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  1. #1
    2 Wheel Junkie
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    Two Cyclists' Deaths in Los Angeles

    Cyclists' Deaths Point to PCH Perils


    The breathtaking views on the Pacific Coast Highway carry risks for cyclists, who ride in the sea breeze at considerable peril as cars on the narrow road zoom by.

    On Saturday morning, a catering truck hit two cyclists, who had been forced off the northbound shoulder and onto the road by a construction project. The driver did not stop immediately after hitting the men, who died soon after being airlifted to UCLA Medical Center.

    Rest of article in the following link:
    http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la...nes-california

  2. #2
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    This is a rare rear-ender, which could have been prevented by the use of rear view mirrors by the bicyclists. Condolences to the family.
    Given the majority's ruling, the only safe bicycle in Illinois is a stationary exercise bike located in one's home or at the gym. ----Illinois State Supreme Court, Boub V Wayne

  3. #3
    Senior Member Keith99's Avatar
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    Just so people can place this one. It is on PCH just North of Peperdine. Normally a prety good section of road, reasonable shoulder. It has been a while since I've been out there, but there was not a bike lane and I doubt there is one now.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Keith99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barenakedbiker
    This is a rare rear-ender, which could have been prevented by the use of rear view mirrors by the bicyclists.
    How? Long section of road with no where to go to get out of the way. Not much one can do all mirrors would have done is let them see death coming.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keith99
    How? Long section of road with no where to go to get out of the way. Not much one can do all mirrors would have done is let them see death coming.
    I have ridden that section of PCH. Most of PCH out of Santa Monica is knarly. If you check your rear-view mirror BEFORE you merge off the shoulder and into the regular lanes, you can see traffic coming up your arse, way before it gets nailed.
    Given the majority's ruling, the only safe bicycle in Illinois is a stationary exercise bike located in one's home or at the gym. ----Illinois State Supreme Court, Boub V Wayne

  6. #6
    Senior Member LCI_Brian's Avatar
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    It's hard to tell from the story whether the cyclists waited too late to merge into the traffic lane, or if they had already established position in the traffic lane before getting hit.

  7. #7
    Dominatrikes sbhikes's Avatar
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    ~Diane
    Recumbents: Lightning Thunderbolt, '06 Catrike Pocket. Upright: Trek Mountain Bike.
    8.5 mile commute. I like bike lanes.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbhikes

    Looks like some cute lawyer is gonna make a whole bunch of money from CADOT! The way the construction zone is set up is contributory.

    But, then again, the attoney for the defence, CADOT, will invoke Boub V Wayne. Cyclists shouldn't be on PCH in the first place...blah blah blah.
    Given the majority's ruling, the only safe bicycle in Illinois is a stationary exercise bike located in one's home or at the gym. ----Illinois State Supreme Court, Boub V Wayne

  9. #9
    Cat 6 Wheel-Sucker 2WheelFury's Avatar
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    From what I've heard by some others that ride up that way frequently, the area of the collision is under construction. The company doing the construction work had placed k-rails (commonly called "jersey barriers") RIGHT UP TO the white line on the edge of the road, which they arguably should not have done. Expect a lawsuit against the general contractor for sure.

    Anyway, since there was no shoulder, the cyclist had nowhere to go, with or without a mirror. Since he was likely moving downhill at a reasonable speed, stopping would have been difficult and may have resulted in a crash with him AND the other rider getting injured or run over (those that have ridden in groups will know what I mean).

    So you had a couple of cyclists barreling downhill at moderate to high speed, rounding a curve (where visibility isn't super great to start with), only to get "squeezed" off the shoulder by inappropriately-placed construction barriers. Not good. Add to it the asshat driving the truck who reportedly didn't want to slam on the brakes because there were other guys cooking (yes, COOKING) in the back. This is illegal as hell, for those that don't know.

    Yes, these are the idiots we deal with on a daily basis. Be careful out there people!!!

    Here's the whole story:

    http://www.latimes.com/news/printedi...ck=1&cset=true

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2WheelFury
    From what I've heard by some others that ride up that way frequently, the area of the collision is under construction. The company doing the construction work had placed k-rails (commonly called "jersey barriers") RIGHT UP TO the white line on the edge of the road, which they arguably should not have done. Expect a lawsuit against the general contractor for sure.

    Anyway, since there was no shoulder, the cyclist had nowhere to go, with or without a mirror. Since he was likely moving downhill at a reasonable speed, stopping would have been difficult and may have resulted in a crash with him AND the other rider getting injured or run over (those that have ridden in groups will know what I mean).

    So you had a couple of cyclists barreling downhill at moderate to high speed, rounding a curve (where visibility isn't super great to start with), only to get "squeezed" off the shoulder by inappropriately-placed construction barriers. Not good. Add to it the asshat driving the truck who reportedly didn't want to slam on the brakes because there were other guys cooking (yes, COOKING) in the back. This is illegal as hell, for those that don't know.
    Some cute lawyer for the cyclists' family will make a bunch of money. Hey, someone call Gary Brustin! http://bicyclelawyer.com/bicyclelawyer.com/index.html
    Given the majority's ruling, the only safe bicycle in Illinois is a stationary exercise bike located in one's home or at the gym. ----Illinois State Supreme Court, Boub V Wayne

  11. #11
    Cat 6 Wheel-Sucker 2WheelFury's Avatar
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    Typically barriers are placed to leave a shoulder (might be narrower than normal, but usually SOMETHING is left). If any of the barricades are over the line without having obtained the appropriate permits from Caltrans, the G.C. is f*cked and will possibly be nailed for gross negligance. Either way, the lawyers are going to have a field day with this one.

    Side note, since we're talking about riding safety - even when there IS a shoulder, anytime you have k-rails present at the edge of the road, they just become "junk collectors" and a shoulder strewn with debris can be as big a hazard as anything else. Anyone that rides CA roads with any regularity knows there is WAY too much trash, debris, etc. on the roadsides that never gets picked up. Not to mention the "junk barges" that roll around with crap literally falling out of the back (no tarp, no cover, etc.) It's all too common.

  12. #12
    Banned. Helmet Head's Avatar
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    The article says they were riding side by side, which means at least one of them was pretty far left.

    This guy should get the death penalty as far as I'm concerned.

    Outrageous.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helmet Head

    This guy should get the death penalty as far as I'm concerned.
    Yes. The car driver was certainly wild and crazy and murdered people. But, don't you think the State be held to a higher standard than a lowlife, good-fer-nuthin' wild and crazy car driver?
    Given the majority's ruling, the only safe bicycle in Illinois is a stationary exercise bike located in one's home or at the gym. ----Illinois State Supreme Court, Boub V Wayne

  14. #14
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helmet Head
    The article says they were riding side by side, which means at least one of them was pretty far left.

    This guy should get the death penalty as far as I'm concerned.

    Outrageous.
    What? Are you SURE there wasn't some way that the cyclists could have avoided this...

    Perhaps they did not ensure it was clear far enough back, or perhaps they abruptly pulled out in front of the food truck, perhaps they should have moved further to the left or perhaps their mirrors were dirty, or...

    I donno, I want to see a full investigation before committing to the death penalty... after all the motorist did say "I didn't see them... "

    I guess broad daylight, two cyclists in the middle of the lane, is just not visible, eh?

  15. #15
    Senior Member Cassave's Avatar
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    I ride that section often (last time was 9 days ago). The construction site is along an uphill stretch.
    The driver could have seen riders well far ahead due to the grade. It's quite common to get breezed on PCH due to the speeds, the amount of traffic and the erratic shoulder width. This last Saturday morning
    was foggy at the beach. The driver should have been driving at reduced speed because of the fog, certainly not driving over the limit like the article states. I'm sure I'll get a chill next time I ride that bit of road again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by genec
    What? Are you SURE there wasn't some way that the cyclists could have avoided this...

    Perhaps they did not ensure it was clear far enough back, or perhaps they abruptly pulled out in front of the food truck, perhaps they should have moved further to the left or perhaps their mirrors were dirty, or...

    I donno, I want to see a full investigation before committing to the death penalty... after all the motorist did say "I didn't see them... "

    I guess broad daylight, two cyclists in the middle of the lane, is just not visible, eh?
    This is the classic rear-ender, rare, but could have been avoided by the use or rear-view mirror by the cyclists. But, the fault is with the wild and crazy car driver.
    Given the majority's ruling, the only safe bicycle in Illinois is a stationary exercise bike located in one's home or at the gym. ----Illinois State Supreme Court, Boub V Wayne

  17. #17
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barenakedbiker
    This is the classic rear-ender, rare, but could have been avoided by the use or rear-view mirror by the cyclists. But, the fault is with the wild and crazy car driver.
    Honestly if the cyclists had seen this guy in their mirrors, were would they have gone to avoid the truck? The side of the road was closed, and only the other lane was available. In reality, the truck should have slowed down had the driver been paying attention...

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by genec
    Honestly if the cyclists had seen this guy in their mirrors, were would they have gone to avoid the truck? The side of the road was closed, and only the other lane was available. In reality, the truck should have slowed down had the driver been paying attention...
    The cyclists would have seen the truck long before merging into traffic.
    Given the majority's ruling, the only safe bicycle in Illinois is a stationary exercise bike located in one's home or at the gym. ----Illinois State Supreme Court, Boub V Wayne

  19. #19
    kipuka explorer bkrownd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barenakedbiker
    This is the classic rear-ender, rare, but could have been avoided by the use or rear-view mirror by the cyclists.
    I don't buy the mirror bit. I have two mirrors on my bike, and there just isn't time to safely monitor both the road ahead and traffic behind. The road ahead takes almost constant attention. Even if you catch a glimpse of something coming, by the time it's obvious it's too late to do anything other than clench your butt cheeks and hope.
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  20. #20
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    I don't leave home with a helmet-mounted rear-view. That's right. Bike mounted rear views require a look-down.
    Given the majority's ruling, the only safe bicycle in Illinois is a stationary exercise bike located in one's home or at the gym. ----Illinois State Supreme Court, Boub V Wayne

  21. #21
    Senior Member Cassave's Avatar
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    This section of road is straight, slightly uphill and at present, because of construction, without a shoulder.
    A rear view mirror wouldn't have saved anybody in this case. There is nowhere to go. If the riders were two abreast they were doing the only reasonable thing. They had to take the lane since the shoulder is non-existent for a significant distance.

    You can easily see a single rider 1/2 mile ahead along there if you're paying attention. I'd guess the driver was distracted by something happening in the back of the truck and just gave up on driving for a while.

  22. #22
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barenakedbiker
    The cyclists would have seen the truck long before merging into traffic.
    And a look back couldn't tell them this? Could it be they saw the truck, saw how far back it was and simply assumed that the truck will see them in plenty of time to slow down, so no big deal?

    Not a good course of action frankly. I never assume I am seen. Yes, I do believe cyclists are invisible. No, I don't always act like it, but when I need to make sure I am seen by faster traffic behind me, I signal and wait for something to slow down first. I use that vehicle as a shield between me and anything behind the now slowed vehicle.

    Is that a perfect system... no way.

    The slowed shield vehicle can be plowed into behind them, driving them forward into me. (I have had that happen to me in an auto, so I know it can happen to a cyclist). Motorists behind the slowed shield vehicle can become upset (gee, that never happens) and pull sudden passing moves around the slowed vehicle assuming that there is free space in front... where I am.

    But only depending on mirrors and signals and lane positioning to make one "visible," nah, there is a real fatal flaw in that thinking.

  23. #23
    Don't worry about it!
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    Quote Originally Posted by barenakedbiker
    The cyclists would have seen the truck long before merging into traffic.
    What makes you think they just didn't check their six before getting over? Not having, or having a mirror has nothing to do with this. Give it a rest.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by genec
    But only depending on mirrors and signals and lane positioning to make one "visible," nah, there is a real fatal flaw in that thinking.
    You are right. Rear-view, signals, and positioning doesn't always protect. I would look for a gap in the traffic. Get in front of a slow mover and use him for protection. Car driver who insists on slowly tailgating me at a respectable distance is a good boy. They can honk all they want. But, as long as they are behind me, protecting me from the speedy gonzalez, it is ok with me.
    Given the majority's ruling, the only safe bicycle in Illinois is a stationary exercise bike located in one's home or at the gym. ----Illinois State Supreme Court, Boub V Wayne

  25. #25
    Banned. Helmet Head's Avatar
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    And what happens when the slow-mover changes lanes and passes you? Now whose protecting you from speedy gonzalez?

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