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Old 10-09-06, 09:23 AM   #1
gqsmoothie
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I wrecked!

Had a wreck last Thursday. For some unfathomable reason I grabbed my front brake lever while off the seat and standing up, did an endo (sp?), and then landed in the middle of the road while everybody was trying to figure out how the hell I wrecked when there was nothing I could possibly have ran into. Needless to say, I am very, very happy that I was wearing a helmet. I don't think I'll EVER ride without my helmet. If I didn't have that thing on I'd probably have some brain damage. I did land on my right side and managed to hurt my arm pretty bad, doc said it's just tissue damage, no breaks or fractures.

Just thought I'd share my little incident w/y'all.

Peace,

Gabe
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Old 10-09-06, 11:07 AM   #2
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whoa, that's crazy. glad you're ok. and thanks for the reality check, i've been kinda slacking w/ the whole helmet thing lately.
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Old 10-10-06, 06:34 AM   #3
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way to go smoothie. Reminds me of video of the girl who puts her foot into the spokes.
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Old 10-10-06, 10:14 AM   #4
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Glad you're ok. Not to state the obvious or anything but next time, don't grab just the front brake when standing. Or better yet don't grab the brakes at all while standing unless unavoidable.
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Old 10-10-06, 03:25 PM   #5
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Now we know where your handle comes from Smoooothe operator...
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Old 10-10-06, 03:40 PM   #6
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Glad to hear your head does not listen to inconclusive and misleading statistics or the ineffective helmet that saved your head would have been in a box at home. Cheers and good riding.
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Old 10-10-06, 03:41 PM   #7
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On pavement, I stand in order to accelerate or to power up a grade... in neither case would it make sense to brake.

Off hand, the only time I can imagine braking with either brake while standing is off road on a mountain bike, going down (hence the braking) bumpy terrain (hence the standing).
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Old 10-10-06, 03:45 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmet Head
Off hand, the only time I can imagine braking with either brake while standing is off road on a mountain bike, going down (hence the braking) bumpy terrain (hence the standing).
and then, the front brake is your friend! NOT the rear.....
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Old 10-10-06, 03:49 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmet Head
On pavement, I stand in order to accelerate or to power up a grade... in neither case would it make sense to brake.

Off hand, the only time I can imagine braking with either brake while standing is off road on a mountain bike, going down (hence the braking) bumpy terrain (hence the standing).
You ride off-road and haven't figured out that the best way to brake is to lift off the saddle and push back? I brake that way all the time, road or mountain bike. Also, how do you do long skids if you remain on the saddle? Stand up, move all the way to the stem, lay on the rear brake as hard as you can and leave a skid mark that any 10 year old will admire ...or at least inner 10 year old
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Old 10-10-06, 03:54 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cyccommute
You ride off-road and haven't figured out that the best way to brake is to lift off the saddle and push back? I brake that way all the time, road or mountain bike. Also, how do you do long skids if you remain on the saddle? Stand up, move all the way to the stem, lay on the rear brake as hard as you can and leave a skid mark that any 10 year old will admire ...or at least inner 10 year old
and while you are at it, cause enough erosion that it will look like a throttle twister came by.... pls dont skid up your trail system and ruin it for everyone Adopt that posture on the bike, and get deep into the front brake and use the rear only for balance and come to smooth fast stops on loose steep downhills .... much classier.
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Old 10-10-06, 04:00 PM   #11
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Skidding is fun but real hard on the ol' rear tire & if off road is bad for the trail too. It's important that people that don't like mountain bikes don't know we've even been there (aka: Leave no trace). It looks real ugly to trail users that are looking for a natural looking park experience.
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Old 10-10-06, 04:31 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twowheelfunman
Skidding is fun but real hard on the ol' rear tire & if off road is bad for the trail too. It's important that people that don't like mountain bikes don't know we've even been there (aka: Leave no trace). It looks real ugly to trail users that are looking for a natural looking park experience.
Exactly. Ripping up trails = closed trails and no fun for anyone.
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Old 10-10-06, 04:42 PM   #13
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My brakes are calibrated so badly that I'd never endo - much safer!
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Old 10-10-06, 04:52 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cyccommute
You ride off-road and haven't figured out that the best way to brake is to lift off the saddle and push back? I brake that way all the time, road or mountain bike. Also, how do you do long skids if you remain on the saddle? Stand up, move all the way to the stem, lay on the rear brake as hard as you can and leave a skid mark that any 10 year old will admire ...or at least inner 10 year old
Yes, on steep downhills, of course I get behind the seat. And even on pavement in an emergency stop. But I don't think of that as standing.

And I haven't intentionally skidded in decades.
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Old 10-10-06, 06:17 PM   #15
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Welcome to the club!
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Old 10-10-06, 07:18 PM   #16
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Wow, is this the first real thread on advocacy on the ASS forum in ages?
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Old 10-10-06, 08:21 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gqsmoothie
Had a wreck last Thursday. For some unfathomable reason I grabbed my front brake lever while off the seat and standing up, did an endo (sp?), and then landed in the middle of the road while everybody was trying to figure out how the hell I wrecked when there was nothing I could possibly have ran into. Needless to say, I am very, very happy that I was wearing a helmet. I don't think I'll EVER ride without my helmet. If I didn't have that thing on I'd probably have some brain damage. I did land on my right side and managed to hurt my arm pretty bad, doc said it's just tissue damage, no breaks or fractures.

Just thought I'd share my little incident w/y'all.

Peace,

Gabe
Yes, this is where helmets truly excel, protecting the inexperienced from themselves.
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Old 10-11-06, 08:41 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sgtsmile
and while you are at it, cause enough erosion that it will look like a throttle twister came by.... pls dont skid up your trail system and ruin it for everyone Adopt that posture on the bike, and get deep into the front brake and use the rear only for balance and come to smooth fast stops on loose steep downhills .... much classier.
I don't skid on mountain trails. Skid marks aren't that impressive there. I'm talking about leaving black marks on the pavement
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Old 10-11-06, 08:45 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sgtsmile
Exactly. Ripping up trails = closed trails and no fun for anyone.
Sorry. I wasn't thinking of skidding (by the way it was a JOKE!) in context of off-road. I don't skid there, mostly because I know how to brake on a bike. I don't advocate skidding on mountain trails. Fire roads, dirt roads, etc., by all means have fun but don't do it on trails.
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Old 10-11-06, 09:00 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmet Head
Yes, on steep downhills, of course I get behind the seat. And even on pavement in an emergency stop. But I don't think of that as standing.

And I haven't intentionally skidded in decades.
On a more serious note, how do you come to a stop and dismount if you don't stand up while braking? The very act of stopping, with a properly adjusted saddle, requires you to stand up and move forward off the saddle to put your foot on the ground. I thought about this all the way in to work this morning and I find that I stand up the majority of the time while braking...if I'm going to stop.

Gqsmoothie, it's more a matter of technique than anything else. Your bike is dynamic, you should treat it that way. I have loads of mountain bike experience and I tend to brake like a mountain biker. Often times we have to be off the saddle with our knees locked (or nearly so) for balance purposes while braking on steep terrain. You learn very quickly how to shift your weight back and forth small amounts to keep the brakes doing what they are supposed to be doing...giving you control. I disagree with Sgtsmile that the front brake is a friend on steep trails. Depending too much on the front brake is just as bad as depending too much on your rear brake. Your brakes work together, you have to find the position between them to keep the bike from doing something you don't what it to do...like throwing you on your head.

As I've noted above, skidding on trails is bad but learning how to skid and how to play with the brakes to make the bike do what it's supposed to do isn't. Go out and learn how to brake in all situations. Learn how to skid (use old tires and don't do it on public trails), learn how to brake hard with the front wheel and still keep the rear wheel on the ground (hint: shift your weight backwards as the wheel starts to come off the ground), learn how to properly panic stop. Learn all this stuff by playing around on the bike (in the proper setting, of course) to see how far you can push it.
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An Good Ol' Fashion Appalachian Butt Whoopin'.

Last edited by cyccommute; 10-11-06 at 12:06 PM.
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Old 10-11-06, 10:36 AM   #21
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Quote:
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My brakes are calibrated so badly that I'd never endo - much safer!
ditto
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Old 10-11-06, 11:28 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cyccommute
On a more serious note, how do you come to a stop and dismount if you don't stand up while braking? The very act of stopping, with a properly adjusted saddle, requires you to stand up and move forward off the saddle to put your foot on the ground. I thought about this all the way in to work this morning and I find that I stand up the majority of the time while braking...if I'm going to stop.
Good point, I didn't think of that. Of course I'm braking as I'm about to come to a stop, and I do stand up to get off the saddle. But, that scenario - standing while braking at such a low (about to stop) speed - is not applicable to the situation presented in the OP, which is probably why I didn't come to my mind.

Quote:
Gqsmoothie, it's more a matter of technique than anything else. Your bike is dynamic, you should treat it that way. I have loads of mountain bike experience and I tend to brake like a mountain biker. Often times we have to be off the saddle with our knees locked (or nearly so) for balance purposes while braking on steep terrain. You learn very quickly how to shift your weight back and forth small amounts to keep the brakes doing what they are supposed to be doing...giving you control. I disagree with Sgtsmile that the front brake is friend on steep trails. Depending too much on the front brake is just as bad as depending too much on your rear brake. Your brakes work together, you have to find the position between them to keep the bike from doing something you don't what it to do...like throwing you on your head.

As I've noted above, skidding on trails is bad but learning how to skid and how to play with the brakes to make the bike do what it's supposed to do isn't. Go out and learn how to brake in all situations. Learn how to skid (use old tires and don't do it on public trails), learn how to brake hard with the front wheel and still keep the rear wheel on the ground (hint: shift your weight backwards as the wheel starts to come off the ground), learn how to properly panic stop. Learn all this stuff by playing around on the bike (in the proper setting, of course) to see how far you can push it.
+1

I agree with all of the above.
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Old 10-11-06, 11:46 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmet Head
Yes, on steep downhills, of course I get behind the seat. And even on pavement in an emergency stop. But I don't think of that as standing.

And I haven't intentionally skidded in decades.

What about panic stops? When I practice those, I skid. Yes, I am also out of the saddle at that point too... but not exactly "standing up." I throw my weight back toward the rear to maintain control over the bike and avoid doing an endo.

Those Kool Stop salmon pads stop real fast.
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Old 10-11-06, 01:38 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gqsmoothie
For some unfathomable reason I grabbed my front brake lever while off the seat and standing up,
Good discussion of braking technique, but my understanding of the OP is that he didn't mean to brake, he just absent-mindedly squeezed the handle. His braking technique may well be just fine, when that's what he intends to do... The issue seems to be more what the heck was he thinking!

Glad you weren't hurt, smoothie!
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Old 10-12-06, 08:37 AM   #25
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You got it right John Brooking. I had no intention whatsover to brake. I musta been daydreaming or looking at all of the cute NCSU girls. Other than this incident I'd have to say that I have pretty good braking technique.

Gabe
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