 07:44 AM
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It too bad that people will set home because others have convinced them it is too dangerous to go out and ride.
06-19-16, 09:22 AM
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Just calculate what the average young (20-35 years old WITH money to spend) person spends on a smartphone, internet connection, and the Unaffordable Care Act health insurance. There is your outdoor recreational budget shot to Hell for most people, even people without children.
Also many sports rely on automotive transportation to get to trail-heads or other rural destinations. Man, there are a million activities I love to do, but the trade-off of owning and caring for a car (and maybe a boat) is just not worth it to me, and I don't even have a smart phone or play video games. I do have expensive health care and internet connection, which does not break the budget, but a dependable, "vacation-worthy" automobile would crush me financially.
Kayaking, fishing, hunting, canoeing, day hiking, backpacking, beach combing, birdwatching, etc., are all things I love to do, and used to participate often. Life is full of trade-offs.
I also believe that YouTube generates a lot of fear of the outdoors. Just my opinion, not sure if it has any actual effect on folks getting interested in outdoor pursuits.
Certainly the last financial crash (Big Bank Burglary) and the fleecing of the middle class once again with mandatory and high health insurance costs combined with still needing a ton of cash on hand if you get really sick, has pretty much emptied the pockets of the potential outdoor demographic in the USA. Other than team sports of course paid for by parents who are often living their "outdoor life" vicariously through their kids.
Also many sports rely on automotive transportation to get to trail-heads or other rural destinations. Man, there are a million activities I love to do, but the trade-off of owning and caring for a car (and maybe a boat) is just not worth it to me, and I don't even have a smart phone or play video games. I do have expensive health care and internet connection, which does not break the budget, but a dependable, "vacation-worthy" automobile would crush me financially.
Kayaking, fishing, hunting, canoeing, day hiking, backpacking, beach combing, birdwatching, etc., are all things I love to do, and used to participate often. Life is full of trade-offs.
I also believe that YouTube generates a lot of fear of the outdoors. Just my opinion, not sure if it has any actual effect on folks getting interested in outdoor pursuits.
Certainly the last financial crash (Big Bank Burglary) and the fleecing of the middle class once again with mandatory and high health insurance costs combined with still needing a ton of cash on hand if you get really sick, has pretty much emptied the pockets of the potential outdoor demographic in the USA. Other than team sports of course paid for by parents who are often living their "outdoor life" vicariously through their kids.
Last edited by JoeyBike; 06-19-16 at 09:25 AM.
06-19-16, 09:27 AM
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I have a friend who is a surgeon. He USED to be a terrific skateboarder. Now he is worried about damaging his hands, breaking an arm, etc. It sucks to grow up. I doubt I will ever try it.
06-19-16, 10:54 AM
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No, it's not the safety factor, but many will use this as an excuse.
Laziness is what holds back cycling. That's been my experience with all the people I've tried to get into cycling. They start out really strong, but it fades over time.
Really no different than all those gym memberships that start up after a New Year's resolution, they start out strong and motivated, but within six months very few of them are still at it.
Laziness is what holds back cycling. That's been my experience with all the people I've tried to get into cycling. They start out really strong, but it fades over time.
Really no different than all those gym memberships that start up after a New Year's resolution, they start out strong and motivated, but within six months very few of them are still at it.
I know that time and time again I "gave up" on bike commuting after a particular harrowing incident... and bear in mind I have been hit three times.
The love of cycling always brought me back into it.
06-19-16, 10:57 AM
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Maybe I should have remembered to insert a little smiley face 
as parts of the post were intended as serious-humor.
On the bike paths and local streets... I see cyclist and joggers that are mostly old men (like myself) and MUCH younger women. It appears that interest in outside activity's does not appeal to young men. And... as a former young man... I can relate to and understand that.
as parts of the post were intended as serious-humor. On the bike paths and local streets... I see cyclist and joggers that are mostly old men (like myself) and MUCH younger women. It appears that interest in outside activity's does not appeal to young men. And... as a former young man... I can relate to and understand that.
06-19-16, 11:17 AM
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Maybe I should have remembered to insert a little smiley face as parts of the post were intended as serious-humor.
On the bike paths and local streets... I see cyclist and joggers that are mostly old men (like myself) and MUCH younger women. It appears that interest in outside activity's does not appeal to young men. And... as a former young man... I can relate to and understand that.
as parts of the post were intended as serious-humor. On the bike paths and local streets... I see cyclist and joggers that are mostly old men (like myself) and MUCH younger women. It appears that interest in outside activity's does not appeal to young men. And... as a former young man... I can relate to and understand that.
06-19-16, 11:55 AM
#38
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Mountain Biking often involves some serious *downhill* riding, with unexpected logs or boulders blocking the path. That's why the helmets...
06-19-16, 12:34 PM
#39
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Re-reading your OP, I don't see any mention of Bike Lanes. Nor did you once mention LED lighting, or Rear-View Mirrors.
Body Armor? WTF? I never heard of it. Okay, I have heard of body armor, and now I looked at your profile, and I see you're from Michigan...
Forget body armor, what about a chain-guard? If everyone had to have a chainguard, 98% of bicycles would be legislated off the road...
Bicycle safety is very faddish . Helmets seem to be an obsession , while other types of safety gear are ignored .
I have recently told a few people that my LED (12 volt) Lighting System "costs more than the Bike is worth"... And that shut them up, whatever they were raving about...
Let me make a brief statement about our design philosophy;
IF we start with a certain class of Cargo Bicycle, it will be easier to install a Fairing, and convert that bike into a Velomobile.
We have Not gone fully Recumbent, though some of our Prototypes are "Semi-Recumbent".
IF you are inside a Velomobile Fairing, you are already enclosed in ARMOR, and you can withstand wiping-out without road-rash, and even survive a hit by a car (or a pickup truck, according to other accounts).
Carbon Fiber costs 70 times more than Fiberglass, and Fiberglass costs 50 times more than Coroplast™ (brand of Polypropylene, in board-form) .
2) I have never understood why we can't get a Dutch Cargo Bike, and use it as a Touring Bike, which you alluded too: Bicycle Touring involves Camping. Outdoor Sports have declined, there are fewer Camp-Grounds...
3) At this point I will insert a few photographs to show the progress of the work (I just got back from a 12.5 mile ride on this bike):
Re-reading your OP, I don't see any mention of Bike Lanes. Nor did you once mention LED lighting, or Rear-View Mirrors.
Body Armor? WTF? I never heard of it. Okay, I have heard of body armor, and now I looked at your profile, and I see you're from Michigan...
Forget body armor, what about a chain-guard? If everyone had to have a chainguard, 98% of bicycles would be legislated off the road...
Bicycle safety is very faddish . Helmets seem to be an obsession , while other types of safety gear are ignored .
I have recently told a few people that my LED (12 volt) Lighting System "costs more than the Bike is worth"... And that shut them up, whatever they were raving about...
Let me make a brief statement about our design philosophy;
IF we start with a certain class of Cargo Bicycle, it will be easier to install a Fairing, and convert that bike into a Velomobile.
We have Not gone fully Recumbent, though some of our Prototypes are "Semi-Recumbent".
IF you are inside a Velomobile Fairing, you are already enclosed in ARMOR, and you can withstand wiping-out without road-rash, and even survive a hit by a car (or a pickup truck, according to other accounts).
Carbon Fiber costs 70 times more than Fiberglass, and Fiberglass costs 50 times more than Coroplast™ (brand of Polypropylene, in board-form) .
2) I have never understood why we can't get a Dutch Cargo Bike, and use it as a Touring Bike, which you alluded too: Bicycle Touring involves Camping. Outdoor Sports have declined, there are fewer Camp-Grounds...
Body Armor? WTF? I never heard of it. Okay, I have heard of body armor, and now I looked at your profile, and I see you're from Michigan...
Forget body armor, what about a chain-guard? If everyone had to have a chainguard, 98% of bicycles would be legislated off the road...
Bicycle safety is very faddish . Helmets seem to be an obsession , while other types of safety gear are ignored .
I have recently told a few people that my LED (12 volt) Lighting System "costs more than the Bike is worth"... And that shut them up, whatever they were raving about...
Let me make a brief statement about our design philosophy;
IF we start with a certain class of Cargo Bicycle, it will be easier to install a Fairing, and convert that bike into a Velomobile.
We have Not gone fully Recumbent, though some of our Prototypes are "Semi-Recumbent".
IF you are inside a Velomobile Fairing, you are already enclosed in ARMOR, and you can withstand wiping-out without road-rash, and even survive a hit by a car (or a pickup truck, according to other accounts).
Carbon Fiber costs 70 times more than Fiberglass, and Fiberglass costs 50 times more than Coroplast™ (brand of Polypropylene, in board-form) .
2) I have never understood why we can't get a Dutch Cargo Bike, and use it as a Touring Bike, which you alluded too: Bicycle Touring involves Camping. Outdoor Sports have declined, there are fewer Camp-Grounds...
3) At this point I will insert a few photographs to show the progress of the work (I just got back from a 12.5 mile ride on this bike):
Re-reading your OP, I don't see any mention of Bike Lanes. Nor did you once mention LED lighting, or Rear-View Mirrors.
Body Armor? WTF? I never heard of it. Okay, I have heard of body armor, and now I looked at your profile, and I see you're from Michigan...
Forget body armor, what about a chain-guard? If everyone had to have a chainguard, 98% of bicycles would be legislated off the road...
Bicycle safety is very faddish . Helmets seem to be an obsession , while other types of safety gear are ignored .
I have recently told a few people that my LED (12 volt) Lighting System "costs more than the Bike is worth"... And that shut them up, whatever they were raving about...
Let me make a brief statement about our design philosophy;
IF we start with a certain class of Cargo Bicycle, it will be easier to install a Fairing, and convert that bike into a Velomobile.
We have Not gone fully Recumbent, though some of our Prototypes are "Semi-Recumbent".
IF you are inside a Velomobile Fairing, you are already enclosed in ARMOR, and you can withstand wiping-out without road-rash, and even survive a hit by a car (or a pickup truck, according to other accounts).
Carbon Fiber costs 70 times more than Fiberglass, and Fiberglass costs 50 times more than Coroplast™ (brand of Polypropylene, in board-form) .
2) I have never understood why we can't get a Dutch Cargo Bike, and use it as a Touring Bike, which you alluded too: Bicycle Touring involves Camping. Outdoor Sports have declined, there are fewer Camp-Grounds...
(I posted this to the Helmet Thread but maybe it's bigger than that.)
Outdoor sport in general is in decline.
Many aspects of outdoor sport seem to suffer from "bro -ism." A macho attitude and expectation of extremeness. Common among young white rich men. This reduces the potential attractiveness to other demographics. Which causes a downward feedback spiral. For instance, if women don't do something then some men are less likely to since socializing is often a component. Male-bonding is a powerful factor but it might not always be enough.
Then there's the Type A style that much modern outdoor sports marketing seems to have. This only appeals to that one demographic.
Then there's the Gear Fetish syndrome that marketers encourage in outdoor activity -- again, only appeals to a limited demographic.
Next, there might even be a sort of socially-inept embarrassment of a nerd-ish character verging on conspiracy-theory where there are demographic appeals to HUGELY changing the appearance of an activity (via helmet, lycra, terribly garish graphic design, aero-sunglasses, clicky shoes) to achieve a tiny theoretical benefit for most who adopt the protocol. What kind of person does this appeal to? ("I wear a tinfoil hat because someone MIGHT be trying to steal my brainwaves. I don't want to take that small risk over such an important thing to me.")
In many places the decline in outdoor activity is not just marginal but it is TOTAL. I've seen quite a few big bike, ski and paddling scenes where there is near ZERO replacement of the demographic. The group members are now often in their 60's and their events appeal to very few new users. So that in ten years the activity and organization will disappear. So we're not talking just fine-tuning here. But a total age-out.
It seems useful to encourage outdoor sport to be popular among ALL possible demographics.
Where is outdoor sport showing potential? What kind of people can it reach out to that it is not right now?
Yes, I see some types of big, extreme events becoming popular. But I also see casual urban Bike Parties catching on everywhere.
Offhand, I'd suggest that we shouldn't overlook: youth, women, minorities, lower income, casual dabblers.
What does a culture of ARMORING do to an activity?
Armoring usually relates to safety but it has components of power, mastery, gear-fetish, aggressiveness, plus an appeal to geekish theoretical risk avoidance. These relate to the resulting appeal to various demographics.
For instance, one area that many cyclists automatically give over to helmets is mt-biking. They might say "I don't always wear a helmet when I ride around the block to the grocery store, but I *always* wear one when mt-biking." The implication is "because when mt-biking I'm then going fast around rocks and trees and could more easily fall and hit my head." ...What if a kind of mt-biking that was slow and lollygagging was encouraged? On mellow trails, just to spend some time in the woods, to go for a picnic. Would that kind appeal to anyone? What kind of gear would be needed for it? ...Probably a very simple bike and no other special gear except a rack and picnic basket.
I also note that mt-biking is suffering from a decline, at least in some places. Why? Is it perhaps due to too much emphasis on the limited demographics of "macho performance"? What could be done to increase its appeal? Could other demographics become interested?
It might be that all types of biking, and maybe especially mt-biking, could become more popular if they were more open and accessible. What if GOING SLOW AND CASUAL AND SIMPLE were encouraged? What if all kinds of biking included marketing tied in with PICNICKING rather than just "performance."
It might be that to save our sports that we should give up on gaining tiny fractions of life-saving in trade for large gains in appeal and re-connection with the bulk of REALITY.
If someone is a bumbler or knows they tend to be awkward, let them buy all the armor they like. Don't stare at them, though. And don't try to push it on most folks.
Outdoor sport in general is in decline.
Many aspects of outdoor sport seem to suffer from "bro -ism." A macho attitude and expectation of extremeness. Common among young white rich men. This reduces the potential attractiveness to other demographics. Which causes a downward feedback spiral. For instance, if women don't do something then some men are less likely to since socializing is often a component. Male-bonding is a powerful factor but it might not always be enough.
Then there's the Type A style that much modern outdoor sports marketing seems to have. This only appeals to that one demographic.
Then there's the Gear Fetish syndrome that marketers encourage in outdoor activity -- again, only appeals to a limited demographic.
Next, there might even be a sort of socially-inept embarrassment of a nerd-ish character verging on conspiracy-theory where there are demographic appeals to HUGELY changing the appearance of an activity (via helmet, lycra, terribly garish graphic design, aero-sunglasses, clicky shoes) to achieve a tiny theoretical benefit for most who adopt the protocol. What kind of person does this appeal to? ("I wear a tinfoil hat because someone MIGHT be trying to steal my brainwaves. I don't want to take that small risk over such an important thing to me.")
In many places the decline in outdoor activity is not just marginal but it is TOTAL. I've seen quite a few big bike, ski and paddling scenes where there is near ZERO replacement of the demographic. The group members are now often in their 60's and their events appeal to very few new users. So that in ten years the activity and organization will disappear. So we're not talking just fine-tuning here. But a total age-out.
It seems useful to encourage outdoor sport to be popular among ALL possible demographics.
Where is outdoor sport showing potential? What kind of people can it reach out to that it is not right now?
Yes, I see some types of big, extreme events becoming popular. But I also see casual urban Bike Parties catching on everywhere.
Offhand, I'd suggest that we shouldn't overlook: youth, women, minorities, lower income, casual dabblers.
What does a culture of ARMORING do to an activity?
Armoring usually relates to safety but it has components of power, mastery, gear-fetish, aggressiveness, plus an appeal to geekish theoretical risk avoidance. These relate to the resulting appeal to various demographics.
For instance, one area that many cyclists automatically give over to helmets is mt-biking. They might say "I don't always wear a helmet when I ride around the block to the grocery store, but I *always* wear one when mt-biking." The implication is "because when mt-biking I'm then going fast around rocks and trees and could more easily fall and hit my head." ...What if a kind of mt-biking that was slow and lollygagging was encouraged? On mellow trails, just to spend some time in the woods, to go for a picnic. Would that kind appeal to anyone? What kind of gear would be needed for it? ...Probably a very simple bike and no other special gear except a rack and picnic basket.
I also note that mt-biking is suffering from a decline, at least in some places. Why? Is it perhaps due to too much emphasis on the limited demographics of "macho performance"? What could be done to increase its appeal? Could other demographics become interested?
It might be that all types of biking, and maybe especially mt-biking, could become more popular if they were more open and accessible. What if GOING SLOW AND CASUAL AND SIMPLE were encouraged? What if all kinds of biking included marketing tied in with PICNICKING rather than just "performance."
It might be that to save our sports that we should give up on gaining tiny fractions of life-saving in trade for large gains in appeal and re-connection with the bulk of REALITY.
If someone is a bumbler or knows they tend to be awkward, let them buy all the armor they like. Don't stare at them, though. And don't try to push it on most folks.
06-19-16, 12:35 PM
#40
Senior Member
06-19-16, 12:39 PM
#41
Senior Member
IMG_4162 by AviationMetalSmith, on FlickrA Warning Sticker on the Fairing, stating that "This Protective Shield may NOT be capable of withstanding impacts greater than 5MPH"
With all these idiots thinking they should wear ARMOR on their bodies, rather than ride inside an ARMORED Vehicle, the General Public is going to get completely confused.
IMG_4161 by AviationMetalSmith, on FlickrFARM TRIANGLE. Enhanced with Red LED Lighting Strips. As I said, The Lighting System Costs MORE than The Bike is Worth...
06-19-16, 01:01 PM
#42
Senior Member
IMG_4162 by AviationMetalSmith, on FlickrThe Headlights, as they appear in the DAYTIME.
Motorcycles are Required to have their Headlights on in the Daytime,
And I believe Bicycles should too.
Yes, people are bailing at this point, maybe some people can NOT afford $415.97 for a Lighting System , to add to their $79.99 Wal-Mart Bike, LOL
Too many people think of Bicycling as a pastoral activity, a nostalgic reminisce .
My opinion is that people have to think about Money, and especially to PLAN their pregnancies, so that every child can have a Bicycle.
It's a shame that children are growing up without experiencing bike riding as a regular activity.
There needs to be more handing-down of quality bicycles, from brother to brother, sister to sister, because a good bike can last fifty years , and it's a shame to throw it out after a few summers of use.
Thrift Stores should help recycle bicycles...
IMG_3789 by AviationMetalSmith, on FlickrHere's a Photograph showing the actual Cargo Platform . This Is what makes this bike Cargo Bike. The Aerodynamic Fairing was added later.
With THIS Safety Device, I am protected from cars that cut me off.
NO, to answer your OP Question, Too Much safety concern is NOT holding back biking...
The complete OPPOSITE:
A lack of safety concern is holding back biking. As evidenced by the fact that you can hardly find a decent Cargo Bike anywhere.
If a car hits a Cargo Bike, the car is Totaled, worse off than if it hit a deer or a moose.
I would advise that there may be a strong correlation between Dutch Bicycle Safety and Dutch Cargo Bikes.
Once you have a fleet of Cargo Bikes, the Bike Lanes are just icing on the cake.
06-19-16, 01:43 PM
#43
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@JeffOYB I completely agree with your original post but cringed to see you post it in A&S where all you can hope to get in response is the snarky comments of people that are already sure they know everything. As a snowboarder I have seen that novices have a great amount of trepidation getting into the sport. Some are scared of what the gear will cost and sacred that they will get the wrong gear or that they will use it incorrectly. They're not too far off base in these fears if you look at magazines like Powder that poke fun at the folks they call "Jerrys" for wearing their helmets backwards or too high on their heads. They poke fun at people that ride short skis even though they are easier to learn on. Novices watch YouTube videos to try and learn the skills necessary to ride a snowboard. The videos often include some extreme element making it seem very dangerous just to walk onto the mountain. And professional lessons are too expensive for the average novice to justify. And there is the stigma of trying to learn on the bunny hill. It's right in front of the lodge (usually) and full of little kids so if you're not good there will be plenty of people to laugh at you.
I see the same thing here on Bike Forums where there are frequent threads making fun of "Freds" for wearing something the group has deemed inappropriate or made some modification to their bike in a way the group thinks is stupid. There is just so little room to be yourself in these groups. I see the attitude when I ride locally where people have given me flack for things like using a triple crankset when I was first getting back into biking even though it is quite hilly where I live. I experienced the know-it-all atitude of other cyclists when I was riding my mountain bike last Friday on dirt roads. I had forgotten my helmet but decided to ride anyway, knowing I would be on dirt fire roads where the risk of crashing was small and the risk of hitting my head was also small. Pretty much everyone I rode past said something like "nice helmet". I was hit by cars twice as a kid before anyone wore helmets. One of those times hitting my head on a concrete curb, I survived just fine.
I don't know what the answer is. All I have been able to do is try to reach out to people that I know are just starting out and encourage them. Give them pointers and constructive advice to make sure they stay engaged. I also tell them about gear exchanges and co-ops where they can get their stuff cheaper and talk to them about trying to make plans collectively to spread the expense. I never cared what others think of me so I guess it's easier if you think like that. I love the idea of trying to slow it down and make it more inclusive but I think its something that has to be done locally. You won't convince too many on a cyclist forum that this is a good direction. As you can see by the first 3 replies to your post you won't be convincing anyone in the Advocacy and Safety forum of this anytime soon. Get involved with your local co-op or start a local group ride with the goal of being inclusive and taking it slow to enjoy the view.
I see the same thing here on Bike Forums where there are frequent threads making fun of "Freds" for wearing something the group has deemed inappropriate or made some modification to their bike in a way the group thinks is stupid. There is just so little room to be yourself in these groups. I see the attitude when I ride locally where people have given me flack for things like using a triple crankset when I was first getting back into biking even though it is quite hilly where I live. I experienced the know-it-all atitude of other cyclists when I was riding my mountain bike last Friday on dirt roads. I had forgotten my helmet but decided to ride anyway, knowing I would be on dirt fire roads where the risk of crashing was small and the risk of hitting my head was also small. Pretty much everyone I rode past said something like "nice helmet". I was hit by cars twice as a kid before anyone wore helmets. One of those times hitting my head on a concrete curb, I survived just fine.
I don't know what the answer is. All I have been able to do is try to reach out to people that I know are just starting out and encourage them. Give them pointers and constructive advice to make sure they stay engaged. I also tell them about gear exchanges and co-ops where they can get their stuff cheaper and talk to them about trying to make plans collectively to spread the expense. I never cared what others think of me so I guess it's easier if you think like that. I love the idea of trying to slow it down and make it more inclusive but I think its something that has to be done locally. You won't convince too many on a cyclist forum that this is a good direction. As you can see by the first 3 replies to your post you won't be convincing anyone in the Advocacy and Safety forum of this anytime soon. Get involved with your local co-op or start a local group ride with the goal of being inclusive and taking it slow to enjoy the view.
06-19-16, 02:47 PM
#44
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@JeffOYB I completely agree with your original post but cringed to see you post it in A&S where all you can hope to get in response is the snarky comments of people that are already sure they know everything. As a snowboarder I have seen that novices have a great amount of trepidation getting into the sport. Some are scared of what the gear will cost and sacred that they will get the wrong gear or that they will use it incorrectly. They're not too far off base in these fears if you look at magazines like Powder that poke fun at the folks they call "Jerrys" for wearing their helmets backwards or too high on their heads. They poke fun at people that ride short skis even though they are easier to learn on. Novices watch YouTube videos to try and learn the skills necessary to ride a snowboard. The videos often include some extreme element making it seem very dangerous just to walk onto the mountain. And professional lessons are too expensive for the average novice to justify. And there is the stigma of trying to learn on the bunny hill. It's right in front of the lodge (usually) and full of little kids so if you're not good there will be plenty of people to laugh at you.
I see the same thing here on Bike Forums where there are frequent threads making fun of "Freds" for wearing something the group has deemed inappropriate or made some modification to their bike in a way the group thinks is stupid. There is just so little room to be yourself in these groups. I see the attitude when I ride locally where people have given me flack for things like using a triple crankset when I was first getting back into biking even though it is quite hilly where I live. I experienced the know-it-all atitude of other cyclists when I was riding my mountain bike last Friday on dirt roads. I had forgotten my helmet but decided to ride anyway, knowing I would be on dirt fire roads where the risk of crashing was small and the risk of hitting my head was also small. Pretty much everyone I rode past said something like "nice helmet". I was hit by cars twice as a kid before anyone wore helmets. One of those times hitting my head on a concrete curb, I survived just fine.
I don't know what the answer is. All I have been able to do is try to reach out to people that I know are just starting out and encourage them. Give them pointers and constructive advice to make sure they stay engaged. I also tell them about gear exchanges and co-ops where they can get their stuff cheaper and talk to them about trying to make plans collectively to spread the expense. I never cared what others think of me so I guess it's easier if you think like that. I love the idea of trying to slow it down and make it more inclusive but I think its something that has to be done locally. You won't convince too many on a cyclist forum that this is a good direction. As you can see by the first 3 replies to your post you won't be convincing anyone in the Advocacy and Safety forum of this anytime soon. Get involved with your local co-op or start a local group ride with the goal of being inclusive and taking it slow to enjoy the view.
I see the same thing here on Bike Forums where there are frequent threads making fun of "Freds" for wearing something the group has deemed inappropriate or made some modification to their bike in a way the group thinks is stupid. There is just so little room to be yourself in these groups. I see the attitude when I ride locally where people have given me flack for things like using a triple crankset when I was first getting back into biking even though it is quite hilly where I live. I experienced the know-it-all atitude of other cyclists when I was riding my mountain bike last Friday on dirt roads. I had forgotten my helmet but decided to ride anyway, knowing I would be on dirt fire roads where the risk of crashing was small and the risk of hitting my head was also small. Pretty much everyone I rode past said something like "nice helmet". I was hit by cars twice as a kid before anyone wore helmets. One of those times hitting my head on a concrete curb, I survived just fine.
I don't know what the answer is. All I have been able to do is try to reach out to people that I know are just starting out and encourage them. Give them pointers and constructive advice to make sure they stay engaged. I also tell them about gear exchanges and co-ops where they can get their stuff cheaper and talk to them about trying to make plans collectively to spread the expense. I never cared what others think of me so I guess it's easier if you think like that. I love the idea of trying to slow it down and make it more inclusive but I think its something that has to be done locally. You won't convince too many on a cyclist forum that this is a good direction. As you can see by the first 3 replies to your post you won't be convincing anyone in the Advocacy and Safety forum of this anytime soon. Get involved with your local co-op or start a local group ride with the goal of being inclusive and taking it slow to enjoy the view.
My EYES!!!!
06-19-16, 03:33 PM
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. But that would be my expectation as well. But it just isn't the case in my experience on local paths and streets. I am sure there is more at play than just video games and drug use. But I don't think young men are avoiding cycling out of fear of injury. Maybe... since many mothers are very hesitant to allow their children to ride bikes. Maybe... more adult young men don't know how to bicycle than we would guess. I have been approached by young women who were interested in "learning how to ride a bike". Maybe young men who can't (don't know how to) ride a bike... chose to play hoops. I did see several young men on a basketball court I rode my bike pass today.
06-19-16, 03:52 PM
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@JeffOYB...... As a snowboarder I have seen that novices have a great amount of trepidation getting into the sport. ..... if you look at magazines like Powder that poke fun at the folks they call "Jerrys" for wearing their helmets backwards or too high on their heads....
I don't know what the answer is. All I have been able to do is try to reach out to people that I know are just starting out and encourage them. Give them pointers and constructive advice to make sure they stay engaged....
I don't know what the answer is. All I have been able to do is try to reach out to people that I know are just starting out and encourage them. Give them pointers and constructive advice to make sure they stay engaged....
No one has the answer... as to how to popularize a sport... or much of anything else. Cycling (and other sports) popularity has always gone up and down in cycles. I believe cycling will be around for centuries! But it may never again be like it was (more than half a century ago) when I was a kid.
06-19-16, 04:43 PM
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BTW, I've also been hit three times, once by a car and twice by a pickup and there was never a break in my riding, got right back on the horse, so to speak. Although, an accident I had a couple years ago really shook me up and it didn't even involve a vehicle, but I'm not sure how one didn't hit me, given that I was hurled out into the middle of the road in rush hour traffic. But still I kept riding.
06-19-16, 09:15 PM
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@JeffOYB I completely agree with your original post but cringed to see you post it in A&S where all you can hope to get in response is the snarky comments of people that are already sure they know everything.
[Snip]
As you can see by the first 3 replies to your post you won't be convincing anyone in the Advocacy and Safety forum of this anytime soon. Get involved with your local co-op or start a local group ride with the goal of being inclusive and taking it slow to enjoy the view.
[Snip]
As you can see by the first 3 replies to your post you won't be convincing anyone in the Advocacy and Safety forum of this anytime soon. Get involved with your local co-op or start a local group ride with the goal of being inclusive and taking it slow to enjoy the view.
06-19-16, 11:04 PM
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Thanks @I-Like-To-Bike! A&S for the win when it comes to sanctimonious BS!