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Old 02-28-07, 09:04 PM   #1
FlyingAnchor
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Siping? Can it be done?

I found this at a major tire chain and wondered if it has ever been done to a bicycle tire and what effect it may have had. Do you think it is viable for us?

http://www.lesschwab.com/siping.asp

Discuss.
Steven
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Old 02-28-07, 10:18 PM   #2
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Sounds like free beef to me.
Here is what Sheldon Brown says about tread on bike tires (tyres).
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Old 03-01-07, 12:50 AM   #3
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As I understand it, sipping has two purposes. 1) to allow water to escape from under the tire on a microscale level (as opposed to the macroscale, or bulk level with the tire treads), and 2) to keep heat from building up inside the tread.

Bike tires, as far as I know, have neither one of these problems. The tire is curved, so water has no trouble escaping from under the tire, even on the microscale level, and the principle wear mechanism is from friction rather than from heat, as a bike tire tread is much softer than a car tire's.

So I don't think that sipping will help with bike tires.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:44 AM   #4
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I think if the tires were siped for for/aft traction, then they might help a bit on ice.. but at all other times, the rubber would feel squirmy. Also the wear rate would really increase.
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Old 03-01-07, 10:23 AM   #5
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Everything that they claim is an issue for care tires doesn't apply to bike tires. Not even a little bit. Sounds like a very nice scam to punch a few useless holes in a tire. But hey, just send my your tires, and I will sipe them for the low low price of $29.99. I have a set of exacto knives just sitting in the case.
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Old 03-01-07, 03:03 PM   #6
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that's a bunch of bullcrap to cheat people out of their money.

it doesn't have any benefit (despite the marketing claims) for car tires, much less any bicycle tire.

most car tires already have siping in the tread or have other design traits to specifically give "Improved Braking!" "Better Traction!" and "Smoother Ride!"

manufacturers spend a ton of money making sure of this. they put alot of reasearch into which tread and compound designs give the best combination of braking, traction and smooth ride. you can't excel in all three! a tire with great traction and breaking will have a harsh, noisy ride with decreased life. a tire with great comfort, low noise and long treadwear will suffer in the braking and handling department.

the only thing aftermarket siping will do to your tires is make them overheat. contrary to Les Schwab's BS claim, putting a thousand tiny cuts in your tires creates much more friction, and in turn, overheating.

let the tire manufacturers do their job (surprisingly, they actually know what they're doing!), become educated and put these snake oil vendors out of business. this siping belongs with Slick 50, The Tornado and the Gas Saving Pill.

it's just another marketing ploy these chain auto-care stores come up with to make more money off a customers' ignorance.
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Old 03-01-07, 03:16 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G60
this siping belongs with...The Tornado
But the old granny in her Geo Metro got a speeding ticket using it. It MUST add horsepower

(Yes, I admit it. I can't help but watch infomercials sometimes)
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Old 03-01-07, 04:13 PM   #8
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Quote:
Gas Saving Pill.
Wait! There's a gas saving pill? Oh, yes here it is.

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Old 03-01-07, 05:17 PM   #9
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Siping WAS common practice for tireshops back in the day (when I was a kid), ie before tires were modeled and computer simulated blah blah..and it is still very useful for truckers running retreads. In fact, the only tire shops around here that do siping, are the same ones that sell tires for commercial trucks.

Also, lots of 4x4 enthusiasts will sipe their blocky mud tires for rock crawling.
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Old 03-01-07, 09:30 PM   #10
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Well glad I never really thought of doing this, I just was surfing and saw that ad.
So, what are the odds of the Mets winning the pennant this year?
Steven
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Old 03-02-07, 09:39 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingAnchor
Well glad I never really thought of doing this, I just was surfing and saw that ad.
So, what are the odds of the Mets winning the pennant this year?
Steven

slim to none. Ryan Howard and Chase Utley and a combined 95 homeruns will take the Phillies to victory!
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Old 03-02-07, 10:42 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by slowandsteady
slim to none. Ryan Howard and Chase Utley and a combined 95 homeruns will take the Phillies to victory!
Or in other words, about the same as the Toronto Maple Leafs winning the Stanley Cup....
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Old 03-02-07, 12:16 PM   #13
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BTW Les Schwab is actually a very large PNW regional tire manufacturer, distributor and dealer, based in Prineville, Oregon. And ain't it the American way to try and sell the public something they don't really need?
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Old 03-02-07, 04:23 PM   #14
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I sipe the tires on my truck. Say what you will whether or not you think it works, I don't care because I know it does.

I'm not sure it would work on cars, and I know for certain it wont work on bikes but for my truck that weighs around two tonnes, and is pushed over boulders, up large loose hills and through creeks/ponds and mud bogs it is a great thing.
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Old 03-03-07, 09:41 PM   #15
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if bike tires don't hydroplane, why did Ullrich skid out in the final TT in the '03 Tour?
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Old 03-04-07, 08:13 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpedaler
if bike tires don't hydroplane, why did Ullrich skid out in the final TT in the '03 Tour?
Uh, because the inertia of his fat ass trying to continue moving in a straight line was sufficient to overcome his tires' grip on the pavement?
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Old 03-04-07, 08:58 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpedaler
if bike tires don't hydroplane, why did Ullrich skid out in the final TT in the '03 Tour?
The road was slick from rain; not the same. Hydroplaning is different; it's when a bulk of water gets trapped between the tire and the road and there is no contact between the tire and the road. Cars get this because the tire is wide with flat treads. At high speeds (>~50mph), water gets trapped under the treads and lifts the tire off the road. It happens to cars on freeways a lot. Bike tires are round in profile and so intrinsically forces water out from under the tire, and further more, they don't very often get up to speeds great enough to cause hydroplaning.
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Old 03-05-07, 12:36 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff
The road was slick from rain; not the same. Hydroplaning is different; it's when a bulk of water gets trapped between the tire and the road and there is no contact between the tire and the road. Cars get this because the tire is wide with flat treads. At high speeds (>~50mph), water gets trapped under the treads and lifts the tire off the road. It happens to cars on freeways a lot. Bike tires are round in profile and so intrinsically forces water out from under the tire, and further more, they don't very often get up to speeds great enough to cause hydroplaning.

Because of the shape and size of a bike tire, you need to be going over 175 mph for it to hydroplane. It is a non-issue for bikes.
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Old 03-05-07, 12:51 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by slowandsteady
Because of the shape and size of a bike tire, you need to be going over 175 mph for it to hydroplane. It is a non-issue for bikes.
Man... I do that every day on my commute...
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Old 03-07-07, 02:43 PM   #20
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Man... I do that every day on my commute...

Yeah, me too. But since my handling skills are so spectacular it isn't an issue for me.
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