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Old 01-28-07, 07:34 PM   #1
ken cummings
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have your Police tried this one?

Our area has quite a problem with unliceinsed drivers. So much so that often batches of them are run through the courts in the same session. When that happens the local and county officers may have spotters in the court-room passing descriptions to officers outside. When a violator with a suspended liceinse steps outside they watch to see if he or she get in a vehicle to drive away. Happens so often it is not funny. How does it matter to cyclists? Well, the second (or third or Nth) time around the driver will be in jail for a while making the roads a little safer for us. Conversly, the families of such people frequently end up on public assistance 'til the driver gets out of the hoosegow. I will see if our local Bikes for Kids program will consider a Bikes for Unliceinsed Drivers program.
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Old 01-28-07, 07:43 PM   #2
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reward a felon with a bike............how about new velodomes inside the prisons too!
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Old 01-28-07, 08:31 PM   #3
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Our county is trying to make 3 tickets for unlicensed driving a felony, as we have the highest hit & run stats of any county in the nation. The police won't even come talk to you unless you have a plate number and/or there's an injury involved.

Naturally, the local Hispanic community action group is up in arms claiming that it's discrimination.

I would simply enjoy being safer on the roads, and I could care less what the ethnicity of the dangerous drivers is...

I think as soon as my daughter's out of high school, I'm moving to Switzerland or somewhere similar.

Az
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Old 01-28-07, 08:42 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by spry
reward a felon with a bike............how about new velodomes inside the prisons too!
A lot of those people are driving without licenses because they have no other way to get to and from work. If handing them a bicycle will get them out of their cars then I'm in favor of handing them a bicycle.
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Old 01-28-07, 08:57 PM   #5
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A lot of those people are driving without licenses because they have no other way to get to and from work. If handing them a bicycle will get them out of their cars then I'm in favor of handing them a bicycle.
They are not driving because they don't have a bike. Most of the places these kind of people live (trashy apartment complexes, trailer parks) are littered with abandoned x-mart bikes. They drive because they are lazy and have no respect for the law. Give them a bike and it will either become part of the litter or sold for beer and/or dope.
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Old 01-28-07, 09:06 PM   #6
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My best friend Tony is 31 and has never had a license. He's been caught several times, and went to jail the last time. He's a fantastic driver and he never got in trouble for any other traffic violation. He doesn't drink and he isn't all that lazy, in spite of what Deputy Jones (the village idiot) says above. I think he has respect for the law, other than the law that says you need a license to drive a car. Somehow, that law just doesn't make any sense to him!

Oh--he's also the best cyclist I've ever seen. He can literally dance on a bike, and make it do other things it shouldn't be able to do.
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Old 01-28-07, 09:15 PM   #7
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reward a felon with a bike............how about new velodomes inside the prisons too!
I'd rather them pedaling that drunkenly careening down the road in a beat up Ford.

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I've had people ask if I lost my license since I started commuting by bike 2 years ago. Amazing.
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Old 01-28-07, 09:38 PM   #8
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Does the courthouse have a) housing within a 15 minute walk that is affordable for felons, b) a bus service that runs, c) light rail or a subway, d) reliable taxi service (don't laugh - a lot of places do not have this - Calgary is one). If none of these are available - either cycling or driving off are the only options. If I was convicted, I would argue that the lack of public transit was entrapment
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Old 01-28-07, 11:29 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Roody
My best friend Tony is 31 and has never had a license. He's been caught several times, and went to jail the last time. He's a fantastic driver and he never got in trouble for any other traffic violation. He doesn't drink and he isn't all that lazy, in spite of what Deputy Jones (the village idiot) says above. I think he has respect for the law, other than the law that says you need a license to drive a car. Somehow, that law just doesn't make any sense to him!

Oh--he's also the best cyclist I've ever seen. He can literally dance on a bike, and make it do other things it shouldn't be able to do.
I don't care if he's Mario freakin' Andretti, he can go take the test like everyone else. It's not hard, it's not expensive, and it doesn't take much time. What's the problem?

Statistically, someone is 100% less likely to get into a crash if they're licensed and insured.

Az
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Old 01-29-07, 12:07 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Az B
I don't care if he's Mario freakin' Andretti, he can go take the test like everyone else. It's not hard, it's not expensive, and it doesn't take much time. What's the problem?

Statistically, someone is 100% less likely to get into a crash if they're licensed and insured.

Az
Believe me, if I could get him in there I would do it. I don't understand the problem--except that his father hasn't had a license since 1969, and he's been in jail several times. So it runs in the family. At this point it would cost my friend something like $1200 to get his license. I just wanted to point out that some of the assumptions made about people without licenses are totally unwarranted. They aren't all lazy stupid drunken outlaws with trash on their front lawns. I hate it when people take that holier-than-thou attitude. (Not you--an earlier poster.)
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Old 01-29-07, 07:26 AM   #11
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They are at least outlaws...
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Old 01-29-07, 07:36 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by deputyjones
They drive because they are lazy and have no respect for the law.
Agreed.
Getting a Driver License is rediculously easy and inexpensive in the U.S.

People like Tony cause, and in doing so, deserve, their own problems.
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Old 01-29-07, 07:40 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roody
My best friend Tony is 31 and has never had a license. He's been caught several times, and went to jail the last time. He's a fantastic driver and he never got in trouble for any other traffic violation. He doesn't drink and he isn't all that lazy, in spite of what Deputy Jones (the village idiot) says above. I think he has respect for the law, other than the law that says you need a license to drive a car. Somehow, that law just doesn't make any sense to him!

Oh--he's also the best cyclist I've ever seen. He can literally dance on a bike, and make it do other things it shouldn't be able to do.
Did he just simply not get a liscense or is there a legal reason he can not have one? If not, why doesn't he go & get one? Especially if that is the only law he has ever broken & the fact he respects the law as you put it.
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Old 01-29-07, 07:56 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roody
My best friend Tony is 31 and has never had a license. He's been caught several times, and went to jail the last time. He's a fantastic driver and he never got in trouble for any other traffic violation. He doesn't drink and he isn't all that lazy, in spite of what Deputy Jones (the village idiot) says above. I think he has respect for the law, other than the law that says you need a license to drive a car. Somehow, that law just doesn't make any sense to him!

Oh--he's also the best cyclist I've ever seen. He can literally dance on a bike, and make it do other things it shouldn't be able to do.

Ok so he's a good driver and a good cyclist and he's not all that lazy and I agree, one should not stereotype.

He is still operating a motor vehicle without insurance or a valid drivers license. I don't care that he doesn't "respect the law that says you need a drivers license". If he is in a motor vehicle accident and someone (or himself) is hurt that person is left to pay for damaged property and/or medical bills because Tony "doesn't feel like" getting insurance or having a valid drivers license.

That, my friend, is a self centered, disrespectful, stupid attitude. He has a responsibility to others while on the road and having insurance to pay for those damages 'insures' that person is cared for. Unless, of course, Tony is quite wealthy and willing to pay for those damages....?
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Old 01-29-07, 09:30 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roody
My best friend Tony is 31 and has never had a license. He's been caught several times, and went to jail the last time. He's a fantastic driver and he never got in trouble for any other traffic violation. He doesn't drink and he isn't all that lazy, in spite of what Deputy Jones (the village idiot) says above. I think he has respect for the law, other than the law that says you need a license to drive a car. Somehow, that law just doesn't make any sense to him!

Oh--he's also the best cyclist I've ever seen. He can literally dance on a bike, and make it do other things it shouldn't be able to do.
Tony is 31, has never bothered to get a license, and has spent time in jail for not doing so... I'm sorry, but he is the Village Idiot.
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Old 01-29-07, 09:43 AM   #16
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Tony is 31, has never bothered to get a license, and has spent time in jail for not doing so... I'm sorry, but he is the Village Idiot.
As well as his good buddy making excuses for him.
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Old 01-29-07, 10:16 AM   #17
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Deputy Jones, what is it about immigrants and litter? Whatever happened to anti-litter laws? Why do they insist on trashing wherever they live or go? Why don't you guys ever crack down on them for littering and their slum landlords for never cleaning up their apartment complexes? I walk by one of them that's a total trash heap with broken windows and everything. You'd think somebody would crack down on the slum lord for this at least.
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Old 01-29-07, 10:17 AM   #18
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At what point will the legal system enact penalties that actually keep people from driving?
There was a news story up here in Seattle over the weekend about a woman on her 40-something-ith violation for driving on a suspended license. The court system has made the statement that they'll just continue to fine her when she's caught because it's too expensive to try and jail her. There are plenty of people driving around with a suspended license for any number of reasons: from the relatively harmless "failure to provide proof of insurance" to the deadly "multiple D.U.I." offenders.
Here's the real issue... Taking away someone's documentation of driving privileges is ineffective at stopping someone from driving. It's the equivalent of taking my degree off my wall and telling me to stop being smart.
Don't take away licenses. Take away vehicles. It's awfully tough to get a 2nd, 3rd... 15th D.U.I. (it's insane how many you can have, and still be allowed to drive,) when you don't have a car.
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Old 01-29-07, 10:25 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roody
My best friend Tony is 31 and has never had a license. He's been caught several times, and went to jail the last time. He's a fantastic driver and he never got in trouble for any other traffic violation. He doesn't drink and he isn't all that lazy, in spite of what Deputy Jones (the village idiot) says above. I think he has respect for the law, other than the law that says you need a license to drive a car. Somehow, that law just doesn't make any sense to him!

Oh--he's also the best cyclist I've ever seen. He can literally dance on a bike, and make it do other things it shouldn't be able to do.
So how does he get caught? Is the car also not registered. And of course he does not have insurance! So he takes out a cyclist or other car and the other driver is out of luck.

If he is such a great driver why no license? They are very easy to get. The tests are not hard.

Oh wait "that law just doesn't make sense to him'! Bet there are other laws that he doesn't think make sense. Wonder which ones.
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Old 01-29-07, 10:35 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by digger

He is still operating a motor vehicle without insurance or a valid drivers license. I don't care that he doesn't "respect the law that says you need a drivers license". If he is in a motor vehicle accident and someone (or himself) is hurt that person is left to pay for damaged property and/or medical bills because Tony "doesn't feel like" getting insurance or having a valid drivers license.
....?
Talk about assumptions. As far as I know, Tony has never driven an uninsured vehicle. In this state, the no-fault insurance goes with the vehicle, not the driver. Tony doesn't own a car. He stupidly drives his girlfriend's car or his parent's car, and they're stupid enough to let him do it. If he were involved in an accident, their insurance would cover Tony, the car and 3rd party damages. The other driver's insurance would cover damages to the 2nd car and occupants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiznaz
They are at least outlaws...
Or scofflaws.

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Originally Posted by sbhikes
Deputy Jones, what is it about immigrants and litter? Whatever happened to anti-litter laws? Why do they insist on trashing wherever they live or go? Why don't you guys ever crack down on them for littering and their slum landlords for never cleaning up their apartment complexes? I walk by one of them that's a total trash heap with broken windows and everything. You'd think somebody would crack down on the slum lord for this at least.
Off-topic troll. You've expressed your bigotry and prejudice on this forum many times before. Try reading the guidelines.
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Old 01-29-07, 10:35 AM   #21
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Does the courthouse have a) housing within a 15 minute walk that is affordable for felons, b) a bus service that runs, c) light rail or a subway, d) reliable taxi service (don't laugh - a lot of places do not have this - Calgary is one). If none of these are available - either cycling or driving off are the only options. If I was convicted, I would argue that the lack of public transit was entrapment
You need to learn what entrapment is. This is about as far from it as you can get. Entrapement is when someone is lured into commiting a crime they would not otherwise have committed. In the case here someone got caught for driving withoiut a license.They are then stupid enough to drive to the courthouse without a license and then drive away, still without a license.

Far from entrapment. If someone drives without a license this is the one time you would expect them to make other arrangements. Rather than 'entrapment', this is just getting the very worst offenders.
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Old 01-29-07, 10:40 AM   #22
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Since 9/11, driver licenses have become de facto national ID cards. They have little magnetic stripes with your personal information on them. Any federal agent can access this personal information without a warrant. Another erosion of our personal liberties.

"Your papers please. Ve must see your papers."
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Old 01-29-07, 10:44 AM   #23
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Talk about assumptions. As far as I know, Tony has never driven an uninsured vehicle. In this state, the no-fault insurance goes with the vehicle, not the driver. Tony doesn't own a car. He stupidly drives his girlfriend's car or his parent's car, and they're stupid enough to let him do it. If he were involved in an accident, their insurance would cover Tony, the car and 3rd party damages. The other driver's insurance would cover damages to the 2nd car and occupants.
Knowingly alowing an unlicensed driver to operate your vehicle may void the insurance, or it may cover those injured but allow the insurance company to come after the cars owners to recover any payout thay made. Tony's girlfriend and parents would do well to make sure what the law is in their state.
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Old 01-29-07, 11:21 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roody
My best friend Tony is 31 and has never had a license. He's been caught several times, and went to jail the last time. He's a fantastic driver and he never got in trouble for any other traffic violation. He doesn't drink and he isn't all that lazy, in spite of what Deputy Jones (the village idiot) says above. I think he has respect for the law, other than the law that says you need a license to drive a car. Somehow, that law just doesn't make any sense to him!

Oh--he's also the best cyclist I've ever seen. He can literally dance on a bike, and make it do other things it shouldn't be able to do.

Uh, he can't be that great of a driver IF HE'S BEEN CAUGHT SEVERAL TIMES. He must have been doing something wrong to be pulled over. Let me guess...the stop sign didn't make any sense to him.
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Old 01-29-07, 02:11 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by deputyjones
They are not driving because they don't have a bike. Most of the places these kind of people live (trashy apartment complexes, trailer parks) are littered with abandoned x-mart bikes. They drive because they are lazy and have no respect for the law. Give them a bike and it will either become part of the litter or sold for beer and/or dope.
...and people wonder why there are so many of "those kind" of people in jails.
why should they have respect for a legal system that continually assumes that they are "those kind of people" simply because of where they live? it's a viscious cycle and (viscious) cops who assume this kind of superior attitude are part of the problem. i bet you routinely stop young black males and keep everyone safe from "those kinds of people" too. kudos to you sir.
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