Bekologist

glad to hear it. I'm positive that while towing a canoe a nice ample shoulder would be a tool you could use too.

it will be interesting to see how florida ridership and road infrastructure develops in the years to come..... i have hopes for florida that road designs will be held to a higher standard if the mandatory bikelane law sticks.

Noobtastic

I'll keep cycling the way I do; except now always carrying my Florida Cycling "Street Smarts" manual, if I'm pulled over I can at least show the officer why I believed that the bike lane was not safe at the moment.

randya

Next up for the Florida legislature - MHL!!!

CommuterRun

Like I explained earlier, yet again; what you define as nice ample shoulders do not exist here. There are no 8' paved shoulders.

You are also quite conveniently overlooking the fact that a paved shoulder is not included in the legal definition of a roadway.

cudak888 

ATTENTION:

For those of you who wish to send an email to Crist expressing your concerns, but do not have the time to draft a letter, you can visit the following site, VETO HB 971, and sign your name to a prepared petition letter. Upon submission, this petition will be sent directly to Governor Crist's email box:

See: https://vetohb971.x10hosting.com/

^
PLEASE TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THIS - SEND IN YOUR REQUEST TO VETO THIS BILL VIA EMAIL AS WELL!

-Kurt

Mr IGH

In these days of declining infrastructure and new demands on tax dollars, I don't see any chance. This is just a way to push cyclists out of site, out of mind. There's not a single provision for added cycle lanes/cycle infrastructure. They're laying off teachers....

Bekologist

..well, i think this bill provision is very likely an assaultive dig on bicyclists by some state legislator(s) with nothing to offer but an axe to grind with bicyclists.

what i'm saying is that a MBL law will allow active transportation advocacy organizations to hold municipalities to a higher - IE AASHTO green book minimum or greater - standard of infrastructure design if bikelane use becomes 'mandatory' in Florida. which of course, means hardly ever as there will only be bike lanes on a very small portion of roads in any flordia community. the ones that will be there can be well designed fer shure. paint is cheap.

yes, if you insist, but you don't ride definitions. i am confident that, with an ample roadway facility or shoulder a person towing a canoe or a trailer with a kid in it or 80 pounds of groceries (but not commuter run obviously) would be quite happy to choose to ride in the bikelane or shoulder if safe to do so - they would likely even prefer it.

i would like to see video of a bicyclist tow a canoe over an intercoastal waterway bridge choosing the travel lane and not the shoulder. of course, i've ridden in the lane over the columbia river out west here, the logging trucks just had to wait. cyclists should be free to choose the travel lane or bikelane or shoulder and should never be required to use these facilities.

i am opposed to mandatory bikelane and mandatory shoulder use laws.

CFXMarauder

Thanks Kurt...I passed the Bill info and info posted on Commute Orlando around to some groups on facebook and will do the same with this link...

Digital_Cowboy

There is something that I can see happening because of this revision.

That is that a commuter cyclist has no choice but to take a route that includes one or more bike lanes. They are in their opinion unusable, either because of being too narrow, damaged or cluttered with debris. There is a cop who patrols said street(s) s/he thinks that said bike lane(s) is/are usable (never haven ridden a bike after getting his/her license) and tickets said cyclist. Cyclist goes to court and fights and wins.

A short while goes by and the cop again sees the commuter cyclist out going to work or coming home. Sees that they are not in the bike lane and tickets them again. And again they take it to court and fight it and again wins.

How many times of having to take it to court to win do you think it will take before our intrepid cyclist decides that it isn't worth the fight and puts the bike in the garage and starts to use their car again to commute to work?

Or even worse, our cyclist takes it to court gets a judge who isn't bike friendly and rules against them. Forcing them to appeal to a higher court? Again how many times of having to go to court to fight for their rights do you think it would take for the average person to "hang up" their bike?

Bekologist

Twisted visions of people actually hanging their bicycles up due to the implementation of preferred class infrastructure is quite far fetched hysterical fearmongering for communities that plan for bike traffic, digital cowboy!

funny stuff for a sunday morning.

What's more likely to happen will be, you and your fellow floridans can get communities to improve conditions for bicycling, bike advocacy groups will be able to work with communities to ensure bike infrastructure is designed to AASHTO minimums or better, etc.... gradually, bridge ways and pinch points in communities will become more bikeable across flordia.

i used to live in florida and don't like the idea of a MBL law as much as the rest of you. trouble is, other states do have them and do quite well planning for bikes in the transportation mix so a MBL is not a deal breaker to people riding bikes in a community. hang the bikes up because of bikelanes?

it certainly isn't going to cause the public to stop riding; rather, i see it as the chance for florida's active transportation alliances to insist on at least federal bikeway design standards in floridas towns and cities.

Shadowex3

Excuse me, rights? Bicycling is no more a right than driving a car is, they're both privileges, along with everything else that goes with them. We don't have a right to an interstate system or well-paved roads, as nice and "necessary" as they are. The government merely has a responsibility to keep a minimum standard once they provide it and monopolize it. If they aren't doing that then yes it's a really big freakin problem, but nobody should be throwing the word "Rights" around.

chipcom 

Since my daughter lives in Florida, I submitted on her behalf.

chipcom 

Horsepucky. People do have a right to travel and they do have a right to protect themselves. This law puts restrictions on both.

Sorry, comrade, but you don't get to define the rights of others nor whether the term can be used in the context of this discussion.

cudak888 

Watch from 6:42-on:


-Kurt

chipcom 

From 8:44 on if you want to cut to the bottom line.

cudak888 

True.

-Kurt

genec

You fail on the basic concept that operating a motor vehicle is a granted privilege (and revocable) by the state; whereas travel on the public way under one's own power is neither granted, nor licensed, but is considered a fundamental Constitutional right. (considered a right, but not explicitly "granted")

Now this of course does not mean that you have a fundamental right to travel by bicycle, but merely that there is a difference between the privilege of driving, and the right to travel freely, which no state can deny.

Handy quick references... (confirm them on your own time)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom...ted_States_law
https://www.apfn.org/apfn/travel.htm
https://supreme.lp.findlaw.com/consti...ment14/33.html

Of course if you want to argue this further... I suggest you take it up with the courts, they have been discussing it since the time of the Magna Carta.

cudak888 

Bump to top - don't want anyone missing this that shouldn't.

-Kurt

Shadowex3

If you're going to insult me that unabashedly at least attempt to do it when people can't see my post right there and try not to agree with me right after beating up your straw man.

Bekologist

...well, lets hope the governor vetoed the bill, keep us out of towners updated eh.

a little precedent from a persuasive authority, the kansas supreme court, in the 1890 benchmark case Swift v. the city of Topeka, affirmed the right of bicyclists to travel public roads and bridges, with the majority opinion finding "Each citizen has the absolute right to choose for himself the mode of conveyance he desires, whether it be by wagon or carriage, by horse, motor or electric car, or by bicycle .... This right of the people to the use of the public streets of a city is so well established and so universally recognized in this country that it has become a part of the alphabet of fundamental rights of the citizen.(43)"

the US supreme court then upheld the ability of states to regulate and license both motor vehicle and motorists by the 1920's, in a couple of court cases recognizing the danger and damage resulting from motor vehicle operation.

citizens have the right to travel by bike if they like, and all states now regulate motor vehicles and their operators.

Mycah

Police Officers in Florida will catch up to this law in 10 to 20 years, just like the rest of them...

CommuterRun

Just called Governor Crist's office and spoke with Will. The governor has not signed HB 971 as of yet.

shutterspeed100

Still more email and calls needed to reach the 2500 required for him to look at the bill. Please email him at Charlie.Crist@MyFlorida.com or call at (850) 488-4441 if you disagree with this bill.

cudak888 

Florida cyclists, remember: If you don’t have time to compose your own email, this site can help:

https://vetohb971.x10hosting.com/

You can also copy/paste the text from the site into your email to Crist.

A MS Word .doc flier can be downloaded off that site as well – ask all your local bike shops to put it up. DO IT NOW!

-Kurt

SunnyFlorida

Thanks Kurt for the link. I did my e-mail and made the call. This bill concerns all Florida cyclist regardless of where, how often and what they ride.