Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12-05-08, 08:49 PM   #1
degnaw
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
degnaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Bellevue, WA
Bikes:
Posts: 1,605
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Banned from cycling

I'm a high school senior, and a week ago, my dad randomly told me I couldn't ride anymore because its too dangerous. Its only been a week since, but bumming rides/walking 4 miles has gotten quite repetitive already. My parents say I should start driving, but I think I'd fall asleep driving at 6:30am.

This
is most of my route, which I admit is a bit questionable (35mph rural roads, real speed is around 45), but I feel safe with a superflash, 4 feet of reflective tape, a fluorescent hoodie, and a 606a q5 helmet light. In the three months I've been riding, I've only had one close call (which in retrospect wasn't really that close at all).

What would any of you do in a situation like this? Apparently my dad knows someone who was killed on a bike (and no one in a car crash), and he always emphasizes how a car provides a 3000lb shield in the event of an accident.
degnaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-08, 09:10 PM   #2
Hickeydog
Crushing souls
 
Hickeydog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sagamore Hills, Ohio.
Bikes: Trek 1500
Posts: 1,591
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Well, from the map view, it looks like you have 4 lane roads for most of the way. That can help make the ride safer.

Having been in your position (teenager here as well), if you parent's say no, then you have to respect that and do not go against their wishes.

Something you may want to consider is getting (asking?) for is a cheap helmet cam and show them your commute. Or even take your dad on a ride and ride the route on the weekend or something similar.

If they are forcing you to drive, however, I would expect them to compensate for a significant portion of the cost of driving, like gas and insurance.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wordbiker View Post

What's frightening is how coherent Hickey was in posting that.
Hickeydog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-08, 09:10 PM   #3
uke
it's easy if you let it.
 
uke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: indoors and out.
Bikes:
Posts: 4,124
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Not much you can do until you're living on your own. I'd advise letting it go until the spring, building good terms with him until then, and trying again if you're still interested in riding then. In the meantime, you can still ride to other places.
uke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-08, 09:42 PM   #4
PLyTheMan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 71
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yeah, dealing with parents is (obviously) different for everyone. Tell them that you hate having to rely on others for rides and walking so far. And of course a car is way too much to pay for... the car, gas, insurance, etc, a bike really is much cheaper =D If nothing else give it some time and see if they change their opinion by then, maybe a few more weeks or even until the winter has passed. Taking your dad on a ride seems like a good idea as well.
PLyTheMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-08, 11:00 PM   #5
John E
feros ferio
 
John E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: www.ci.encinitas.ca.us
Bikes: 1959 Capo; 1980 Peugeot PKN-10; 1981 Bianchi; 1988 Schwinn KOM-10;
Posts: 17,046
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
3.4 miles each way is not an unreasonable distance to walk or jog. I cover at least 5.5mi on a typical workday, and you are much younger than I am.
__________________
"Early to bed, early to rise. Work like hell, and advertise." -- George Stahlman
Capo [dschaw'-poe]: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger, S/N 42624
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1981 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
John E is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-08, 11:00 PM   #6
fuzz2050
Real Men Ride Ordinaries
 
fuzz2050's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 3,701
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
facts

Tell them to read the 1978 survey published by Kenneth Cross and Gary Fisher. After you read it yourself of course, and then assure them you don't do all of the stupid things that get cyclists injured.

I can guarantee that will help, but at least you spread some knowledge...Parents are often just clueless
fuzz2050 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-08, 11:09 PM   #7
soze
ex-everything.
 
soze's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Charlestown, MA
Bikes: venerable surly crosscheck
Posts: 606
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Then Daddy should welcome the opportunity to pay for your car, insurance, gas, and maintenance. Does he have any idea what car insurance costs for an under 18 driver?

Unfunded mandates suck anywhere they're applied.
soze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-08, 11:15 PM   #8
rotharpunc
BEHOLD! THE MANTICORE!
 
rotharpunc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: 54914
Bikes:
Posts: 1,797
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
whats the worse they can do if you don't obey them?
rotharpunc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-08, 11:37 PM   #9
AlmostTrick
Yabba-Dabba-Doo!
 
AlmostTrick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Bedrock, IL
Bikes: 1968 Schwinn Orange Krate, 5 speed stick shift
Posts: 4,784
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rotharpunc View Post
whats the worse they can do if you don't obey them?
Make his life miserable. I wouldn't advise disobeying.

Since your dad's concern here is the perceived danger, you need to demonstrate/prove that riding is not as dangerous as he thinks, especially when one takes the proper safety precautions and rides in a prudent manner. Consider this your assignment.
AlmostTrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 12:00 AM   #10
steveknight
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: portland or
Bikes:
Posts: 1,888
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
if cars are so safe why do they need airbags and seat belts and impact zones? the illusion that metal cage makes you safe is really pretty pathetic. the non car more of transportation is not safe argument based on no facts is pretty common. I guess thats what happens when people become so car dependent that can't imagine any other way to get around.
being a kid sucks glad I am done with it (G)
steveknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 12:28 AM   #11
cyclezealot
Senior Member
 
cyclezealot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Fallbrook,Calif./Palau del Vidre, France
Bikes: Klein QP, Fuji touring, Surly Cross Check, BCH City bike
Posts: 13,166
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 92 Post(s)
Bummer.. I'd be distraught...Not much you can do until you are 18... Maybe when Spring comes and its light later, they will change their minds. Meanwhile, all you have is quiet persuasion... And some men cyclists complain of controlling wives.. Not letting them ride.. Glad mine does not have that much authority over me.. She knows I'd be impossible to live with.. Remember that when going out on dates...
__________________
Pray for the Dead and Fight like Hell for the Living






^ Since January 1, 2012

Last edited by cyclezealot; 12-06-08 at 12:33 AM.
cyclezealot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 12:29 AM   #12
Groundhound
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by steveknight View Post
being a kid sucks glad I am done with it (G)
Being a parent can sometimes suck too. Cut Dad some slack - it's every parent's worst nightmare to have to bury their own child, and Dad's right about one thing - in a collision between a car and a bike, the bike loses every time (F=MA). To the OP, be patient and try to show him why your route is safe, and if the route you take is truly a safe one and you can demonstrate you know how to ride that route safely, you'll likely be able to get him to relent with time. Just don't forget he sees his primary job as getting you to adulthood in one piece.
Groundhound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 12:29 AM   #13
mike
Senior Member
 
mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Snowy midwest
Bikes:
Posts: 5,392
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
If your parents are telling you to drive a car and you are saying, "well, I would rather ride a bicycle", then you are one VERY unique and cool cat. It is usually in reverse.

I would abide by your parents request, but make express your desire to ride a bicycle at the same time.
mike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 04:04 AM   #14
trekker pete
pedalphile
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: ellington, ct
Bikes: trek 1200, 520, Giant ATX 970, Raleigh Talon
Posts: 1,035
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Can I adopt you?

I have been trying to get my high school senior daughter to ride a bike. She won't, but has no problem at all driving. Well, she didn't have a problem until she wadded up the OL's minivan a few weeks ago.
trekker pete is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 06:50 AM   #15
rbrian
Senior Member
 
rbrian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Aberdeen, Scotland
Bikes: '07 Brompton S6L; '10 Brompton M6R
Posts: 482
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Wow, surprised no-one saying stand up to your dad! You're a teenager, you're supposed to argue with your parents. What can he really do anyway? You can make his life just as miserable as he can make yours - just don't blink first.

Or hide your bike a little way down the road, start walking, then get on the bike when you're out of his sight.
rbrian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 07:37 AM   #16
-=(8)=-
♋ ☮♂ ☭ ☯
 
-=(8)=-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: 40205 'ViLLeBiLLie
Bikes: Sngl Spd's, 70's- 80's vintage, D-tube Folder
Posts: 7,903
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Im a parent of a bicycle commuter........
Its awesome that my offspring is into bikes the way he is instead of
the usual fast car stuff his peers are. Finally something I succeeded at
But, knowing the bad stuff that can/will come to him as a daily rider, it is very
troubling and worrisome when he goes out.
Do you have a real nice helmet and that kind of stuff ?? Make token gestures
desigened to show how safety concience you are. Keep working on it. Its great
when the next generation makes a decision to go against the status quo for thier
own betterment, but beyond that, parents never stop worrying about their kids.
Its just human nature.
__________________
-ADVOCACY-☜ Radical VC = Car people on bikes. Just say "NO"
-=(8)=- is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 09:12 AM   #17
mandovoodoo
Violin guitar mandolin
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Friendsville, TN, USA
Bikes: Wilier Thor, Fuji Professional, LeMond Wayzata
Posts: 1,171
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
You can tell who is a parent and who isn't.

You have exactly 1 side of this story with absolutely no fact checking at all. Making any kind of call in that circumstance is unwarranted.

I wish critical thinking would be taught in schools. We have it in our home school program.

On this issue, presenting a real case with real numbers and statistics that you understand in a balanced and objective way may allow reopening the discussion. Just whining will harden the opponents stance.

And to those who suggest making things difficult - shut up. That's the most stupid suggestion I've read here. It's difficult enough being a parent and having a teenager when the teenager is behaving.

And to teenagers. You're immature hormonally challenged beginners underestimating the real challenges of everything and overestimating your limited abilities in generally handling life. Exceptions exist, but that's the general rule.

Walk into the issue gently and really discuss it. That's about the only way a resolution really gets made.

Push really hard and come the legal age, you're out on the street. Cold and very very alone. I have seen it happen.

Learn to negotiate, learn to listen, learn to manage money, learn to learn, and especially learn to cook really well without recipes. That's the ticket. Also the way to a girl's/boy's heart. That good cooking stuff. That and music. I had a girl over once, cooked her a nice meal, played her some piano, didn't try to kiss her, was just glad for some company. She's still here 16 years later!
mandovoodoo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 10:30 AM   #18
degnaw
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
degnaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Bellevue, WA
Bikes:
Posts: 1,605
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thanks for the replies;

Firstly, there's no safer route - the "4-lane" arterial is actually a 55mph 2-lane rural route. I don't really see anything I can do to change my dad's mind - he hasn't ridden in decades and I don't see him riding on a rural road. And its kind of hard to convince a rational person that riding 15mph on a bike is safer on an unlit rural road than 45mph (traffic speed) in a car. I'm not going to disobey him, though I did ride around my neighborhood this morning. I'm just waiting for college right now, which fortunately is less than a year away-They've already told me that they don't have a problem with me riding when the speed differential is 15mph or less.

As for the car driving thing, my parents would, at least initially, subsidize most of the costs. I just don't see the point - the only currently available parking lot is a 15-minute walk from the front of the school (with a 15-minute drive assuming traffic), at which point I might as well have made the 50-minute walk home (riding took about 15-20 minutes, and I could park adjacent to the school doorway).
degnaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 10:46 AM   #19
crhilton
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
Bikes: '07 Trek 1500, '08 Surly Cross Check, '09 Masi Speciale Sprint custom build
Posts: 4,568
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by John E View Post
3.4 miles each way is not an unreasonable distance to walk or jog. I cover at least 5.5mi on a typical workday, and you are much younger than I am.
That's an hour walk. That's an unreasonable distance.
crhilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 10:50 AM   #20
crhilton
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
Bikes: '07 Trek 1500, '08 Surly Cross Check, '09 Masi Speciale Sprint custom build
Posts: 4,568
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by degnaw View Post
Thanks for the replies;

Firstly, there's no safer route - the "4-lane" arterial is actually a 55mph 2-lane rural route. I don't really see anything I can do to change my dad's mind - he hasn't ridden in decades and I don't see him riding on a rural road. And its kind of hard to convince a rational person that riding 15mph on a bike is safer on an unlit rural road than 45mph (traffic speed) in a car. I'm not going to disobey him, though I did ride around my neighborhood this morning. I'm just waiting for college right now, which fortunately is less than a year away-They've already told me that they don't have a problem with me riding when the speed differential is 15mph or less.

As for the car driving thing, my parents would, at least initially, subsidize most of the costs. I just don't see the point - the only currently available parking lot is a 15-minute walk from the front of the school (with a 15-minute drive assuming traffic), at which point I might as well have made the 50-minute walk home (riding took about 15-20 minutes, and I could park adjacent to the school doorway).
You're safer in the car and it doesn't matter how you cut it. However, the margin of extra danger on the bike is tiny. It's not likely to kill you: The overall incidence of death is higher than the incidence of death while cycling. This is probably due to the extra care one takes while cycling that we often fail to apply to other activities like eating, not smoking and not binge drinking .

Your father should find something better to worry about like teen pregnancy. But you still have to listen to him (I'm supposed to tell you that).
crhilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 11:00 AM   #21
crhilton
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
Bikes: '07 Trek 1500, '08 Surly Cross Check, '09 Masi Speciale Sprint custom build
Posts: 4,568
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mandovoodoo View Post
I wish critical thinking would be taught in schools. We have it in our home school program.
It is, or at least it was for me. This seems to be a common misconception (I assume you're in the US). Your public school might be filled with inept teachers but that's not universal.
crhilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 12:03 PM   #22
bmclaughlin807
Crankenstein
 
bmclaughlin807's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Spokane
Bikes: Novara Randonee (TankerBelle)
Posts: 4,038
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by crhilton View Post
You're safer in the car and it doesn't matter how you cut it.
Really? And just where are you getting your statistics? Assumptions?

Fact of the matter is that cycling is safer per hour riding than driving...

'facts' like these are why people are afraid to ride a bike... You're on a cycling forum... the least you could do is check the facts before spouting off nonsense about cars being safer than bikes.

Yes... in the event of an actual, high-speed accident... you may very well be safer in a car than on a bike... but the fact of the matter is that you're much more likely to be involved in a high-speed accident IN a car than outside of it... and MANY, MANY more people die inside cars every year than die on bikes.
__________________
"There is no greater wonder than the way the face and character of a woman fit so perfectly in a man's mind, and stay there, and he could never tell you why. It just seems it was the thing he most wanted." Robert Louis Stevenson
bmclaughlin807 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 02:20 PM   #23
MrCjolsen
Senior Member
 
MrCjolsen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Davis CA
Bikes: Surly Cross-Check, '85 Giant road bike (unrecogizable fixed-gear conversion
Posts: 3,957
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmclaughlin807 View Post
Really? And just where are you getting your statistics? Assumptions?

Fact of the matter is that cycling is safer per hour riding than driving...

'facts' like these are why people are afraid to ride a bike... You're on a cycling forum... the least you could do is check the facts before spouting off nonsense about cars being safer than bikes.

Yes... in the event of an actual, high-speed accident... you may very well be safer in a car than on a bike... but the fact of the matter is that you're much more likely to be involved in a high-speed accident IN a car than outside of it... and MANY, MANY more people die inside cars every year than die on bikes.
Statistically, a high school senior is most likely to die in an automobile accident than anything else. For teenagers, cycling (even if they do it stupidly and dangerously) is far more safe than driving (which they often do stupidly and dangerously).

If I had a teenager, I'd sleep much better knowing they were cycling instead of driving.
MrCjolsen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 02:24 PM   #24
StrangeWill
Senior Member
 
StrangeWill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Fallbrook, CA.
Bikes:
Posts: 1,112
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Aren't two laned rural roads like huge killers due to head ons?

I'd figure you'd be actually safer on the shoulder on a bike strangely enough.



Though to be honest, once a parent has an idea in their head, the heavens couldn't move that idea out usually, statistically, per hour spent on the road, you're safer on a bike, probably as you mentioned, has a lot to do with forced awareness (you not falling asleep) due to being actively part of the situation.
StrangeWill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-08, 02:53 PM   #25
chipcom 
Infamous Member
 
chipcom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Bikes: Surly Big Dummy, Fuji World, 80ish Bianchi
Posts: 24,366
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I don't agree with your Dad, but hey, he's your Dad and until you are of legal age you're gonna have to respect and obey his wishes. Going outside the family with your problem prolly isn't a good idea either.
<godfather voice>Never go against the family, and family business stays inside the family</godfather voice>
__________________
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
chipcom is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:14 PM.