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  1. #1
    Tom (ex)Builder twahl's Avatar
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    Think cycling examples don't matter to drivers? Think again.

    I was on the way home yesterday from a grocery run, in my evil SUV. I was waiting on the light in the left turn lane while cross traffic had the green. From the opposite direction comes a cyclist, more accurately a rare breed of cyclist around here; a roadie. He approaches the light, clears traffic, and procedes to blow through the light.

    When I got my green arrow (as did the car on the opposite side) and started to move to turn, the vehicle coming straight from the opposite side ran through the red light and almost creamed me.

    I tend to watch how drivers behave around cyclists, and this driver was sitting there directly watching the cyclist, and he had more of an amused look on his face than an angry one. Despite that, as soon as there was another automobile moving, he followed the cyclist.
    Tom

    "It hurts so good..."

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    Thanks for the post. That's an excellent reason not to run a red.

    It's just like crossing on a red as a pedestrian. You may know what you're doing, but the guy who follows your lead without looking could be in a lot of trouble.

  3. #3
    Commuter JohnBrooking's Avatar
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    twahl, is your title based on the novel "Pillars of the Earth"?
    Quote Originally Posted by MadfiNch on Commuting forum
    What's the point of a bike if you can only ride it on weekends, and you can't even carry anything with you?!
    Portland Maine Bicycle Commuting Meetup

  4. #4
    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    So it was the cyclist fault, that the motorist that almost creamed you, was too stupid to actually look at the traffic signal?

  5. #5
    Banned Bikepacker67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by twahl View Post
    I tend to watch how drivers behave around cyclists, and this driver was sitting there directly watching the cyclist, and he had more of an amused look on his face than an angry one.
    If I made facial movements every time I saw a cager "breaking the law" (speeding/rolling thru stopsigns/illegally passing) I'd look like a tourette sufferer having a tick fit.

    So what's your point? That cyclists should be held to a higher standard than the jackholes piloting land yachts?

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    Isn't illegal to run a red light on a bike? I see a lot of people doing this on bikes, and I wonder if it is giving us a bad name. I wonder what the people do when they see a bike in the photos that are taken to snag people who run red lights?

  7. #7
    Banned Bikepacker67's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linus_S View Post
    Isn't illegal to run a red light on a bike? I see a lot of people doing this on bikes, and I wonder if it is giving us a bad name. I wonder what the people do when they see a bike in the photos that are taken to snag people who run red lights?
    What is it with cyclist self-loathing?

    Ya... running red lights on a 25lb vehicle is a bad thing.
    So is speeding thru residential neighborhoods in a 2000lb bullet.

    You don't see car centric forums lamenting about scofflaw members lighting up rubber.

  8. #8
    Old Fogy
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    I keep hearing about these 2,000 lb cars. Exactly what cars are these that weight 2,000 lbs? I once drove a 2-CV Citreon that came close.

  9. #9
    Prefers Cicero cooker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CB HI View Post
    So it was the cyclist fault, that the motorist that almost creamed you, was too stupid to actually look at the traffic signal?
    In part, yes. We can all get suckered from time to time. I've seen several examples of people mindlessly starting to follow someone else who is crossing against a red or whatever. Sure it's their own fault, but the other person contributed to their error.

    I almost caused an accident myself to a school kid about 10 years old. I reached an intersection on foot, and the light was about to change, so I impatiently stepped from the curb and then stopped since the cars were still coming, and she saw me step into the street and started across and I had to yell at her to stop.

    My dad had an aquaintance who hated cab drivers and tried to deliberately get them in accidents, by starting forward at red lights when he was next to them.

  10. #10
    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cooker View Post
    In part, yes. We can all get suckered from time to time. I've seen several examples of people mindlessly starting to follow someone else who is crossing against a red or whatever. Sure it's their own fault, but the other person contributed to their error.

    I almost caused an accident myself to a school kid about 10 years old. I reached an intersection on foot, and the light was about to change, so I impatiently stepped from the curb and then stopped since the cars were still coming, and she saw me step into the street and started across and I had to yell at her to stop.

    My dad had an aquaintance who hated cab drivers and tried to deliberately get them in accidents, by starting forward at red lights when he was next to them.
    The story says that the driver pulled out when the left turning motorist started moving, so it must be the left turning motorist at fault rather then the clueless driver!

  11. #11
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linus_S View Post
    Isn't illegal to run a red light on a bike? I see a lot of people doing this on bikes, and I wonder if it is giving us a bad name. I wonder what the people do when they see a bike in the photos that are taken to snag people who run red lights?
    Isn't it illegal to speed in a car? I see a lot of people doing this in cars, and I wonder if it is giving drivers bad names. I wonder what the people do when they see a car in a photo taken to snag people that drive over the speed limit?


    Frankly since most motorists drive in some illegal manner some way most of the time, perhaps motorists should "worry about their own house" before ragging on other road users.

    In fact the next time some motorist brings up the "running red lights issue," just ask if they drove the speed limit or less that day, all day.

  12. #12
    Senior Member StrangeWill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by waldowales View Post
    I keep hearing about these 2,000 lb cars. Exactly what cars are these that weight 2,000 lbs? I once drove a 2-CV Citreon that came close.
    Picking the low end of the weight still has a huge effect, and makes it so you practically can't argue weights in a better light, just worse.

    And it's a fun number.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Bruce Rosar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by waldowales View Post
    Exactly what cars are these that weight 2,000 lbs?
    Lotus Elise.
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  14. #14
    Prefers Cicero cooker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CB HI View Post
    The story says that the driver pulled out when the left turning motorist started moving, so it must be the left turning motorist at fault rather then the clueless driver!
    Good point.

  15. #15
    feros ferio John E's Avatar
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    The elephant in the room is the demand-triggered traffic signal which does not respond to bicyclists.
    "Early to bed, early to rise. Work like hell, and advertise." -- George Stahlman
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  16. #16
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John E View Post
    The elephant in the room is the demand-triggered traffic signal which does not respond to bicyclists.
    But that elephant is not standing with the cyclists that are at a light that has stopped traffic, where the cyclist choses to leave early anyway.

    But I do agree that the demand-triggered light may cause appearances to be one of a cyclist running a light.

    I know more then once I have left such a light after a mandatory wait, only to have a motorist pull up moments after I am into the intersection. I would suppose in the mind of that motorist, I am a scofflaw. (BTW while sight lines are such that indeed I can see approaching motorists, I cannot tell which ones may or may not chose to slip into the LTOL at the last second)

  17. #17
    Senior Member wahoonc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cooker View Post
    In part, yes. We can all get suckered from time to time. I've seen several examples of people mindlessly starting to follow someone else who is crossing against a red or whatever. Sure it's their own fault, but the other person contributed to their error.

    I almost caused an accident myself to a school kid about 10 years old. I reached an intersection on foot, and the light was about to change, so I impatiently stepped from the curb and then stopped since the cars were still coming, and she saw me step into the street and started across and I had to yell at her to stop.

    My dad had an aquaintance who hated cab drivers and tried to deliberately get them in accidents, by starting forward at red lights when he was next to them.
    When I was bit younger I loved to get behind an inattentive driver at the stoplights and tap the horn...usually about 3 out of 5 would roll forward without looking first...interesting results and a phenomenal study of human behavior and conditioning.

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  18. #18
    Prefers Cicero cooker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wahoonc View Post
    When I was bit younger I loved to get behind an inattentive driver at the stoplights and tap the horn...usually about 3 out of 5 would roll forward without looking first...interesting results and a phenomenal study of human behavior and conditioning.

    Aaron
    Fortunately when we get older we outgrow our dangerous games.

  19. #19
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    Software for Cyclists SSP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linus_S View Post
    Isn't illegal to run a red light on a bike? I see a lot of people doing this on bikes, and I wonder if it is giving us a bad name. I wonder what the people do when they see a bike in the photos that are taken to snag people who run red lights?
    Not everywhere...in Idaho, the law allows cyclists to treat Stop signs as Yield signs, and red lights as Stop signs.

    So, in Idaho, a cyclist must come to a stop at a red light, but can proceed through the intersection if there's no other vehicles nearby with right of way.

    Personally, I think this is a good law...it encourages cycling, and legalizes what is often common practice.
    CycliStats.com - Software for Cyclists
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  20. #20
    Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by waldowales View Post
    I keep hearing about these 2,000 lb cars. Exactly what cars are these that weight 2,000 lbs? I once drove a 2-CV Citreon that came close.
    I once owned a Willys cj-2a that weighed in at 1880 lbs, very light. Far from the normal weight especially today. Newer cars are actually much heavier than then their direct counterparts from a few years ago.
    a 78 mustang weighed in at 2900lbs, an 94 mustang (actually the same size) weighed 3900lbs.

    I've noticed many people on bikes that blow through reds, always made me wonder what (if anything) they had going through their minds.

    Ken.

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