Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-24-08, 06:02 PM   #1
genec
genec
Thread Starter
 
genec's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2
Posts: 24,960
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 844 Post(s)
How many times have you heard that cyclists just don't obey stop signs?

check out this video... http://warren-t.blogspot.com/2007/08/stop.html
genec is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-08, 06:08 PM   #2
Ed Holland
8speed DinoSORAs
 
Ed Holland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Oxford, UK or Mountain View, Ca
Bikes:
Posts: 2,749
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Pretty bad behaviour...

However (and I'm all for observing traffic regulations, and practice what I preach) I detest the stop sign. It is extremely rare in Britain, where I grew up and learned about road use, so the notion of being required to stop in full, rather than yield as necessary seems absurd - although there it is, right at the bottom of my street.

In certain residential situations, I can accept how the stop sign acts to mediate traffic behaviour. The problem is one has invented a regulation that is hard to enforce.

Must go and make the dinner.

Ed
__________________
Get a bicycle. You will certainly not regret it, if you live.
Ed Holland is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-08, 06:25 PM   #3
SweetLou
Senior Member
 
SweetLou's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 2,114
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
But this video is not complete. I can't see the intersection. There might have been a cop directing traffic and waving the cars through.
I've seen both cars and bikes run stop signs. I hate when people try to explain their behavior because of the behavior of others. The, "Well, cars speed all the time, so I run red lights." is not a good argument. I do find car drivers to be hypocritical when they complain about cyclists disobeying the law when I do see more cars breaking the law then I do bikes. But that is probably because I see a lot more cars than bikes everyday.
SweetLou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-08, 12:17 AM   #4
StrangeWill
Senior Member
 
StrangeWill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Fallbrook, CA.
Bikes:
Posts: 1,112
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
"It's okay, this group of cars do it too!"

Yeah, okay, whatever.
StrangeWill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-08, 12:42 AM   #5
o-dog
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: College Park, MD
Bikes:
Posts: 535
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I should take some video of the stop sign directly outside my house. cars just blow right through it like it isn't even there, without braking or anything. some people even hit the gas while going through it.

this is a residential neighborhood that has lots of children playing outside.
o-dog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-08, 01:19 AM   #6
StrangeWill
Senior Member
 
StrangeWill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Fallbrook, CA.
Bikes:
Posts: 1,112
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by o-dog View Post
I should take some video of the stop sign directly outside my house. cars just blow right through it like it isn't even there, without braking or anything. some people even hit the gas while going through it.

this is a residential neighborhood that has lots of children playing outside.
Or pick up the phone...
StrangeWill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-08, 06:54 AM   #7
Tommyr
Older "newbie"
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Hudson Valley of NY
Bikes: Fuji Newest 4.0 just bought 7/26/08!
Posts: 157
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Same thing here in my village. I see people EVERY DAY blow through the stop signs. And there are lots of kids and pre-teens around playing too.

Guess they figure no major road="I can blow through this sign".
Tommyr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-08, 08:00 AM   #8
San Rensho 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 5,559
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Those that say that cyclists always run stop signs are simply bigotted hippocrates, they have an irrational hatred of cyclists and logic will certainly not convince them.

Cars are by far the biggest bargers of stop signs, because they outnumber cyclists, and also because the vast majority of cars think that "slowing down" for a stop is fine for them, but will go into conniptions when a cyclist does the same thing.
__________________
Il faut de l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours de l'audace

1980 3Rensho-- 1975 Raleigh Sprite 3spd
1990s Raleigh M20 MTB--2007 Windsor Hour (track)
1988 Ducati 750 F1
San Rensho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-08, 08:43 AM   #9
invisiblehand
Part-time epistemologist
 
invisiblehand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Bikes: Jamis Nova, Bike Friday NWT, STRIDA, Austro Daimler Vent Noir, Haluzak Horizon, Salsa La Raza, Hollands Tourer, Bike Friday tikit
Posts: 5,636
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Sure drivers are hypocrites. Cyclists are hypocrites too. I think by nature, many people hold others to higher standards than themselves. Since drivers and cyclists are people ...

Nevertheless, I like the video. Stuff like that is helpful. Although such blatant behavior is atypical around here.
__________________
A narrative on bicycle driving.
invisiblehand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-08, 09:13 AM   #10
cc_rider
Calamari to go
 
cc_rider's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Falls Church, VA
Bikes: Trek 750
Posts: 3,107
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
In the 15 miles I've driven this morning I've seen two cars run stops signs, eight cars not come to a complete stop at a sign, one car run a red light, four cars not stop before a right turn on red, many failures to signal a lane change or a turn, and too many speeders and tailgaters to count.

Are all drivers scum???
cc_rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-08, 09:29 AM   #11
ghettocruiser
Former Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: dropmachine.com
Bikes:
Posts: 4,062
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Actually, if there was no opposing traffic present.... those rolling stops are average or better by Toronto standards.

This is more typical of the "respect" that stopping at a stop sign gets you here.
ghettocruiser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-08, 07:59 PM   #12
crhilton
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
Bikes: '07 Trek 1500, '08 Surly Cross Check, '09 Masi Speciale Sprint custom build
Posts: 4,568
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by SweetLou View Post
But this video is not complete. I can't see the intersection. There might have been a cop directing traffic and waving the cars through.
I've seen both cars and bikes run stop signs. I hate when people try to explain their behavior because of the behavior of others. The, "Well, cars speed all the time, so I run red lights." is not a good argument. I do find car drivers to be hypocritical when they complain about cyclists disobeying the law when I do see more cars breaking the law then I do bikes. But that is probably because I see a lot more cars than bikes everyday.
Yea, you sort of have to believe the author. It's a bit better than the evidence presented against cyclists. It usually goes like this: "Cyclists never stop at stop signs, I'll like eat my own shorts if I see one stop, really stop, at a stop sign or stop light when they don't have to."
crhilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-08, 10:21 AM   #13
dynaryder
PatronSaintOfDiscBrakes
 
dynaryder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: BicycleSPACE warehouse in SW Washington DC
Bikes:
Posts: 6,983
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cc_rider View Post
In the 15 miles I've driven this morning I've seen two cars run stops signs, eight cars not come to a complete stop at a sign, one car run a red light, four cars not stop before a right turn on red, many failures to signal a lane change or a turn, and too many speeders and tailgaters to count.

Are all drivers scum???
No,you're in the DC metro area.

And if you were to tell any of them that what they were doing was illegal,they would've threatened to run you over.
__________________

C'dale BBU('05 and '09)/Super Six/Hooligan8and 3,Kona Dew Deluxe,Novara Buzz/Safari,Surly Big Dummy,Marin Pt Reyes,Giant Defy 1,Schwinn DBX SuperSport,Dahon Speed Pro TT,Brompton S6L/S2E-X
dynaryder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-08, 10:43 AM   #14
flipped4bikes
ROM 6:23
 
flipped4bikes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Coastal Maine
Bikes: Specialized Tricross Comp, Lemond Tourmalet, Bridgestone MB-5
Posts: 1,713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by invisiblehand View Post
Sure drivers are hypocrites. Cyclists are hypocrites too. I think by nature, many people hold others to higher standards than themselves. Since drivers and cyclists are people ...

Nevertheless, I like the video. Stuff like that is helpful. Although such blatant behavior is atypical around here.
+1. All I have to do is watch a stop light outside of my work. I see so many cyclists blow the red, even when it's been that way for 30 seconds, it's embarassing. But I also see drivers blow the red a few seconds after it's turned from yellow. Bad left turns, the I-totally-paused-right-on-reds, using the center lane as their own personal travel lane. And pedestrians, totally jaywalking, ignoring flow of traffic, I'm entitled to crossing the sidewalk against the light.
flipped4bikes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-08, 11:03 AM   #15
genec
genec
Thread Starter
 
genec's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2
Posts: 24,960
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 844 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by flipped4bikes View Post
+1. All I have to do is watch a stop light outside of my work. I see so many cyclists blow the red, even when it's been that way for 30 seconds, it's embarassing. But I also see drivers blow the red a few seconds after it's turned from yellow. Bad left turns, the I-totally-paused-right-on-reds, using the center lane as their own personal travel lane. And pedestrians, totally jaywalking, ignoring flow of traffic, I'm entitled to crossing the sidewalk against the light.
Sure, all this happens and it is the reality of human nature... BUT... only motorists hold it against cyclists... dangle it in front of us as "you are so bad..."

Of course obviously we give it right back. (as in this thread).

But the basis for so much of the lack of acceptance (even rage) comes down to a perceived ownership of the road by motorists based on their belief that they pay "road taxes" and always obey the laws. Neither of which is true.

So to motorists... stop flying that red flag... and share the road.

Bottom line, next time you get that same old tired argument... just remember, it's all BS.
genec is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-08, 11:30 AM   #16
flipped4bikes
ROM 6:23
 
flipped4bikes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Coastal Maine
Bikes: Specialized Tricross Comp, Lemond Tourmalet, Bridgestone MB-5
Posts: 1,713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
No argument from me, genec. As long as motorists are safely behind their steel cage and we have nothing to protect us except common sense and a bunch of blinkies and bright clothing, we're always going to be more vulnerable.
flipped4bikes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-08, 11:37 AM   #17
Hickeydog
Crushing souls
 
Hickeydog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sagamore Hills, Ohio.
Bikes: Trek 1500
Posts: 1,591
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
It helps if you avoid talking to any non-cyclist.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wordbiker View Post

What's frightening is how coherent Hickey was in posting that.
Hickeydog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-08, 11:40 AM   #18
genec
genec
Thread Starter
 
genec's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2
Posts: 24,960
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 844 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hickeydog View Post
It helps if you avoid talking to any non-cyclist.
They talk to me. Somehow they feel they understand better how I should ride my bike.
genec is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-08, 12:19 PM   #19
invisiblehand
Part-time epistemologist
 
invisiblehand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Bikes: Jamis Nova, Bike Friday NWT, STRIDA, Austro Daimler Vent Noir, Haluzak Horizon, Salsa La Raza, Hollands Tourer, Bike Friday tikit
Posts: 5,636
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dynaryder View Post
No,you're in the DC metro area.

And if you were to tell any of them that what they were doing was illegal,they would've threatened to run you over.
__________________
A narrative on bicycle driving.
invisiblehand is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:27 AM.