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  1. #1
    Senior Member slagjumper's Avatar
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    GM's new PUMA to use bikelanes!

    Looks like GM sees the writing on the wall and has developed an electric Segway-like two seater that will run in bikelanes! Wouldn't it be funny if all of a sudden the top twenty cities started a big push for seperated paths. If Forester were dead, he'd be turning over in his grave.


    http://www.engadget.com/2009/04/07/g...s-stage-debut/

    The biggest obstacle to commercialization, however, is the lack of infrastructure: P.U.M.A. in its current incarnation is designed for for bike lanes, and the first cities to get it will be ones with existing, comprehensive bike lanes -- not as much of an obstacle in Europe, but quite the stretch for most American cities. Still, the mathematics are quite alluring, with a 35 mile range at 35 mph for a 35 cent charge -- even us mouth-breathing Statesiders can understand that.

    Cities with extensive bike lanes -- look out:
    http://weblogs.newsday.com/cars/blog..._twowheel.html

    ...the first cities to get it will be ones with existing, comprehensive bike lanes -- not as much of an obstacle in Europe, but quite the stretch for most American cities.
    Last edited by slagjumper; 04-07-09 at 07:53 PM. Reason: added second link

  2. #2
    Senior Member degnaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slagjumper View Post
    P.U.M.A. in its current incarnation is designed for for bike lanes . . . . at 35 mph
    Now that's simply ridiculous. Heck, even I tend to leave bike lanes when I top 20mph or so. If its top speed is 15 or 20mph, it'd be more understandable.

  3. #3
    Senior Member slagjumper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by degnaw View Post
    Now that's simply ridiculous. Heck, even I tend to leave bike lanes when I top 20mph or so. If its top speed is 15 or 20mph, it'd be more understandable.
    I guess it is all about the consumer's perception of safety. Many cyclists will be able to blow the PUMA's away. But given GM's track record for inovation this will probably never take off.

  4. #4
    Team Fat Boy SeattleShaun's Avatar
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    This is the same GM that killed the EV-1 and Saturn?

    RIP PUMA....

    OTOH, the IT Segway changed the transportation world, didn't it?

  5. #5
    JRA
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    GM is gonna build a vehichle for the Segway market? Sheesh! Hasn't the Segway been failure enough?

    GM killed the EV-1 and someday they may bring out the Volt.

    They're not bankrupt but the government tells them who their CEO can be and the taxpayer is on the hook to pay for waranty repairs.

    The world ain't nuts; it's crazy.
    "It may even be that motoring is more healthful than not motoring; death rates were certainly higher in the pre-motoring age."- John Forester
    "Laws cannot be properly understood as if written in plain English..."- Forester defending obfuscation.
    "Motorist propaganda, continued for sixty years, is what has put cyclists on sidewalks." - Forester, sociologist in his own mind
    "'There are no rules of the road on MUPs.' -John Forester" - Helmet Head quoting 'The Great One'

  6. #6
    www.theheadbadge.com cudak888's Avatar
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    Talk about an "accelerated pedestrian."

    Pun intended.

    -Kurt

  7. #7
    Senior Member slagjumper's Avatar
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    It seems clear to us that the PUMA is a bad idea. But wasnt replacing public transportation in LA with an extensive road system a bad idea? What about the countless bridges and roads to nowhere? I bet the road building folks will eat this up as an idea to spend more on bmodal infrastructure, Might sound appealing to bike lane advocating cyclists.

  8. #8
    -=Barry=- The Human Car's Avatar
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    The thing looks like a wheelchair with a roll cage to me, just say'n.
    Cycling Advocate
    http://BaltimoreSpokes.org
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  9. #9
    Senior Member slagjumper's Avatar
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    I wonder how it does on hills.

  10. #10
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    I'd better not catch one in a bike lane...

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by JRA View Post
    GM is gonna build a vehichle for the Segway market? Sheesh! Hasn't the Segway been failure enough?

    GM killed the EV-1 and someday they may bring out the Volt.

    They're not bankrupt but the government tells them who their CEO can be and the taxpayer is on the hook to pay for waranty repairs.

    The world ain't nuts; it's crazy.
    They need this so that when you go shopping for an electric car at a chevy dealership the salesman can point to the PUMA and say "that's what electric cars are like, you want this SUV here." It's how GM makes good ideas sound ridiculous. They may do something similar with the volt: "Oh you want a plugin hybrid, we have one but it's $50,000. You want a Cadillac!"

    GM did it to electric cars the last time by building a thousand of them and including R&D costs into the purchase price of 1,000 vehicles. In software we know how this game works: Research is risk. If you succeed you win it back ten times over. If you fail then you wasted all of your time. You don't get to charge for it because it's not a per widget cost.

    That's just my theory on what they're trying to do. It could also be that they want to claim they hire engineers and researchers to build electric cars. Then they encourage them to build something unmarketable so that they won't risk actually building a successful electric car. Electric cars ruin GM's policy of selling you the bigger engine at a ridiculous markup. They limit the silly electric gadgets that everyone sells at a crazy high markup.

  12. #12
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crhilton View Post
    They need this so that when you go shopping for an electric car at a chevy dealership the salesman can point to the PUMA and say "that's what electric cars are like, you want this SUV here." It's how GM makes good ideas sound ridiculous. They may do something similar with the volt: "Oh you want a plugin hybrid, we have one but it's $50,000. You want a Cadillac!"

    GM did it to electric cars the last time by building a thousand of them and including R&D costs into the purchase price of 1,000 vehicles. In software we know how this game works: Research is risk. If you succeed you win it back ten times over. If you fail then you wasted all of your time. You don't get to charge for it because it's not a per widget cost.

    That's just my theory on what they're trying to do. It could also be that they want to claim they hire engineers and researchers to build electric cars. Then they encourage them to build something unmarketable so that they won't risk actually building a successful electric car. Electric cars ruin GM's policy of selling you the bigger engine at a ridiculous markup. They limit the silly electric gadgets that everyone sells at a crazy high markup.
    Based on what Toyota has come up with... I tend to agree... what in the world is GM thinking! Obviously GM and the Oil companies have some sort of behind the scenes connection.

    As far as innovation... GM left it all behind somewhere... sheesh. The CEO didn't step down soon enough.

  13. #13
    Senior Member sjauch's Avatar
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    That piece of crap doesn't belong in the bike lane.

  14. #14
    Punk Rock Lives Roughstuff's Avatar
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    Since the auto industry in the US went from being run by Auto executives (up until the 1960s) to Ralph Nader luddites and their congressional ilk, its all been downhill for the auto industry and GM. I don't blame management OR the unions.

    This garbage can on wheels is only the beginning of the turd vehicles we will see out of detroit.

    roughstuff
    Electric car sales are on fire! :)

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by crhilton View Post
    I'd better not catch one in a bike lane...
    I'd carry a spare frame pump just to Cinzano one of those abominations.

  16. #16
    your nightmare gal chipcom's Avatar
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    Another good reason to avoid bike lanes....or can we start calling them PUMA lanes?
    "Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey

  17. #17
    JRA
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Human Car View Post
    The thing looks like a wheelchair with a roll cage to me, just say'n.
    I often see people in wheelchairs driving vehicularly. They don't need no stinkin' bike lanes.

    Ironically, I also see people on bicycles riding on the sidewalk-- on the same street at the same time (what a hoot!).

    I can't for the life of me figure out why a vehicle that can go 35mph would need a special lane. Isn't 35 mph pretty much the speed limit on many roads?
    Last edited by JRA; 04-08-09 at 09:17 AM.
    "It may even be that motoring is more healthful than not motoring; death rates were certainly higher in the pre-motoring age."- John Forester
    "Laws cannot be properly understood as if written in plain English..."- Forester defending obfuscation.
    "Motorist propaganda, continued for sixty years, is what has put cyclists on sidewalks." - Forester, sociologist in his own mind
    "'There are no rules of the road on MUPs.' -John Forester" - Helmet Head quoting 'The Great One'

  18. #18
    Senior Member wheel's Avatar
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    yawn...

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by JRA View Post
    I often see people in wheelchairs driving vehicularly. They don't need no stinkin' bike lanes.

    Ironically, I also see people on bicycles riding on the sidewalk-- on the same street at the same time (what a hoot!).

    I can't for the life of me figure out why a vehicle that can go 35mph would need a special lane. Isn't 35 mph pretty much the speed limit on many roads?
    Because if it collides with anything larger than a bicycle, all occupants of the electric rickshaw will be killed?



  20. #20
    Al noisebeam's Avatar
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    While this is very unlikely for a wide range of reasons, it would be welcome as it could increase the visibility of the problems with bike lanes to a wider audience.

  21. #21
    Senior Member slagjumper's Avatar
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    While I'm not betting any of my money that it will succeed, it seems like it has some of the features that are bound to be found in future vehicles. Things like smaller foot print, cheaper to buy and run, less polluting, less stylish, and more utilitarian.

    The speed limit on city of Pittsburgh public streets is never more than 35.

    Spike, I think that you name for that bubble on wheels, might stick and kill the concept alltogether, at least in the Western half of the globe.

    "electric rickshaw"

    Would a city of PUMAs be the same as "car free"?
    Last edited by slagjumper; 04-08-09 at 12:35 PM.

  22. #22
    Sophomoric Member Roody's Avatar
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    The PUMA can't crash into anything.


    "Think Outside the Cage"

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roody View Post
    The PUMA can't crash into anything.
    True that. However, It's an unfortunate fact that all other vehicles can crash into pumas.

  24. #24
    LCI #1853
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    Unless PUMAs have pedals for the major part of their propulsive power, they may well be screwed. Many communities prohibit motor vehicles from operating in bike lanes, and nearly all prohibit them on bike paths and multi-use paths. Pretty much the same problems that mo-peds and E-bikes have in many places...

  25. #25
    your nightmare gal chipcom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roody View Post
    The PUMA can't crash into anything.
    IF the network that does not yet exist is created...till then it can crash just like anything else.
    Geesh...now the bike lanes are gonna go wireless too!
    We can surf the web as we ride!
    "Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey

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