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Old 08-03-06, 11:26 AM   #1
San Rensho 
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Cagers care more about their cages than peoples safety

I was riding this morning on a two lane street, doing about 25 mph in a 30 zone. I was riding almost in the middle of my lane. A car passes me, not obnoxiously, not really close, but straddling both lanes. Up ahead is a puddle, in the right third of the lane. After she passes me, she sees the puddle and then moves left some more, completely into the left hand lane, across the centerline, to avoid the puddle!

I dont get it, she has no problem moving completely over into the oncoming traffic lane to avoid getting her precious car wet, but she doesn't have the courtesy to give a vulnerable human being the same amount of room.
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Old 08-03-06, 11:41 AM   #2
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She didn't want to get you wet Pretty thoughtful of her.
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Old 08-03-06, 12:30 PM   #3
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She didn't want to get you wet Pretty thoughtful of her.
that's what i thought too!
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Old 08-03-06, 12:46 PM   #4
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Me too.
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Old 08-03-06, 12:53 PM   #5
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I see this all the time. It's worse when you're a passenger in the car.

Me: Why didn't you scoot over and give that cyclist more room?"
Driver: "I didn't want to cross the line."
Me: "Why do you care more about a stripe of paint than a fellow human being?"
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Old 08-03-06, 01:24 PM   #6
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Whether she went left to avoid the puddle on her behalf or to keep you dry, at least she was courteous in going around you. I have had the cocoon warrior who swerves to cut me off and then force me into the puddle. This shared roadway stuff is hard for all of us to get. I ride every day in city where bike couriers dart through traffic, ride wrong way on one ways, curse out drivers and generally act aggressively and give all two wheelers a bad rep.
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Old 08-03-06, 01:25 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaman
She didn't want to get you wet Pretty thoughtful of her.
That was my thought too. In any case, how was her action dangerous?

Sometimes I think that as a group, we have too much of a chip on our shoulder. The folks that read this forum are not an accurate representation of what "cagers" (grow up people.) see on a bicycle most of the time. Most of what they see are slow riders on the sidewalk, usually with no helmet or lights or any other "serious riding gear" of any sort. They don't expect us to be moving as fast as we are because they don't believe they could ever move more than maybe 5 MPH on a bike. That's the perception they have when they encounter us. Of course they want to go around us!
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Old 08-03-06, 01:53 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by twahl
That was my thought too. In any case, how was her action dangerous?

Sometimes I think that as a group, we have too much of a chip on our shoulder. The folks that read this forum are not an accurate representation of what "cagers" (grow up people.) see on a bicycle most of the time. Most of what they see are slow riders on the sidewalk, usually with no helmet or lights or any other "serious riding gear" of any sort. They don't expect us to be moving as fast as we are because they don't believe they could ever move more than maybe 5 MPH on a bike. That's the perception they have when they encounter us. Of course they want to go around us!
I think that chip gets built up there. It doesn't just happen because one cycles. It happens because one fends off issue after issue... No single thing does it, but over time, the little things build up and then we just assume the worst.

Over my 30+ years of cycling I have "quit" a few times simply because of some action of a motorist that caused me to think... "jeeze what am I doing out here with these nut cases." After a while I tend to forget those incidents and get right back out there again.

I agree with the perception issues... brought on no doubt by motorist's themselves looking at bikes at "toys," and perhaps their own experience of weekend park riding. The times that I have had problems with motorists tended to be when I was riding very fast... and either they did not realize how fast, or didn't care. I think our size also plays into that as our narrow profile can be deceiving to a motorist just making a quick glance judgement.
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Old 08-03-06, 02:28 PM   #9
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People are irrational creatures, we need to accept that first and foremost, so that we don't flip our lids when someone does something senseless.

Usually, I ignore this kind of thing, I'd rather they do that then splash me while I'm on my way in to work, or to a social event or something.

It's the dangerous lane-change or passing maneuvers some do that disturb me....like passing someone, only to suddenly cut in front of them, when they could have used the lane to the right....cops ignore passing laws when passing slow moving vehicles...so just do it already...sheesh.
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Old 08-03-06, 02:31 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Zinn-X
that's what i thought too!
She was a good 7 cars legnths ahead of me when she moved over again, so she was not being courteous and not splashing me.
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Old 08-03-06, 02:50 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twahl
That was my thought too. In any case, how was her action dangerous?

Sometimes I think that as a group, we have too much of a chip on our shoulder. The folks that read this forum are not an accurate representation of what "cagers" (grow up people.) see on a bicycle most of the time. Most of what they see are slow riders on the sidewalk, usually with no helmet or lights or any other "serious riding gear" of any sort. They don't expect us to be moving as fast as we are because they don't believe they could ever move more than maybe 5 MPH on a bike. That's the perception they have when they encounter us. Of course they want to go around us!

Okay, she was not trying to avoid splashing me, she was WAY ahead of me when she went around the puddle, she was already moving back into the right hand lane, when she moved left again, this time, completely into the oncoming traffic lane, in order to avoid the puddle. Sorry that wasn't clear in my original post.

The only point I'm trying to make is that she gives more room to a puddle on the road than she does to a human being. The fact that she gives more room to a puddle demonstrates she's more worried about getting her car wet than about the safety of a person. It wasn't a dangerous pass per se, just demonstrative of many cagers attitude towards bicyclists, that they care more about a puddle than they do for us.
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Old 08-03-06, 04:24 PM   #12
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While I think you are right: that many cagers care a great deal about their cars, sometimes to the point of endangering other users of the road, it is also instinct as a motorist to avoid obstacles on the road. I know I used to steer around or straddle puddles, whichever was safer, because determining their depth and the potential for damage wasn't clear.

But I have also taken advantage of one cagers affection for his car when he came roaring up on me in his customized rice-rocket with dark-tinted windows, fat exhaust pipes, expensive chrome rims and shiny paint job (and obligatory monster stereo system shaking the very road) and passed me within inches at a dangerously high rate of speed. When I caught up to him a half block down the street where he was forced to stop due to traffic volume, I calmly began swinging my four foot, eight pound chain lock over my head like a helicopter blade and suggested he acknowledge and apologize for endangering my life so recklessly and needlessly before my arm got tired and the chain began to take out windows and leave deep dents in his doors, quarter panels and rims. He practically went white when he saw that I meant to damage his car and apologized profusely. Sure, I know he probably called me a string of names after I wished him a nice day and continued on, but I was smiling the rest of the way to work.
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Old 08-03-06, 05:07 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltandlight
Whether she went left to avoid the puddle on her behalf or to keep you dry, at least she was courteous in going around you. I have had the cocoon warrior who swerves to cut me off and then force me into the puddle. This shared roadway stuff is hard for all of us to get. I ride every day in city where bike couriers dart through traffic, ride wrong way on one ways, curse out drivers and generally act aggressively and give all two wheelers a bad rep.
Hod out your hand with a nice set of shinny keys gets them to scoot over real fast
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Old 08-03-06, 09:25 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by San Rensho
I was riding this morning on a two lane street, doing about 25 mph in a 30 zone. I was riding almost in the middle of my lane. A car passes me, not obnoxiously, not really close, but straddling both lanes...
Say, Aldo, a heads up for you in the Gables area - keep a lookout (and steer clear) of a Pizza Hut deliveryman in a black Ford Focus. Notoriously reckless (I've seen him multiple times), and he has nearly shaved my bar tape one day. He didn't care less one bit when I pointed this out to him when I found him delivering pizzas a few blocks away (although this isn't terribly surprising - he's a cager, and this is Miami).

Gave his manager hell on the phone. He's still out there.

-Kurt
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Old 08-04-06, 06:16 AM   #15
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Say, Aldo, a heads up for you in the Gables area - keep a lookout (and steer clear) of a Pizza Hut deliveryman in a black Ford Focus. Notoriously reckless (I've seen him multiple times), and he has nearly shaved my bar tape one day. He didn't care less one bit when I pointed this out to him when I found him delivering pizzas a few blocks away (although this isn't terribly surprising - he's a cager, and this is Miami).

Gave his manager hell on the phone. He's still out there.

-Kurt
You need to call the police. The manager just cares about him getting pizzas on time! Put some real HEAT on him (police)!

Keep Cycling!
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Old 08-04-06, 07:31 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by catatonic
People are irrational creatures, we need to accept that first and foremost, so that we don't flip our lids when someone does something senseless.
Of course, this very good point also explains the actions of cyclists with a huge chip on thier shoulder who do moronic things in traffic. (and then brag about them on the internet....)
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Old 08-04-06, 01:11 PM   #17
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You were riding too predictable. She knew you weren't going to swerve in front of her. That puddle on the other hand could have jumped out into her path. Good thing she gave it plenty of room! /sarcasm off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by San Rensho
The only point I'm trying to make is that she gives more room to a puddle on the road than she does to a human being.
While riding in my quiet neighborhood, an oncoming car moved left to go around a parked car on the curb. The driver left more room for the parked car than they did for me on my bike. It made me wonder the same thing.

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Old 08-04-06, 01:21 PM   #18
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You need to call the police. The manager just cares about him getting pizzas on time! Put some real HEAT on him (police)!

Keep Cycling!
Will seriously consider doing so the next time I nearly get shaved by any of the P-Hut fellows.

Take care,

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Old 08-04-06, 03:14 PM   #19
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Maybe she didn't want to hydroplane off the road and die. It isn't always about selfishness and vanity.
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Old 08-04-06, 04:10 PM   #20
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Maybe she didn't want to hydroplane off the road and die. It isn't always about selfishness and vanity.
You are kidding, right? It was a PUDDLE not a wet road. She was going around 30mph. When is the last time you heard of someone hydroplaning out of control and killing themselves at 30 mph?

If you had said she could have been avoiding space aliens, your post would make as much sense as it does.
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Old 08-04-06, 04:23 PM   #21
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7 x 14= 98 feet.

The fact she avioded the puddle to prevent hydroplaning, and skidding into you, makes her actions a bit more prudent then vanity.
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Old 08-04-06, 04:35 PM   #22
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[QUOTEYou are kidding, right? It was a PUDDLE not a wet road. She was going around 30mph. When is the last time you heard of someone hydroplaning out of control and killing themselves at 30 mph?

If you had said she could have been avoiding space aliens, your post would make as much sense as it does.
][/QUOTE]

Hmmm, hydroplaning on a puddle or space aliens. Yes, they are the same. Thanks for clearing that up.

I have hydroplaned at 30 mph over puddles with lousy tires. Not bald tires mind you, just lousy tires in the rain. I am always very cautious when driving my car through water, even small puddles.

The whole point is why assume she has more concern for vanity than the OP's life? There are a number of plausible explanations that don't end up concluding evil on the driver's part.

Quote:
Hydroplaning (Aquaplaning) - Smart Motorist

Hydroplaning (called aquaplaning in Europe and Asia) occurs when water on the roadway accumulates in front of your vehicle's tires faster that the weight of your vehicle can push it out of the way. The water pressure can cause your car to rise up and slide on top of a thin layer of water between your tires and the road. While hydroplaning your vehicle rides on top of the water, like a water skier on a lake. In less than a second, your car can completely lose contact with the road, putting you in immediate danger of sliding out of your lane. This usually happens at higher speeds, over 40 miles per hour. Try to imagine your vehicle traveling at a high rate of speed on a sheet of ice: that image approximates what will happen if you try to brake or steer while hydroplaning.

The 3 main factors that contribute to hydroplaning:

Vehicle speed. As speed increases, wet traction is considerably reduced. Since hydroplaning can result in a complete loss of traction and vehicle control, you should always reduce speed, paying attention to the traffic around you.
Tire tread depth. As your tires become worn, their ability to resist hydroplaning is reduced.
Water depth. The deeper the water, the sooner you will lose traction, although even thin water layers can cause a loss of traction, including at low speeds.
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Old 08-04-06, 07:47 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by slowandsteady
I have hydroplaned at 30 mph over puddles with lousy tires. Not bald tires mind you, just lousy tires in the rain. I am always very cautious when driving my car through water, even small puddles.

The whole point is why assume she has more concern for vanity than the OP's life? There are a number of plausible explanations that don't end up concluding evil on the driver's part.
Believe me, the majority people who drive around here don't even know what "hydroplaning" is, let alone that it can happen to them at 30mph in a car.

For that matter, I'm familiar with the type of puddles we get here in the road - about 3' to 4' wide, and about 10 feet long or so in general cases. Nothing that can create any serious hydroplaning.

I'd bet 10 to 1 it was some Beemer driver who didn't care for water stains on their aluminum rims.

-Kurt
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Old 08-04-06, 08:14 PM   #24
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Ever hit a puddle at 30 mph in a car with rack and pinion steering without power assist? You can have three fistfuls of steering wheel real quick trying to hold it straight and off the curb and the car to your left.
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Old 08-05-06, 08:57 AM   #25
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We've had two hit and runs here now locally where somebody kills a pedestrian and just keeps going. The first one was a lady who had too much to drink, struck a guy out walking (on a narrow road with no sidewalks, bike lanes or shoulder), went home to sober up, then reported that "something hit my SUV" the next morning.

In the recent incident, the lady drifted to the left (on a narrow road with no sidewalks, bike lanes or shoulder) when she bent over to pick up a cellphone ringing on the floor of her SUV. She killed the guy but continued on to her job as if nothing happened.

Both these people live in the super-wealthy part of town and both killed other wealthy neighbors in that town. At least the first one went to jail (but not for very long of course) and the second one is going to get vehicular manslaughter and felony hit-and-run charges. They're still investigating her case.

But my problem with all this is, what the hell is the matter with people? Do cars make people not just careless and overly-coocooned from reality, but actually anti-social?
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