Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.

User Tag List

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 08-06-02, 08:16 AM   #1
LittleBigMan
Sumanitu taka owaci
Thread Starter
 
LittleBigMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Bikes:
Posts: 8,945
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I hate cars -- no apology

Yesterday, I rode home through some heavily trafficked areas during a "smog-alert day."

Today, I have that sensation like the beginning of bronchitis, in which I have to struggle to suppress a cough a few times a minute.

The air conditioning isn't helping much, either.

I do not apologize for hating what other people's convenient form of transportation is doing to my lungs. Go ahead: call me a "lung-hugger."

I just appreciate breathing fresh air and healthy bronchial tubes.
Gas-powered cars are about the worst invention the world has ever seen. I hate them.

Now electric cars, those are cool...
__________________
No worries
LittleBigMan is offline  
Old 08-06-02, 08:46 AM   #2
morsen
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Seattle, WA
Bikes:
Posts: 60
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Aw, come on. Electric cars will run us over just as often as gas-powered cars.

Wherever it was yesterday that I saw the sentence about simple face masks with "Cars Stink" written in black on them, I think I'm going to make one of those too. Apart from the ambient smog, I get diesel exhaust spewed right in my face several times a day and have to hold my breath, sometimes without having taken a good 'clean' breath in the first place. It is definitely getting a little old.
morsen is offline  
Old 08-06-02, 09:09 AM   #3
surreal
Senior Member
 
surreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: NJ
Bikes:
Posts: 3,084
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
"lung hugger". i'm lovin' that term; mind if i use it, pete?

as for electric cars: these things are only as clean as the electricity that powers them. just b/c the electricity seems to come out of big ol' "outlet" thingie in your garage where there is no pollution doesnt eman it's necessarily clean! round here, most of our electricity comes from nukes. and electric cars run on lots of electricity. powering those things would rely on lots of nuclear power, and while my lungs may(or may not) be ok with that, i'm not into nuclear waste.

to be sure, electric cars are better for air quality than gasoline- or deezle-powered vehicles. but until the majority of civilians begin to take walks/rides for reasonably short distances, we're still gonna be plagued by dirty motorized vehicles. of course, another important step is to plan necessary destinations (shopping, PO, pub<haha>, work, school, etc) within reasonable distances of housing. but everyone already knows that. =)

i work with this kid. he got into some trouble, and his folks are making him ride his dad's bike everywhere. no more rides in the car. anyway, he's leaving work one night, and he wants to go to a convenience store before he goes home. the convenience store is 6 blocks in one direction; his home is 8 in the other direction. the kid cant get a ride home, or he'll be in trouble. so what's he do? he bums a ride off of another coworker to the convenience store and back, leaving just the 8 block ride home. 20 blocks is too much fr him, i guess. it's this kid of thinking that makes cars seem "necessary" for so many ppl. it just makes me sad.

-rob
surreal is offline  
Old 08-06-02, 09:39 AM   #4
Spire
山馬鹿
 
Spire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Fuchu, Tokyo, Japan
Bikes: TREK 1000 and a junk bike with a basket on the front to go to the shops.
Posts: 1,398
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yes, electric cars can cause more pollution than the equivalent gas powered car. But where is that pollution being created. Out at a power plant. Not in a city. It gets the pollution out of the cities. Also, it is easier to enforce a anti-pollution initiative if you have one really big power plant to control rather than millions of little powerplants to control (read cars).
__________________
http://www.cyclistsroadmap.com/eng/ - Cyclists' road map. Checkout which roads are good for cycling and rate roads in your area.
Spire is offline  
Old 08-06-02, 11:11 AM   #5
Jupe
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Bikes: Jamis Quest, Santa Cruz Blu, Miyata Seven Ten (early eighties)
Posts: 109
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally posted by surreal
i work with this kid. he got into some trouble, and his folks are making him ride his dad's bike everywhere. no more rides in the car.
Riding a bike as punishment! Now that's surreal!
Jupe is offline  
Old 08-06-02, 11:13 AM   #6
Feldman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Bikes:
Posts: 863
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
And in addition to "lung hugger," let's add a phrase to slang like "Osama lover" for someone who drives everywhere!
Feldman is offline  
Old 08-07-02, 11:07 AM   #7
Anders K
To infinity and beyond
 
Anders K's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Bikes: Cannondale M600, Crescent 92318, Bianchi Lo Spillone (tandem)
Posts: 421
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I canīt say I hate them, but I dislike them specially when theire drivers donīt behave. Sometimes they can save the life of a cyclist in form of the ambulance. The problem is not the cars and the pollution, itīs peoples attitude towards using theire cars at all times and to all costs (environment). As for electric cars they are as dangerouse in traffic as gasoline cars plus they never will be cleaner then the way the electricity is made. Nuclear powerplant...no thanks.

Anders K
Anders K is offline  
Old 08-07-02, 12:03 PM   #8
nathank
cycle-powered
 
nathank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Munich Germany (formerly Portland OR, Texas)
Bikes: '02 Specialized FSR, '03 RM Slayer, '99 Raleigh R700, '97 Norco hartail, '89 Stumpjumper
Posts: 1,848
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
while pollution is an annoying aspect of motor vehicles, it's not the main problem.

and if we had clean-burning vehicles, autos would still be a problem::

it's how people use them and how they endanger people (and cyclists) and degrade our social space...

so many deaths from auto accidents, parents who won't let their kids walk or bike to school or cross the street because of the danger of getting run over (plus the socially perceived "safety" risk of kidnapping or whatever, but that's another issue)

something like 30% of our public space (i forgot the exact number, but see Asphalt Nation) is devoted to cars: roads, parking, freeways, etc.

automobiles use massive amount of energy, create lots of pollution, AND inconvenience all other users of public space...

cars would truly be a great thing IF they were used in a limited capacity for those things which really require lots of energy or flexible long distance transportation (like Ambulances, police, freight and cargo, etc.)--- but not everyday personal transportation like going to work, the grocery store and the mall when most of the time one or maybe 2 people are riding around in a huge otherwise empty vehicle.
nathank is offline  
Old 08-07-02, 01:21 PM   #9
ngateguy
Center of the Universe
 
ngateguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Everett, WA
Bikes: Bianchi San Remo, Norvara Intrepid MTB , Softride Solo 700
Posts: 4,372
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally posted by Feldman
And in addition to "lung hugger," let's add a phrase to slang like "Osama lover" for someone who drives everywhere!
I was being given a bad time by someone about the fact that my bike was Italian and he drives a good old american ford (hmm made in Canada) then I asked him where he thought the fuel came from and said at least the fuel I run on is home grown!
__________________
Matthew 6
ngateguy is offline  
Old 08-07-02, 03:43 PM   #10
Maelstrom 
Wood Licker
 
Maelstrom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Whistler,BC
Bikes: Transition Dirtbag, Kona Roast 2002 and specialized BMX
Posts: 16,885
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I have never and will never drive a car. No interest. For any and all reasons.
Maelstrom is offline  
Old 08-07-02, 06:43 PM   #11
AndrewP
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Montreal
Bikes: Peugeot Hybrid, Minelli Hybrid
Posts: 6,521
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The nuclear power plants arent as bad as those burning high sulphur coal.
AndrewP is offline  
Old 08-07-02, 07:34 PM   #12
LittleBigMan
Sumanitu taka owaci
Thread Starter
 
LittleBigMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Bikes:
Posts: 8,945
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The way you guys in Europe talk makes me want to move to Europe.

Over here, Cars = Walking. Everyone who would be walking in Europe is driving a car, over in America. Oceans of vehicles.

"Oh, I can't get there. I don't have a CAR."

(Care for some Smog? Just mix exhaust and sunshine/heat. Presto! Chlorine Gas.)

<cough>
__________________
No worries
LittleBigMan is offline  
Old 08-07-02, 10:07 PM   #13
ngateguy
Center of the Universe
 
ngateguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Everett, WA
Bikes: Bianchi San Remo, Norvara Intrepid MTB , Softride Solo 700
Posts: 4,372
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
I don't have the exact figures anymore but I read an article once (I believe US News) that since its invention the automoblie has cost society more money than any other invention before or since. They had it broken down in infrustructure, pollution clean up, heath cost, and legal costs. To add a couple of other things it was mentioned that the power plants outside the city do not add pollution to the city well thats not true pollution is a world wide problem now on a hot sunny day I can barley see Mt Rainer anymore. And one more thing, what people over look the most with electric cars is the batteries disposal is expensive and very very harmful to the enviroment.
__________________
Matthew 6
ngateguy is offline  
Old 08-07-02, 10:37 PM   #14
Dutchy
We drive on the left.
 
Dutchy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Bikes:
Posts: 1,096
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
In the mid 80's there was a TV show (in AUS) called Beyond 2000, it showed all the latest technology available at the time, and a lot of prototype stuff. One story I remember seeing was of an English guy that had converted an old Ferrari to run on water, yep straight old H20, with a slight vapour trail of steam. I guess the oil companies had him taken out, as I have never seen anything about this since.

Is anyone else familiar with this guy's invention?

CHEERS.

Mark
Dutchy is offline  
Old 08-07-02, 10:39 PM   #15
Devster
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: St. Louis Park, Minnesota.
Bikes:
Posts: 137
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Although I must admit, i'm going to get my drivers license soon, I dont think I want to cut back on bicycling. Its very healthy, its quick in traffic, and it helps to somewhat prevent polution. I only want to use a car when its is absolutely necessary (i have to go to Omaha in a couple of weeks). Bicycling is a lot more fun than driving also. I used to be a "little" pudgy, but i'm losing fat, gaining more muscle especially in my legs and I feel really relaxed while I bicycle.
Devster is offline  
Old 08-08-02, 01:12 AM   #16
cyclezealot
Senior Member
 
cyclezealot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Fallbrook,Calif./Palau del Vidre, France
Bikes: Klein QP, Fuji touring, Surly Cross Check, BCH City bike
Posts: 13,166
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 139 Post(s)
I hate auto's because of the way it makes people behave and when out driving in the car anymore, it is a miserable experience. Finally, it detracts from my cycling experience.
The state resists fully funding cycling lanes adjacent highways- maybe when energy crisis' worsen, they could just build us our own,' seperate but equal cycle freeways.
cyclezealot is offline  
Old 08-08-02, 07:01 AM   #17
ngateguy
Center of the Universe
 
ngateguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Everett, WA
Bikes: Bianchi San Remo, Norvara Intrepid MTB , Softride Solo 700
Posts: 4,372
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally posted by cyclezealot
The state resists fully funding cycling lanes adjacent highways- maybe when energy crisis' worsen, they could just build us our own,' seperate but equal cycle freeways.
I would even be willing to pay a user fee/toll for something lkike that by freeway I am 27 miles from work it would take me just over an hour to get to work now if I ride it is 35 miles too many traffic lights so it is almost 2 hours
__________________
Matthew 6
ngateguy is offline  
Old 08-08-02, 07:44 AM   #18
Stor Mand
Senior Member
 
Stor Mand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Massachusetts
Bikes:
Posts: 701
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally posted by Dutchy
snip snip ...I remember seeing was of an English guy that had converted an old Ferrari to run on water, yep straight old H20, with a slight vapour trail of steam. I guess the oil companies had him taken out, as I have never seen anything about this since.
At first thought, it would appear to be a good idea but what would happen if all vehicles emitted a trail of steam? Would we live in a sauna type environment or would it rain everyday? I don't know myself, just posing some questions.
Stor Mand is offline  
Old 08-08-02, 09:49 AM   #19
ngateguy
Center of the Universe
 
ngateguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Everett, WA
Bikes: Bianchi San Remo, Norvara Intrepid MTB , Softride Solo 700
Posts: 4,372
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally posted by Stor Mand


At first thought, it would appear to be a good idea but what would happen if all vehicles emitted a trail of steam? Would we live in a sauna type environment or would it rain everyday? I don't know myself, just posing some questions.
Plus there is a looming water shortage ahead as more people comnsume more water. Case in point I am old enough to remember when there was always snow on the Olympic mountains and the Cascades now in the middle of the summer it is not there. there is no real enviromentaly sane mode of transport wnen it comes to single vehicle use. (except bicycle of course) Mass transit is a help and should be required in all major metropolitan areas (exceot if you cycle)
__________________
Matthew 6
ngateguy is offline  
Old 08-08-02, 09:56 AM   #20
Spire
山馬鹿
 
Spire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Fuchu, Tokyo, Japan
Bikes: TREK 1000 and a junk bike with a basket on the front to go to the shops.
Posts: 1,398
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
A couple years ago many European cities cloesd the downtown cores to all vehicules (read cars/trucks). What if more cities did that more often, but allowed delivery trucks. No cars in downtown area, but buses were allowed in too?
__________________
http://www.cyclistsroadmap.com/eng/ - Cyclists' road map. Checkout which roads are good for cycling and rate roads in your area.
Spire is offline  
Old 08-08-02, 12:46 PM   #21
morsen
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Seattle, WA
Bikes:
Posts: 60
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Gah! Only if, in exchange for the massive favor that would be to the commercial delivery companies, they were required to do everything necessary to clean up their exhaust as well. They are some of the worst polluters out there. ;->
morsen is offline  
Old 08-08-02, 01:09 PM   #22
ngateguy
Center of the Universe
 
ngateguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Everett, WA
Bikes: Bianchi San Remo, Norvara Intrepid MTB , Softride Solo 700
Posts: 4,372
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
remember comercial deleveries are the ones tha deliver your food, bikes, parts clothing etc etc and of course busses no privat autos maybe scooters
__________________
Matthew 6
ngateguy is offline  
Old 08-08-02, 02:34 PM   #23
cyclezealot
Senior Member
 
cyclezealot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Fallbrook,Calif./Palau del Vidre, France
Bikes: Klein QP, Fuji touring, Surly Cross Check, BCH City bike
Posts: 13,166
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 139 Post(s)
I really approve of the mayor of Paris, France. He is a bicycle fanatic. He has succeeded in closing down highways including the expressway adjacent the Seine to auto traffic and letting cyclists and skateboarders take over and ban the dam auto's. Like to make him governor of California. I'd like to see highway 1 adjacent to Big Sur used for bicycles only on Sunday mornings. Way to go Mayor..
cyclezealot is offline  
Old 08-08-02, 03:20 PM   #24
morsen
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Seattle, WA
Bikes:
Posts: 60
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
ngateguy, did the end of your message get garbled? I didn't understand the last part. ["of course busses no privat autos maybe scooters"]

Yes, I know they supply the needs of the metropolis, but they have enjoyed decades of massive subsidies. They also deserve an inordinate amount of the blame for the poor air quality of out cities, compared to modern private automobiles. They should be forced to update their vehicles.
morsen is offline  
Old 08-08-02, 08:25 PM   #25
JDP
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Dallas, TX
Bikes:
Posts: 211
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally posted by Dutchy
In the mid 80's there was a TV show (in AUS) called Beyond 2000, it showed all the latest technology available at the time, and a lot of prototype stuff. One story I remember seeing was of an English guy that had converted an old Ferrari to run on water, yep straight old H20, with a slight vapour trail of steam. I guess the oil companies had him taken out, as I have never seen anything about this since.

Is anyone else familiar with this guy's invention?

CHEERS.

Mark
I used to love Beyond 2000 but I never saw that episode. I have heard many rumors about miracle inventions being buried by big corporations but I'm skeptical.
JDP is offline  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:29 AM.