kuan

From: https://www2.steamboatpilot.com/news/...ness/#comments

Read the comments at the bottom.

Mr. Underbridge

What specifically makes you angry? The cyclists riding like morons or the people making rational comments about how bad behavior irritates them?

Those posts sounded a lot more rational than the "OMFG JAMs should die LOL!" posts you'll see in this forum all too often.

Dchiefransom

It IS interesting that the motorists actually believe that cyclists calling law enforcment ever results in anything happening.

Tom Stormcrowe

I tend to think it should cut both ways! JAM's and JAB's should be treated equally! They are both classes of

Daily Commute

Cyclists who violate the law deserve tickets, but I think many motorists are unaware of 1) just how frequently motorists violate the law; and 2) cyclists have the right to use the road, even when that slows down a motorist.

The commenter complains that cyclists regularly run red lights, but drivers are horrible. When Columbus put up red light cameras at just a few intersections, the lights caught thousands of violations. Watch any non-monitored traffic light, and you'll see cars run the red light almost every cycle. Watch any stop sign in non-busy traffic (and sometimes in even busy traffic), and see how few cars actually come to a complete stop. That doesn't even count speeders, and motorists take it as their God-given right to drive 5 or 10 mph over the speed limit.

Some motorists also think it's their God-given right never to be slowed down by a cyclist. If cyclists have a long line of traffic behind them on a country road, they should let the cars pass, but that's about it. My safety is more important than a few seconds of a motorist's time. I don't think I've ever delayed a motorist by more than 30 seconds.

As to registration, when cyclists have a record of inflicting carnage on others equal to that of motorists, give me a call.

Bekologist

motorists who violate the law deserve tickets. when the motorists man up and stand up to equal scrutiny of their operating on the roads according to the rules, bring on the bike license.

Mr. Underbridge

I wouldn't necessarily be against the notion of some sort of licensing for cyclists who want to ride on roads. Hell, even the VC crowd should be OK with that.

I'm not seeing the quid pro quo you're referring to. Do you mean we'll accept licensing when they accept us on the road? That certainly sounds fair.

Dchiefransom

They might be referring to attaching a large license plate somewhere on the bike. My guess would be it would require installation of fenders or a similar brakect.

Bekologist

motorists complain about bicyclists 'not following the rules' while turning a blind eye to all the transgressions committed by motorists everyday like running red lights, rolling stop signs, speeding, unsafe lane changes, etc.

joejack951

Sounds like those motorists sure know how to drive. Situational awareness is all you need to break the rules and motorists obviously have it in droves since they are rarely harmed by their manuevers. Oh wait, you only defend cyclists who act like idiots.

Bekologist

I'm all for adaptive cycling, true. adaptive motoring, not so much. there's a lot more leeway on a bicycle by nature of its abilities to move between traffic lanes, onto and off sidewalks, etc.

I don't complain when motorists cross a double yellow to pass me, joe.

abolish the double standard expected by motorists of bicyclists.

Bekologist

most motorists expect better operating standards from bicyclists than their fellow motorists.

genec

+1 says it all for me.

bragi

I don't support licensing for bicyclists at all. Licensing doesn't seem to have eradicated poor behavior on the part of motorists, and I'd much rather not have that extra expense, not to mention the extra layers of irritating beauraucracy (sp). I got rid of the car in part to put all that nonsense behind me, thank you very much....

AEO

Driving/Bicycling lessons/licsenses would not be a bad idea for the general public who have no idea how bikes are supposed to work with motorized traffic.

I for one got briefed in one driving lesson, yes driving lesson, about what to expect from bicycles and how we are supposed to watch out for them. Until that driving lesson I didn't know I was supposed to behave like a vehicle when on my bicycle. This was at 18, driving was legal at 16 in Ontario.

maddyfish

Just stop at the stop signs and lights.

Mr. Underbridge

I don't think that's true at all. I drive, and complain often about the stupidity of my fellow drivers. That's one of the things that's compelled me to commute on bike, in fact.

Minorities often make the mistake of thinking that the majority see themselves as some sort of harmonious, cohesive 'club.' Not the case. Here, bikers often see drivers as a united group, when in fact many drivers are intolerant of anyone around them regardless of their means of transport.

Drivers cut each other off, flip each other off, scream at each other all the time. Hate to say it, we're not special in receiving that treatment.

littlewaywelt

+1
The same guy that buzzes a rider or honks at him is the same guy that speeds up to block someone else's pass on the highway, won't let someone in at a lane merge, waits till the last second to merge, uses the shoulder to get around traffic, etc etc. A jam is a jam. Bikes are just one more thing in this type of driver's way.

ghettocruiser

No argument there. I think they treat each other way worse than they treat us, actually.

The rub is that some of these drivers (and select people on this forum) seem to rank cyclist infractions at stopsigns and on sidewalks as somehow worse than the perpetual speeding, tailgating and red-light blowing of motorists.

Mr. Underbridge

I think cyclists expect better behavior from fellow cyclists who should theoretically "know better" after being on the receiving end of a lot of dangerous behavior from motorists.

I do think there is a certain class of cyclist who displays far worse behavior than I usually see on the roads - I've never seen a car (or even motorcyclist) drive 20mph the wrong way on a sidewalk or pass on the right - without slowing down - at a stopsign. I've never seen a driver blow through every stoplight they see. And I do believe there's a relatively small minority of cyclists who see going anywhere they want any way they want as their birthright. Just my perception.

ghettocruiser

Again though, I have to question the *ranking of offences*.

Why is a bike doing 30 kph on a sidewalk *worse* than a car doing 80 in a 50 zone? Were there people walking on the sidewalk? Was there a crosswalk or school zone where the speeding was talking place?

Why is a bike "blowing" a stop sign at 25 kph *worse* than a car slowing down from 60 kph to 25 kph to "roll" through? Did either of them look in all directions? Did either of them care?

When people rank offences on their own little scale without this kind of additional information, it sounds less like concern for public safety and more like pushing of agendas.

Boss Moniker

Interesting. Something else I noticed, is that many motorists cite cyclists riding two abreast as a major problem, especially when they do not move over, or ride single file.

Now in my experience, I have NEVER had a problem with this while driving. I even frequently drive a stretch of road that is famous nationally for great biking, many clubs ride it, and there's no shoulder, but every time I see cyclists riding abreast (which is rare), they immediately form a single file line. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but I think some cultural phenomenon has caused all these motorists to add this offense to their list of grievances against cyclists. Maybe a Dane Cook joke or something.

What about you guys? I've experienced many a JAC, but never in this instance.

joejack951

First, do you believe a cyclist (or pair) is a JAC(s) if they don't go single file? If so, why? In many states, there's no legal obligation to go single file unless the passing lane is being blocked. If you are crossing the centerline to pass, why do you care if the cyclists are two abreast or not?

Mr. Underbridge

1. I'd say, on average, piloting a vehicle along a sidewalk at 30 kph will cause many more collisions than driving 80kph in a 50 kph zone. That depends on the average traffic speed and traffic density, however. So that's my answer. If you need to ride on the sidewalk for a short stretch, keep it under 15 kph. If you're doing 30 kph, you're fast enough to get on the road.

2. It's not, and I don't know anyone purporting that either.

ChipSeal

I agree. If an overtaking car must encroach into oncoming lanes to pass a single cyclist (riding center right on a shoulder-less lane), then two cyclists riding abreast impede traffic to an equal extent. However, motorists will seldom notice this truth.

Cyclists ride two abreast to in order to enjoy conversation with one another. Passengers in cars generally sit in the front seat in order to enjoy conversation with the driver. Perhaps the real problem is the width of motor vehicles! If they weren't so egotistical to demand side by side seating in their vehicles it would be easier to share the road.