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Old 11-03-08, 08:05 AM   #1
genec
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I wonder if cars like this will lower speed limits...

OK apparently there is enough oil to sell gas at less than $3.00 a gallon, for now. It is a limited resource however. So are car manufactures going to go to vehicles like this:

http://green.yahoo.com/blog/ecogeek/...ly-peapod.html

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The Peapod will be available as a one-seater, two-seater or utility van and has a 30-mile range per charge. The car was developed by Chrysler-owned Green Eco Mobility (GEM) and prices are said to start at around $20,000.

The company plans to build the cars in existing factories near key markets to save money and reduce life-cycle CO2 emissions. The downside is that the Peapod reaches maximum speed at 25 mph, which limits its use to either downtown or neighborhood driving.
So might uptake of "neighborhood vehicles" lower speeds on arterial roads?



Here is Tata's version... an air driven car.

http://finance.yahoo.com/family-home...rica%27s-Roads

Max speed of 35MPH.

I would sure rather "share the road" with these, over 3 ton smog spewing SUVs.

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Old 11-03-08, 08:32 AM   #2
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i doubt you will see those outside of big cities, if you see them much at all.

theres plenty of cars like that in the works that can go faster, and im guessing those will be the more popular ones for anyone living in the suburbs
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Old 11-03-08, 08:55 AM   #3
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Yet another braindead idea from one of the not so big as they used to be, three.

Give it another 20 mph top speed and it's a good idea.

I wonder why such a pathetic top speed? It really doesn't take that much extra opwer to get from 25 to 45.

The only possible reason I can think of is they may be exempted from crash standards by limiting top speed. In that case, it might make some sense to build them that way.....then hack the speed govenors.
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Old 11-03-08, 08:56 AM   #4
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Are these not simply enclosed golf carts? They're no more or less deadly in the hands of a reckless anti-cyclist driver. It's small width might even encourage unsafe passing. Speaking of golf carts, I had a close run-in with one recently - tried to shove me off the road.

As for the AIR, get a load of the blind spots, not to mention the complete lack of rearview mirrors.

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Old 11-03-08, 09:38 AM   #5
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Give it another 20 mph top speed and it's a good idea.

I wonder why such a pathetic top speed? It really doesn't take that much extra opwer to get from 25 to 45.
Really? So all this time I've been pedaling along at 15-20 MPH, I could have been going 30-40 MPH with just a little less lollygagging?

Power is roughly proportional to the square of velocity. So to go twice as fast, you need 4 times the power. This is why a 50cc scooter is fine for neighborhood or downtown riding, but if you want to go on the highway, you should be looking at the 250cc models.
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Old 11-03-08, 10:46 AM   #6
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I don't get it. I can ride 30 miles on a bike. I can ride 25 mph on a bike. Why would I pay 20,000 for one of these things. It is just another lazy invention, similar to the Segway or whatever those things are. "I just can't walk 2 miles! Thats way too far!" These gimmicks aren't the key to our oil free life style. The key to the oil free lifestyle is getting off your lazy ass and doing some hard work.
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Old 11-03-08, 11:16 AM   #7
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GM just acquired Chrysler--you think they are going to keep any program going that might form any kind of competition for the Volt? Expect this little GEM to never hit market in the way it was intended by Chrysler.
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Old 11-03-08, 11:32 AM   #8
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GM just acquired Chrysler--you think they are going to keep any program going that might form any kind of competition for the Volt? Expect this little GEM to never hit market in the way it was intended by Chrysler.
GM has NOT acquired Chrysler yet, though they are still negotiating. Of course, the US federal government declined GM's request for assistance in relation to the take-over so that might scuttle the plan.

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Give it another 20 mph top speed and it's a good idea.

I wonder why such a pathetic top speed? It really doesn't take that much extra opwer to get from 25 to 45.
The fact is, speed kills. Lower speeds mean safer roads and, often, faster travel.

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i doubt you will see those outside of big cities, if you see them much at all.
We have a similar car up here, the ZENN (Zero-Emission No-Noise), designed and originally built in Ontario and while it is available for puchase in Quebec and B.C., they are not allowed in Ontario---because Ontario is so heavily invested in established car manufacturers (GM, Ford, Chrysler, Toyota and Honda, among others). No product that cuts into their business will ever be allowed in Ontario so long as our provinvial government has all their faith in the big boys.
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Old 11-03-08, 11:55 AM   #9
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I don't get it. I can ride 30 miles on a bike. I can ride 25 mph on a bike. Why would I pay 20,000 for one of these things. It is just another lazy invention, similar to the Segway or whatever those things are. "I just can't walk 2 miles! Thats way too far!" These gimmicks aren't the key to our oil free life style. The key to the oil free lifestyle is getting off your lazy ass and doing some hard work.
While true, good luck convincing the majority of America that. Heck even bike "heavens" such as Amsterdam and Oulu Finland still have a majority of motorists.

The big weaning off of oil is still not going to change the fact that most Americans will want to drive... What needs to change is the perceived need to go 0-60 in 4.4 seconds with the ability to tow an aircraft carrier. Sure some folks have the need to drive long distances, haul lumber and farm equipment... etc, but frankly, that is not the case for most of us. The NHTSA has determined that most commutes are around 12-15 miles, and most errands are around 2-3 miles... so the fact is that most of us can get along on/in a much smaller vehicle... be it a bike or one of these econo cars.
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Old 11-03-08, 12:00 PM   #10
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GM just acquired Chrysler--you think they are going to keep any program going that might form any kind of competition for the Volt? Expect this little GEM to never hit market in the way it was intended by Chrysler.
Well without any help from the government, GM/Chrysler will eventually go the way of the dodo bird as they continue with their BIG VEHICLE programs... even the Volt is an "economy car" on steroids... and that reality will eventually dawn on them, too late... especially with the market price of $40K.

GM has a hard time moving away from their Good Old Boy ways of the past... and that will eventually sink 'em.
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Old 11-03-08, 12:25 PM   #11
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Really? So all this time I've been pedaling along at 15-20 MPH, I could have been going 30-40 MPH with just a little less lollygagging?

Power is roughly proportional to the square of velocity. So to go twice as fast, you need 4 times the power. This is why a 50cc scooter is fine for neighborhood or downtown riding, but if you want to go on the highway, you should be looking at the 250cc models.

You seem to be forgeting how weak humans are compared to small light weight motors.

One of those puny little 50cc motors will pump out a few hp all day long. A very strong cyclist might get over 1 hp for a very short sprint.

So, comparatively speaking, it really doesn't take that much more power. As speed gets much above 45 mph, it really does start taking considerable power.

I suspect the 25 mph speed limit has more to do with safety regs than it does with physics.

So, it is yet another case of government over regulation screwing us.

VW has a euro market 3 cylinder turbo diesel that will beat the pants off the prius in the fuel economy area. Trouble is, the safety weenies make it to difficult to import.

Yet, I can go down to the suzuki dealer and buy a 400 lb, 150 hp 2 wheeled rocketship.

Somebody 'splain how this makes sense to me.
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Old 11-03-08, 12:45 PM   #12
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Somebody 'splain how this makes sense to me.
Makes as much sense as all the 6000 lb "farm equipment" typically seen on the roads of our cities today.
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Old 11-03-08, 02:29 PM   #13
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Power is roughly proportional to the square of velocity. So to go twice as fast, you need 4 times the power.
Actually, if you're looking at air resistance and ignoring other forms of drag (which is appropriate for a bicycle going at a reasonable clip on flat ground), the power required is proportional to the velocity *cubed*. So to go twice as fast, you need *eight* times the power. More details.
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Old 11-03-08, 02:38 PM   #14
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You seem to be forgeting how weak humans are compared to small light weight motors.
Indeed. A 1 lb R/C glow engine (0.46 in^3, about 8 cc) can put out more power (about 1.75 hp) for hours, more than even the most fit human.
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VW has a euro market 3 cylinder turbo diesel
Really, the number of cylinders doesn't have anything to do with it. You can easily have a really powerful one cylinder engine, or a weak twelve cylinder engine. The total displacement is far more important than the number of cylinders.

Ultimately, power needed to overcome air resistance is proportional to speed *cubed*, which is why it's so much harder to go even a little faster. It's also why bicycles work on so little power -- going down from 45 mph to 15 mph cuts the power required by a factor of 27 (assuming that air resistance is the only drag, which is a reasonable approximation.)
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Old 11-03-08, 02:41 PM   #15
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Any way you put it, getting away from the ICE is a good thing. It at least gives us opportunities to have cleaner energy off the grid.
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Old 11-03-08, 03:12 PM   #16
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A 25 mph top speed will keep those things from making it over the bridges leading out of DC, never mind most of the busy streets & roads. No way I'd get one.
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Old 11-03-08, 03:16 PM   #17
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A 25 mph top speed will keep those things from making it over the bridges leading out of DC, never mind most of the busy streets & roads. No way I'd get one.
Why, do you need to hit escape velocity to get over the bridges?

My point is that we have such high speeds on roads today because there is some "secret competition" to do 0-60 in 4.4 seconds... when in reality there is no such race going on... yet all car makers act as if there is.

Why can't we just have common sense transportation with lower speed roads such that cyclists of all ages feel comfortable mixing it up with the other traffic?
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Old 11-03-08, 03:29 PM   #18
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Why, do you need to hit escape velocity to get over the bridges?

My point is that we have such high speeds on roads today because there is some "secret competition" to do 0-60 in 4.4 seconds... when in reality there is no such race going on... yet all car makers act as if there is.

Why can't we just have common sense transportation with lower speed roads such that cyclists of all ages feel comfortable mixing it up with the other traffic?
I feel safer next to BMWs, Lexuses, and other high end vehicles with extreme power than next to SUVs, and lower end economy cars. This is because not only do they out-preform said SUVs but they are worth a heck of a lot more. No way some guy in his 80,000 dollar Viper is going to hit me. He is too worried about his car. With the plastic cars coming out nowadays, they can hit you and there is no dent or damage.

Give me a road full of Lambos and I would be the happiest cyclist in the world.
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Old 11-03-08, 04:17 PM   #19
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Actually, if you're looking at air resistance and ignoring other forms of drag (which is appropriate for a bicycle going at a reasonable clip on flat ground), the power required is proportional to the velocity *cubed*. So to go twice as fast, you need *eight* times the power. More details.
Ah, right, I was thinking force, not power. Shoulda thought it through. Carry on.
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Old 11-03-08, 04:21 PM   #20
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I feel safer next to BMWs, Lexuses, and other high end vehicles with extreme power than next to SUVs, and lower end economy cars. This is because not only do they out-preform said SUVs but they are worth a heck of a lot more. No way some guy in his 80,000 dollar Viper is going to hit me. He is too worried about his car. With the plastic cars coming out nowadays, they can hit you and there is no dent or damage.

Give me a road full of Lambos and I would be the happiest cyclist in the world.
In a way, probably correct... But highly unlikely.
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Old 11-03-08, 05:23 PM   #21
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Why, do you need to hit escape velocity to get over the bridges?
No, it's because anything that slow is either going to get run off the road itself or get other people to push themselves around trying to get past.

I know, a self-important person like yourself will just say, "F 'em", but I guess you can't remember that there's a whole world out there that doesn't think the way you do.
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Old 11-03-08, 05:25 PM   #22
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No, it's because anything that slow is either going to get run off the road itself or get other people to push themselves around trying to get past.

I know, a self-important person like yourself will just say, "F 'em", but I guess you can't remember that there's a whole world out there that doesn't think the way you do.
Must be heck on Cement Trucks...
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Old 11-03-08, 05:26 PM   #23
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They go just fine, in case you haven't noticed (and a hell of a lot faster than a mere 25 mph).
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Old 11-03-08, 05:37 PM   #24
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They go just fine, in case you haven't noticed (and a hell of a lot faster than a mere 25 mph).
...and when they start off slowly from a stoplight, every J.A.M. will dart around them as if they were part of some slalom course.

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Old 11-03-08, 05:43 PM   #25
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i'd rather just ride my bike.
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