Taking a more agressive & pro-active approach.
02-08-07, 09:58 AM
#51
Faster but still slow
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Jersey
Posts: 5,978
Bikes: Trek 830 circa 1993 and a Fuji WSD Finest 1.0 2006
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
Originally Posted by N_C
My own personal ethics & values...
I just love a good joke.
02-08-07, 10:24 AM
#52
Infamous Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 24,360
Bikes: Surly Big Dummy, Fuji World, 80ish Bianchi
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
3 Posts
As the parks & rec director of the city, I have no idea what 'foundation members' you want me to send this too, and even less of an idea of why I should read this letter or what action you are asking me to take. It looks no different to me than the mass of other form letters, faxes and emails I receive daily that end up in the trash bin.
If one is trying to contact me about a serious issue that I should be interested in addressing, they would take the time to send ME a short personalized letter than tells me, in a very brief, to-the-point fashion, the 5 Ws - who, what, when, where...and most importantly, why, along with an invitation to schedule a meeting/call to discuss in more detail.
If one is trying to contact me about a serious issue that I should be interested in addressing, they would take the time to send ME a short personalized letter than tells me, in a very brief, to-the-point fashion, the 5 Ws - who, what, when, where...and most importantly, why, along with an invitation to schedule a meeting/call to discuss in more detail.
__________________
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
02-08-07, 11:41 AM
#53
Banned.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: San Diego
Posts: 13,075
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by N_C
Here is the email I sent to the STF secretary & president & the parks & rec. director of Sioux City:
****,
Will you please send this to everyone in the foundation?
This is a trailer to a 90 min. video called Contested Streets. While Sioux City does not have as bad of a problem with congestion as other larger cities the problem is still there, just on a smaller scale, that could become larger as the city grows. We need to think of ways to reclaim our public spaces in this community, beyond what we are already doing.
Please watch the short trailer & I will do what I can to obtain the full version of the video. The trailer shows some really great ideas of what has happened in other cites around the world that Sioux City should use as a model.
I think part of this includes having a Complete Streets Policy & Safe Routes to School for all of the schools in Sioux City, both public & private. If we work on melding together Complete Streets, Safe Routes to School & reclaiming the public spaces this community will be a whole lot better for it. We need to adopt a new perspective & get rid of the old traditional way of thinking when it comes to infrastructure, like roadway construction. So what do you say? let's think about ways to do this using the info. in the web sites below.
We have made a good start on some of these things. But so much more needs to be done. Even if it is utilizing ourselves as a think-tank just to come up with ideas for a later time. But there are things that should be done right away. The first of which is a Complete Streets Policy.
So help me out here. Let's do what we can to make this happen. Who's on board?
Here are the links to the information:
https://www.contestedstreets.com/
https://www.iowabikes.com/
https://www.dot.state.ia.us/saferoutes/
https://www.completestreets.org/
https://www.thunderheadalliance.org/index.asp
Thank you.
John
What do you think? I did the research & presented the ideas. Didn't really stroke any ego's or kiss butt, didn't have to. That is up to others to get these ideas implemented. I hope it happens.
One other thing I have heard & get the feeling there are those in the foundation who think our focus should be on the trails only & not other facilties. At times this attitude has almost made me want to stop my efforts. So far there has not been any in-fighting over the issue & I hope there isn't any.
****,
Will you please send this to everyone in the foundation?
This is a trailer to a 90 min. video called Contested Streets. While Sioux City does not have as bad of a problem with congestion as other larger cities the problem is still there, just on a smaller scale, that could become larger as the city grows. We need to think of ways to reclaim our public spaces in this community, beyond what we are already doing.
Please watch the short trailer & I will do what I can to obtain the full version of the video. The trailer shows some really great ideas of what has happened in other cites around the world that Sioux City should use as a model.
I think part of this includes having a Complete Streets Policy & Safe Routes to School for all of the schools in Sioux City, both public & private. If we work on melding together Complete Streets, Safe Routes to School & reclaiming the public spaces this community will be a whole lot better for it. We need to adopt a new perspective & get rid of the old traditional way of thinking when it comes to infrastructure, like roadway construction. So what do you say? let's think about ways to do this using the info. in the web sites below.
We have made a good start on some of these things. But so much more needs to be done. Even if it is utilizing ourselves as a think-tank just to come up with ideas for a later time. But there are things that should be done right away. The first of which is a Complete Streets Policy.
So help me out here. Let's do what we can to make this happen. Who's on board?
Here are the links to the information:
https://www.contestedstreets.com/
https://www.iowabikes.com/
https://www.dot.state.ia.us/saferoutes/
https://www.completestreets.org/
https://www.thunderheadalliance.org/index.asp
Thank you.
John
What do you think? I did the research & presented the ideas. Didn't really stroke any ego's or kiss butt, didn't have to. That is up to others to get these ideas implemented. I hope it happens.
One other thing I have heard & get the feeling there are those in the foundation who think our focus should be on the trails only & not other facilties. At times this attitude has almost made me want to stop my efforts. So far there has not been any in-fighting over the issue & I hope there isn't any.
02-08-07, 11:48 AM
#54
Banned.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Bannation, forever.
Posts: 2,887
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by chipcom
As the parks & rec director of the city, I have no idea what 'foundation members' you want me to send this too, and even less of an idea of why I should read this letter or what action you are asking me to take. It looks no different to me than the mass of other form letters, faxes and emails I receive daily that end up in the trash bin.
If one is trying to contact me about a serious issue that I should be interested in addressing, they would take the time to send ME a short personalized letter than tells me, in a very brief, to-the-point fashion, the 5 Ws - who, what, when, where...and most importantly, why, along with an invitation to schedule a meeting/call to discuss in more detail.
If one is trying to contact me about a serious issue that I should be interested in addressing, they would take the time to send ME a short personalized letter than tells me, in a very brief, to-the-point fashion, the 5 Ws - who, what, when, where...and most importantly, why, along with an invitation to schedule a meeting/call to discuss in more detail.
"John, you need to understand that the primary focus of our organization
is on trails with street routes being a sidebar to our primary emphasis.
Many of those involved with STF has asked us to keep the volume of
e-mails down.
I am personally a big advocate of complete streets and all that entails
and your research has been excellent. On the other hand, right now we
must focus our people's time on the bridge and the upcoming ride. As
part of these processes we are building the relationships that will pay
off big in the street department.
We are at a critical juncture where the bridge connecting the states
will or will not become a reality."
I take this to mean we, (STF) only care about the trails & the streets are of no concern to us. But I, (the foundation president) do personally care about complete streets, even so STF is not going to do anything to support it.
I also understand STF needs to keep it's current focus on the bridge project, I have posted about before. And we need to focus out attention on the upcoming annual ride. I agree with these 2 things. Here's the thing though not all STF members are working on the bridge project or the upcoming ride like the president is making it sound, only a select few. Some of those are overlapping between the 2.
So here's my questions. What do I do about Complete Streets, Safe Routes to School & Contested Streets? Do I form another non-profit that will focus on advocating for those things, but be careful not to compete against & undermine STF's efforts with trails & in fact work with STF & have one of it's memebers of the new non-profit as well as people from the MPO, city streets dept., etc.? What would you do? Has something similar happened in your area? If it has what was done? Was there another non-profit created to work with & focus efforts on the other things that needed to be done?
I need help & advice here. Or you may simply tell me I've anwered my own question as to what to do about it.
02-08-07, 11:53 AM
#55
Banned.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: San Diego
Posts: 13,075
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by N_C
So here's my questions. What do I do about Complete Streets, Safe Routes to School & Contested Streets? Do I form another non-profit that will focus on advocating for those things, but be careful not to compete against & undermine STF's efforts with trails & in fact work with STF & have one of it's memebers of the new non-profit as well as people from the MPO, city streets dept., etc.? What would you do? Has something similar happened in your area? If it has what was done? Was there another non-profit created to work with & focus efforts on the other things that needed to be done?
I need help & advice here. Or you may simply tell me I've anwered my own question as to what to do about it.
I need help & advice here. Or you may simply tell me I've anwered my own question as to what to do about it.
02-08-07, 02:09 PM
#56
Banned.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Bannation, forever.
Posts: 2,887
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Helmet Head
State, as clearly as you can, the problem/s you are trying to solve. Only when the problem/s you are trying to solve is/are clearly identified will you or anyone else be able to answer your questions.
Alright here it is spelled out in as plain of english as I can come up with:
The problem with STF is it's focus is too narrow. They are only focusing on the trail system as the big picture. When they should have a broader picture then this. It is fine to only work on one small piece of the big pciture at a time. But STF is only working on trails, nothing more, nothing less. They should inlude in their big picture all things related to bicycle & pedestrian facilities, not just the trail system.
There you have it. The problem with STF. Rather then try to change STF, which I know will not happen I am thinking of creating a new non-profit with a broader focus then what STF has. Working on 1 small piece at a time.
02-08-07, 02:47 PM
#57
Senior Member
Me... (I don't get it.)
HH's right. You need to state your goal of your advocacy. Once you've got that down, then you have to take it to the right people. This involves knowing how the advocacy circles and government agencies are organized. Obviously the STF is not interested in advocating for road design. They might not have contacts with the local DOT, or they may have simply made the executive decision to focus only on trails.
Is there a bicycle transportation advocacy group in your area which is already established? I'd start with them, or if that is not an option, I'd go to your state representative and have him or her guide you to the correct person within the department of transportation. In fact, the state representative is probably your best bet. If you can convince him (or her) of your argument, then he is your ticket into the various government agencies which make the decisions for bicycle facilities and roads. It is that state representative's job to listen to his constituents, so you'll likely get a hearing of some sort. But like chipcom said, you have to build a coalition and make your idea appeal to the majority of the consituency.
For example, in Portland, part of the reason the BTA (Bicycle Transportation Alliance) was able to start a "bike boulevard" program in SE Portland was because it was not only the cyclists but the neighborhoods which would benefit from such a program.
HH's right. You need to state your goal of your advocacy. Once you've got that down, then you have to take it to the right people. This involves knowing how the advocacy circles and government agencies are organized. Obviously the STF is not interested in advocating for road design. They might not have contacts with the local DOT, or they may have simply made the executive decision to focus only on trails.
Is there a bicycle transportation advocacy group in your area which is already established? I'd start with them, or if that is not an option, I'd go to your state representative and have him or her guide you to the correct person within the department of transportation. In fact, the state representative is probably your best bet. If you can convince him (or her) of your argument, then he is your ticket into the various government agencies which make the decisions for bicycle facilities and roads. It is that state representative's job to listen to his constituents, so you'll likely get a hearing of some sort. But like chipcom said, you have to build a coalition and make your idea appeal to the majority of the consituency.
For example, in Portland, part of the reason the BTA (Bicycle Transportation Alliance) was able to start a "bike boulevard" program in SE Portland was because it was not only the cyclists but the neighborhoods which would benefit from such a program.
__________________
Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter
Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter
02-08-07, 03:01 PM
#58
Banned.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: San Diego
Posts: 13,075
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by N_C
Did anyone else besides HH not understand the problem I am trying to solve? Anyone?
Alright here it is spelled out in as plain of english as I can come up with:
The problem with STF is it's focus is too narrow. They are only focusing on the trail system as the big picture. When they should have a broader picture then this. It is fine to only work on one small piece of the big pciture at a time. But STF is only working on trails, nothing more, nothing less. They should inlude in their big picture all things related to bicycle & pedestrian facilities, not just the trail system.
There you have it. The problem with STF. Rather then try to change STF, which I know will not happen I am thinking of creating a new non-profit with a broader focus then what STF has. Working on 1 small piece at a time.
The problem with STF is it's focus is too narrow. They are only focusing on the trail system as the big picture. When they should have a broader picture then this. It is fine to only work on one small piece of the big pciture at a time. But STF is only working on trails, nothing more, nothing less. They should inlude in their big picture all things related to bicycle & pedestrian facilities, not just the trail system.
There you have it. The problem with STF. Rather then try to change STF, which I know will not happen I am thinking of creating a new non-profit with a broader focus then what STF has. Working on 1 small piece at a time.
Again, it's not about getting me to understand it. It's about getting you to understand it well enough so that you could explain it clearly to someone like me. I just happen to be here as your guinea pig. And this guinea pig is here to tell you, you have not explained the problem you are trying to solve.
You're assuming it's obvious why it's a problem that the STF is focussed only on the trailed system, that they're not taking a broader perspective. But even if it's obvious (which to me it isn't), you should be able to explain it, if you understand it as well as you should.
Did you see the moving "Philadelphia"? Denzel Washington has a great line where he is having trouble trying to get a witness to think about and answer something very fundamental and finally gets him to do it by saying, "explain this to me like I'm a four-year-old, okay?"
That's what I'm asking you to do. Explain to me the problem with no one being focused on bike/ped facilities except the trail system like I'm a four-year-old, okay?
Another way to do it is by completing the following sentence.
The problem with no one being focused on bike/ped facilities (except the STF and the trail system) is that ________________.
02-08-07, 11:21 PM
#59
totally louche
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: A land that time forgot
Posts: 18,023
Bikes: the ever shifting stable loaded with comfortable road bikes and city and winter bikes
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 10 Times
in
9 Posts
NC, its not a problem, its the status quo that's subpar. don't listen to helmet head.
the issue doesn't have to be stated as a problem, just improvements to the status quo. bringing the entire community in as benefactors to your pledges (schoolkids, quality of pedestrians, quality of life in your little burg, ) WILL bring allies to your cause.
the issue doesn't have to be stated as a problem, just improvements to the status quo. bringing the entire community in as benefactors to your pledges (schoolkids, quality of pedestrians, quality of life in your little burg, ) WILL bring allies to your cause.
02-08-07, 11:29 PM
#60
Banned.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Bannation, forever.
Posts: 2,887
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Bekologist
NC, its not a problem, its the status quo that's subpar. don't listen to helmet head.
the issue doesn't have to be stated as a problem, just improvements to the status quo. bringing the entire community in as benefactors to your pledges (schoolkids, quality of pedestrians, quality of life in your little burg, ) WILL bring allies to your cause.
the issue doesn't have to be stated as a problem, just improvements to the status quo. bringing the entire community in as benefactors to your pledges (schoolkids, quality of pedestrians, quality of life in your little burg, ) WILL bring allies to your cause.
Bek, I also ask that you & HH not bicker, fight & debate your differances in this thread. I know a thread can take on a life of it's own & all of a sudden go all sorts of directions after seemingly only going in one. But please not here.
02-08-07, 11:37 PM
#61
totally louche
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: A land that time forgot
Posts: 18,023
Bikes: the ever shifting stable loaded with comfortable road bikes and city and winter bikes
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 10 Times
in
9 Posts
I believe all my comments (with the exception of referencing HH's tendency to post loaded polls in A&S) have been attempts at being helpful, N_C.
you've got to build your constituent base by showing the community at large what benefits your plan will bring. looking at it as a problem is not worthwhile, becuase the community probably doesn't look at the status quo as a problem.
I think emotional tie ins would help bring in a broader base..... parents with kids, make an emotional pitch to their memories of riding bikes as kids, for example....
"remember the innocence of childhood, when you could ride your bike to school and your parents thought it was the most natural thing in the world, for kids to be out riding bikes after school? Our local streets have become a far cry from those memories."
just one suggestion....
you've got to build your constituent base by showing the community at large what benefits your plan will bring. looking at it as a problem is not worthwhile, becuase the community probably doesn't look at the status quo as a problem.
I think emotional tie ins would help bring in a broader base..... parents with kids, make an emotional pitch to their memories of riding bikes as kids, for example....
"remember the innocence of childhood, when you could ride your bike to school and your parents thought it was the most natural thing in the world, for kids to be out riding bikes after school? Our local streets have become a far cry from those memories."
just one suggestion....
