canklecat

A&S = Argument & Sarcasm forum.

BobbyG

Don't ride like you're invisible...ride like they CAN see you and they WANT to kill you.

longbeachgary

Donald? Is that you?

Leisesturm

Speaking only for myself, I responded only to the irony of a poster calling themselves dr. logic... making a totally illogical and hyperbolic fail of a postulate. I for one NEVER use a light in the daylight hours. It has not been lost on me that, when they want to, drivers can see a black cat, darting out from under a black car, against blacktop, in the rain, at night, and react appropriately. In the daytime a high-viz jersey or jacket offers much more visibility than most lights and leaves another hour of run-time in my battery for the next nights ride. YMMV.

drlogik 

I know that was meant partly tongue-in-cheek but that's actually pretty darn good advice right there.

lostarchitect 

Don't take it too personally, there are a lot of people in this forum that will tell you that you are wrong and bad no matter what you post.

nitroRoo

Despite the controversy on almost every thread, it's still worth posting here. One more person may run a light on their next ride, and you NEVER know if that might have saved their life. Nobody here does.

I rode for years without a light in the daytime. I recently picked up a new light that has a strobe function that will run for 50 hours. So I run it. I definitely noticed a drop off in people pulling out in front of me or turning left. I can see the drivers notice the light, process that it's a bicycle, and then hesitate and eventually wait for me to go by. In contrast without a light they'd notice me later and then try to beat me all the time. I regularly had to slow down for a car pulling out of a driveway, thankfully never had too many close calls.

The whole going through a yellow light thing leaves a lot to the imagination so take the criticism with a grain of salt. You came back and clarified that you were 20+mph and at the point of no return when the light changed. That's very different from light changing and then sprinting to try to make it. Would a light have helped you? Maybe... who knows.. there are plenty of videos of cars pulling out or turning in front of semi trucks so some drivers just plain aren't looking or paying attention, and no amount of light or hi-viz clothing will help you there (but defensive riding will).

Maelochs

You are fine, but your post is wrong and bad.

(Sad comment on Internet communication ... I had to wonder if people would see that as humor ... and realized ... probably not.)

rumrunn6

that's the thing about daytime strobes. ppl may giggle, why do you need that? but we need it for that one split second that could end our life

asmac

That's ridiculous and a total distortion of the honest and reasoned debate that goes on here.

lostarchitect 

Shaddap.

howsteepisit

Get real, posters on the A&S forum want nothing but the safest and best practices for all cyclists. ANd we will browbeat you into accepting our vision if needed. Don't be a moron do it my way!

Insidious C. 

meanwhile, back on topic....

I once had a similar experience to OP except it was I on my bike making the left and I had lights on (the oncoming car's lights were not). Because the offending driver followed closely behind another vehicle that did have lights, the second vehicle was virtually invisible to me. Lesson learned is when riding at night just assume someone is out there driving around with lights off. Look for them always.

bulldog1935

thank you

drlogik 

Good general dialog here now. Yes, cycling by nature is risky behavior in my opinion. It doesn't matter if vehicles are involved or not. As a cyclist on both road and trail I try to minimize those risks as much as possible.

For me, I burn lights on the road day or night. For trail? ROFL, anyone have any risk lowering techniques that actually work? I haven't found any yet, other than don't ride on trails.

Milton Keynes

If I had a nickel every time someone said this on bikeforums...

Miele Man

I think that these days distracted driving is much more prevalent than it was years ago. Thus we bicyclists being very vulnerable to being struck by much more massive objects than our bicycle, need to be extra vigilant on the roads (and MUPs) so that we can avoid getting that run down/over feeling. However, please do NOT rely on DLR or blinking lights on bright clear days. Fat too many times experiments show that motorists simply don't see a bright flashing light or if they do they don't recognize it as a bicycle until it's too late. Personally I believe a bright flashing front/rear AMBER light is better as a flashing amber light is universally recognized as a hazard light and warns drivers to avoid hitting whatever the amber light is attached to or near.

At dusk.dawn or in low light conditions a bright flashing light may be seen some distance from the bicycle but only if the driver is attentive and recognizes that they should avoid hitting whateverthe light is on. Research shows too that many people have a great deal of difficulty orare unable to tell at what distance a flashing light white or red is from them. Many drivers also routinely fail to determine the speed of an approaching bicyclist. Put those two together and you get instances of left hooks even in broad daylight.

There's a maneuver I've practiced for emergency left hooks. I lean the bicycle slight to the right and then hit the REAR brake really hard so that the rear wheel skids sideways thereby turning the bicycle to the right and into the same direction the left hooking vehicle is traveling. That maneuver paid off once on a fast downhill run here in town when a car left hooked me as he turned from the main street onto a side street. Instead of hitting that car I was parallel to it. The driver said he didn't think I was going very fast which is why he turned in front of me.

Do NOT depend on drivers seeing you. They might appear to be looking right at you when in actuality they're looking at something behind you and don't see you at all. At intersections watch the vehicle TIRES and look for movement indicating they are coming at you.

Cheers

Maelochs

Perhaps we should start a new forum, "The Armed Cyclist"? I bet a cyclist with an AK-47 slung across his back---even unloaded---would be given wide berth by even the most obnoxious drivers.

CB HI

https://blogs.reuters.com/oddly-enoug...l-this-490.jpg

johnu

I visit Drlogik's state of AZ in the winter months and am disbelief with all the riders we see ascending South Mountain at sunset. They are riding up a narrow winding mountain road with no lights!!! I only went up it once on my Goldwing motorcycle at sunset to tell me it's car only from now on.

trailangel

OK. I add my 2 cents worth.
Don't come to intersection so hot... over 20mph knowing the light may change is too fast.
Don't ride blacked out bikes... black paint, black rims, black spokes.....I hate this trend and I think it's not safe.. can't see the bike.

drlogik 

johnu,

I've heard about South Mountain. In Scottsdale where I "used" to live (we moved away a few months ago) riding with lights was the law, and the police did stop you if you weren't burning lights at "dusk" and "dawn". I wish it were the law where I live now but it isn't.

Maelochs

That's always the toughest call ... having the green and not wanting to kill momentum, versus knowing how many people turn into idiots at intersections.

It's not just that the light might turn yellow (which shouldn't be an issue, anyway ... ) it is the people who will run a light, make an illegal turn, look past a bike and see no cars and decide they can sneak around the corner without waiting ... or who missed the light the last cycle and are just raging inside because they had to sit in a leather easy chair in a climate-controlled room listening tho their favorite toons for an extra 45 seconds ....

That's where the little voice saying "Go for it " is usually not your friend ... but you know that 99% of the time you can blast through the intersection at max speed without a problem .... so you gamble.

Well, I do, sometimes.

rumrunn6

add to that all black ninja clothing

johnu

Thanks, Good to know. We're staying next to the canal in The Colony of Scottsdale this season. I run two in the front and one large red in the back of our bikes.