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what one thing would you do to make things better for cyclists?

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what one thing would you do to make things better for cyclists?

Old 03-18-07, 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted by rando
let's say you have one wish and *POOF* things would instantly change in your community. what would you wish for to make things better for cyclists in your community?
Well...there are many things ya can do. To me one thing to do is set a good example when you are in your car. Reasonable speed, passing with caution and giving as much space as possible, and treating cyclists as if they were legimitate road users.

Similarly as a cyclist, I try and be as aware of the road around me as possible; ride as carefully and courteously as I can.

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Old 03-18-07, 10:08 PM
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$10/gallon gas for private vehicles.
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Old 03-19-07, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by sbhikes
A comprehensive network of bikeways, lined with natural vegetation, so you can ride anywhere you want in peace and quiet or listen to your headphones and actually HEAR the music, and see hawks flying above, critters skittering below, hear birds, watch ducks in the creek or dolphins in the ocean, smell flowers, see and FEEL the changing of the seasons.
Let's not overdo the "natural vegetation" . It's already too easy to hit you head on a tree limb, or get your eye gouged out by a branch.

But I guess since your riding a recumbent and wearing Oakleys, that doesn't concern you.
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Old 03-19-07, 03:45 PM
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Real driver education and training. Graduated licensing with difficult tests. In areas of the world where this is practiced, it makes a much bigger difference than multiple air bags and traction control.

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Old 03-19-07, 03:58 PM
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death penalty for bike thieves.
by lethal anal-probe injection.
i'm thinking the WWE's leftover barbed-wire-wrapped baseball bats....
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Old 03-19-07, 05:06 PM
  #31  
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I would like some real research into how to design roads to accept multimodal traffic (cars, bikes, peds). So far, most the efforts have been somewhat of a cross between "rule of thumb", guesswork/experience, and hit-and-miss. I say this because the most common complaint is "well cyclists have only themselves to blame for getting hit - the road just isn't built for bicycles, it is the realm of cars..." or something to that extent. So, why not start building roads to accept of all forms of transportation.

But some real money should go into this, starting at the university level and working its way up to implementation on the street. It is a real engineering problem, mixing cars and bikes, and cycling must, at some point, be depoliticized and get some real, ol' fashion, nuts and bolts research. We have too many amateur "experts", too many "general purpose" advocates, and way too little research and development going on.
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Old 03-19-07, 05:20 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff
I would like some real research into how to design roads to accept multimodal traffic (cars, bikes, peds). So far, most the efforts have been somewhat of a cross between "rule of thumb", guesswork/experience, and hit-and-miss. I say this because the most common complaint is "well cyclists have only themselves to blame for getting hit - the road just isn't built for bicycles, it is the realm of cars..." or something to that extent. So, why not start building roads to accept of all forms of transportation.

But some real money should go into this, starting at the university level and working its way up to implementation on the street. It is a real engineering problem, mixing cars and bikes, and cycling must, at some point, be depoliticized and get some real, ol' fashion, nuts and bolts research. We have too many amateur "experts", too many "general purpose" advocates, and way too little research and development going on.
Just to be clear, by "multimodal" you mean trimodal (cars, bikes, peds) as opposed to bimodal (vehicular, peds), right?

It's not an engineering problem. It's a basic math problem. Assuming you want to provide continuous segregated routes, as much as possible, for each mode, it's the intersections that are the problem. The intersections are a problem for just a single mode problem. The engineering problem is that we're trying to do this on essentially a single plane. That means you have to stop certain flows across an intersection to allow another through (stop signs, traffic signals). The alternative is much more expensive; grade separation.

When you add a second mode to the problem, that complicates the problem. Others understand this, and so seek to eliminate cars, for example.

But adding a third mode, that's really impractical. You either have impractically expensive multi-grade solutions at intersections, or you have to allow mode-specific flows at intersections, adding delay for everyone. Again, this is already a problem in just a bimodal system (consider how many peds are killed per year).

Adding a third mode to bimodal transportation system complicates everything by probably an order of magnitude. That makes it impractical.
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Old 03-19-07, 05:22 PM
  #33  
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Here we go. Do you really have to correct peoples wishes too?
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Old 03-19-07, 05:22 PM
  #34  
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Multi modal should also include transit such as busses, street cars, light rail, etc. Plus freight, which is a separate category from passenger vehicles.
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Old 03-19-07, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by goinfs
I'd wish that the 5% of selfish and idiot cyclists would start sharing the road in a respectful manner so they wouldn't give the other 95% of us such a bad reputaion with motorists who also have a 5% population of selfish and idiotic people who give them a bad reputation with us.
How novel. realizing it is a small percentage of jerks driving either kind of vehicle. A great dream.

Near the other end is what I'd wish for. Well maintained streets. Helps both cars and bikes.
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Old 03-19-07, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by chipcom
Here we go. Do you really have to correct peoples wishes too?
Brian's "wish" seemed serious... and problematic...
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Old 03-19-07, 05:30 PM
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My wish: fix the pot holes and the sensors that don't detect cyclists.
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Old 03-19-07, 05:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Helmet Head
Brian's "wish" seemed serious... and problematic...
See if I share my letters to Santa with you - stay away from my grandkids at Christmas, k?
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Old 03-19-07, 05:47 PM
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Trimodal? No. Multimodal, in the sense of Randya's post above.

Is the problem difficult? Of course. Does this mean we shy away? No. Otherwise we would never have FEA and CFD designed bicycles weighing 17 lbs (who in the world would want a 17 lb bicycle, and why apply aerospace design tools on something as little as a bicycle; you know, those tools cost several $10,000 for a single seat for a single year). We wouldn't have modern cars (make an engine block out of aluminum? Impossible! Stick with steel as the design problems are an order of magnitude less. Aluminum is utterly impractical).

And I think, HH, you are mistaking my mind's eye vision. If you are thinking any thoughts revolving around bike lanes, you are wrong. I didn't color this wish with a preconcieved notion of the solution! In my mind's eye, I am just now getting my arms wrapped around the problem. I don't know the solution. But I can tell that all attempts at it so far are only partial solutions. But really, what's the fun in solving a problem if the solution is already known?

And how in the world is this not an engineering problem?

Basic math problem... That talk's for quitters .
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Old 03-19-07, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Helmet Head
Brian's "wish" seemed serious... and problematic...
Of course it is serious. How is calling for more research into a very real problem problematic? Do you think the DOT's around the country puts roads in willy nilly without a single iota of research backing the road design?

I have yet to see a serious and well funded attempt at researching the problem of putting bicycles and drivers on the same road in a frictionless way.
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Old 03-19-07, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff
Trimodal? No. Multimodal, in the sense of Randya's post above.

Is the problem difficult? Of course. Does this mean we shy away? No. Otherwise we would never have FEA and CFD designed bicycles weighing 17 lbs (who in the world would want a 17 lb bicycle, and why apply aerospace design tools on something as little as a bicycle; you know, those tools cost several $10,000 for a single seat for a single year). We wouldn't have modern cars (make an engine block out of aluminum? Impossible! Stick with steel as the design problems are an order of magnitude less. Aluminum is utterly impractical).

And I think, HH, you are mistaking my mind's eye vision. If you are thinking any thoughts revolving around bike lanes, you are wrong. I didn't color this wish with a preconcieved notion of the solution! In my mind's eye, I am just now getting my arms wrapped around the problem. I don't know the solution. But I can tell that all attempts at it so far are only partial solutions. But really, what's the fun in solving a problem if the solution is already known?

And how in the world is this not an engineering problem?

Basic math problem... That talk's for quitters .
I didn't think you were thinking bike lanes.

But no research is required to understand the basic problem. We know what it takes to add another mode to an existing transport system. Look at any railroad system. Or how about a subway... that's right, use a separate plain (I've long called for the undergrounding of all motor vehicles - wouldn't that be nice?).

There just aren't that many categories of choices. You either spend inordinate resources to handle the new mode entirely separatedly (like a railroad, and just as limited in terms of source, destination and route), or the freeway system, you put it on a separate plain (like a subway, or the Disneyland monorail), or you (and everyone else) takes the hit (literally) at intersections, either with multi-grade/multi-mode facilities, or with added delays.

There is no other way.
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Old 03-19-07, 06:03 PM
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I wish most cyclists considered themselves to be vehicles and not do things like.....riding at night without lights, ride on the sidewalk, pass on the right then yell at the motorists who almost turns right into them etc.
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Old 03-19-07, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Helmet Head
I didn't think you were thinking bike lanes.
Good.

But no research is required to understand the basic problem. We know what it takes to add another mode to an existing transport system. Look at any railroad system. Or how about a subway... that's right, use a separate plain (I've long called for the undergrounding of all motor vehicles - wouldn't that be nice?).

There just aren't that many categories of choices. You either spend inordinate resources to handle the new mode entirely separatedly (like a railroad, and just as limited in terms of source, destination and route), or the freeway system, you put it on a separate plain (like a subway, or the Disneyland monorail), or you (and everyone else) takes the hit (literally) at intersections, either with multi-grade/multi-mode facilities, or with added delays.

There is no other way.
You have some understanding of the problem then. That's the first step. You know the old adage about bicycle components, that you have cheap, light, and durable, choose any two? Engineering is about having all three. Nobody said the solution was easy or obvious.
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Old 03-19-07, 06:11 PM
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there was a picture in my "Amsterdam" thread of a median bikeway in Bogota. maybe that's a concept to pursue. there's always going to be challenges and problems. there's not going to be a perfect system, ever.... but I think it's time to try some new things. the old ways sure haven't worked, and won't work for anything but an autocentric society.
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Old 03-19-07, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by rando
there was a picture in my "Amsterdam" thread of a median bikeway in Bogota.
There are also a number of median bikeways in Barcelona, Spain.
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Old 03-19-07, 08:48 PM
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OK, people, let's get back on subject -- impossible dream wish list, not a discussion of bike-friendly road facilities! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !

(some of you could kill the buzz of a hummer....)
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Old 03-19-07, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by chipcom
Free pie at work for all bicycle commuters.
Before I support this statement I must know that kind of pie.
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Old 03-19-07, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by donnamb
Since we're talking about a wish here... A comprehensive driver's education curriculum that all people who want a driver's license must take. Begin preparing at a young age with good pedestrian and cyclist education in grade school. Mandatory written and road tests every 5 years required in order to renew driver's license.

Hey, anyone have a magic want I could borrow? I've misplaced mine.
I have a magic...er...

I mean...

I agree with education beginning at a very young age. The founder of the children's theatre I volunteer for believed that if you taught children kindness at a young age, they would go up practicing it. I am a very strong believer in that.

If children grew up with tolerance and respect to cyclists, when they became adults, they would likely be more open to A) cycling, B) research into cycling friendly facilities.
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Originally Posted by Bklyn
Obviously, the guy's like a 12th level white wizard or something. His mere presence is a danger to mortals.
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Old 03-20-07, 07:47 AM
  #49  
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I have a dream...

For all operators of all vehicles to behave as if they have a heart & a soul, to drive like their safety and the safety of others is important. For all operators to know, understand and obey the laws. To have kindness and courtesy become commonplace once more.








But I ain't gonna hold my breath on this one.
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Old 03-20-07, 08:05 AM
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