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  1. #1
    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    Hey JAM, now I know your name,

    The Hawaii Judiciary just changed itís public information link for traffic offenses, such that it is now searchable by license plate number. If the infraction is other than a parking ticket, then the listing includes a name and link to the case. Each court case includes a number associated to that name. The court number is hotlinked to all other traffic offenses associated with that name and AKAs.

    http://jimspss1.courts.state.hi.us:8...CFE23963599BFE

    Over the years, I have logged the plate numbers and actions of JAMs that have intentionally harassed me and placed me in danger. In running the log of license plates, some interesting commonality has shown through:

    1. Virtually all have been ticketed for speeding
    2. Most have been ticketed for not wearing a seat belt
    3. Many have failed to keep either their registration, safety inspection or insurance current
    4. Less than 5% of the plate numbers did not show any offense
    5. The other 95% mostly had multiple infractions.
    6. Only a few had DUI convictions

    With the name and if they own their home/condo, I have public database access such that I can look up their address. The phone book could also work if they list their address there (but Hawaii no longer requires the phone company provide phone books). I wonder if these people would continue to endanger cyclist if they understood they might get tracked down.
    Land of the Free, Because of the Brave.

  2. #2
    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    If you want to have fun, try running this Hawaii plate # JZD634.

    This guy actually got out of his car, started a fight and got his butt kicked.
    Last edited by CB HI; 12-01-10 at 01:13 PM.
    Land of the Free, Because of the Brave.

  3. #3
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    Thanks for the awesome posting. I am impressed that you have kept a personal log of the terrorists who have harassed you; I am just not that disciplined. Just think how safe and pleasant our roads would be if we took away people's cars and licenses for traffic offenses. That would mean that the 95% who are harassing you would be walking, cycling, in buses, in cabs or begging rides. If someone won't follow the law, why should they be trusted guiding a deadly missile?

  4. #4
    Senior Member MrCjolsen's Avatar
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    Safe driving isn't really about skill. It's about common sense and being able to say "Gee, that's kind of stupid, I better not do it."

    I consider myself a pretty crappy driver, but I haven't had an accident or ticket in 25 years.

  5. #5
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    This is better than wiki-leaks. haha
    I tried 20 random numbers and found a guy and girlfriend with 6 parking, 1 cellphone, 2 seat-belt and 1 missing car inspection sticker infraction. You could snoop on anybody. O I rarely wear a seat-belt.

  6. #6
    Senior Member mikeybikes's Avatar
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    I'm trying to come up with how this is a useful tool...
    My Bikes: 2009 Breezer Uptown EX | 1980 Miyata Six Ten | 1970 Hercules Three-Two-Speed
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeybikes View Post
    I'm trying to come up with how this is a useful tool...
    Public humiliation? Vigilantism?

  8. #8
    Senior Member sggoodri's Avatar
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    How far back in time did the record of speeding tickets go? I haven't had any kind of traffic ticket since about 1988-89, when I was a teenager, but I got two speeding tickets in my teens. What percentage of drivers in the general population have never received a ticket? I suspect that it might be small.

    I also suspect that once the wrong politician discovers his license plate number, driving record and other information on this server, it will be taken offline, "to protect the public's right to privacy."

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    Quote Originally Posted by mconlonx View Post
    Public humiliation? Vigilantism?
    Would it be illegal harassment to make a phone call to someone who harassed you on the road, if you could track them down this way? It might shake them up a bit by tearing away the veil of anonymity that they enjoy in their cars, so it could be worth doing if you could find their number and it wouldn't get you in trouble. I don't mean threatening them or something, so much as just letting them know that their identity is known and that if anything happens to you on the road the police will know where to look.

  10. #10
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mnemia View Post
    Would it be illegal harassment to make a phone call to someone who harassed you on the road, if you could track them down this way? It might shake them up a bit by tearing away the veil of anonymity that they enjoy in their cars, so it could be worth doing if you could find their number and it wouldn't get you in trouble. I don't mean threatening them or something, so much as just letting them know that their identity is known and that if anything happens to you on the road the police will know where to look.
    What about making up some official looking letter and sending it telling them they are in a database for errant drivers and have been reported by a cyclist to the database, and this information may be used against them in the future should they be involved in any cyclist related collision. None of the aforementioned is incorrect BTW, as CBHI has indicated that he has a log of JAMs. Maybe even include a HI based list of cyclists' rights to the road.

    It just lets the motorist know that "someone" is watching.

  11. #11
    Yabba-Dabba-Doo! AlmostTrick's Avatar
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    I like it and see how it could come in handy for reasons already mentioned. For me that would only be two or three times a year though.

    Presently there is a lifted Jeep in my neighborhood awaiting an anonymous hand written note that will soon be left on his windshield. Guaranteed to scare him at least a little.
    Have Bike, Will Travel

  12. #12
    Senior Member sggoodri's Avatar
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    What kind of communication or intervention has been demonstrated to be truly effective in changing the behavior of belligerent motorists? I'm not talking about motorists who lose their licenses or go to jail - just the ones who will remain on the road with a negative attitude and are likely to buzz cyclists.

    Clearly, in-person confrontations with cyclists don't work - things generally escalate for the worse. What about "official" messaging from police? It seems if they won't even wear their seat belts, they won't care what the police say. Does greater likelihood of being held accountable for unsafe behavior have an effect? Can empathy for other road users hurt by unsafe driving be developed before the driver hurts someone themselves? Surely someone has studied this issue for habitual reckless or road-rage driving behavior, haven't they?

  13. #13
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sggoodri View Post
    What kind of communication or intervention has been demonstrated to be truly effective in changing the behavior of belligerent motorists? I'm not talking about motorists who lose their licenses or go to jail - just the ones who will remain on the road with a negative attitude and are likely to buzz cyclists.

    Clearly, in-person confrontations with cyclists don't work - things generally escalate for the worse. What about "official" messaging from police? It seems if they won't even wear their seat belts, they won't care what the police say. Does greater likelihood of being held accountable for unsafe behavior have an effect? Can empathy for other road users hurt by unsafe driving be developed before the driver hurts someone themselves? Surely someone has studied this issue for habitual reckless or road-rage driving behavior, haven't they?
    I have to laugh... thinking of "intervention;" your examples are true... very little motivates scofflaws... so perhaps the most effective form of intervention is merely to slash their tires.

    I know, I know... highly illegal, and very negative, but when you get right down to it... "they won't care what the police say..." then what other solution exists?

  14. #14
    Senior Member ScottStr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sggoodri View Post
    What kind of communication or intervention has been demonstrated to be truly effective in changing the behavior of belligerent motorists?
    I can just picture the offending driver's loved ones sitting around in a circle, telling him how much they love him and how much it hurts, but they will have to cut off contact with him if he doesn't attend a defensive driving class with bicycle-safety emphasis.
    Last edited by ScottStr; 12-01-10 at 11:58 AM. Reason: Typo

  15. #15
    Yabba-Dabba-Doo! AlmostTrick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sggoodri View Post
    What kind of communication or intervention has been demonstrated to be truly effective in changing the behavior of belligerent motorists? I'm not talking about motorists who lose their licenses or go to jail - just the ones who will remain on the road with a negative attitude and are likely to buzz cyclists.

    Clearly, in-person confrontations with cyclists don't work - things generally escalate for the worse. What about "official" messaging from police? It seems if they won't even wear their seat belts, they won't care what the police say. Does greater likelihood of being held accountable for unsafe behavior have an effect? Can empathy for other road users hurt by unsafe driving be developed before the driver hurts someone themselves? Surely someone has studied this issue for habitual reckless or road-rage driving behavior, haven't they?
    Threat of harm to their person or property is the most likely thing to scare them straight. Thinly veiled threats coupled with “I know where you live” would make most anyone very uncomfortable.
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  16. #16
    "Per Ardua ad Surly" nelson249's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottStr View Post
    I can just picture the offending driver's loved ones sitting around in a circle, telling him how much they love him and how much it hurts, but they will have to cut off contact with him if he doesn't attend a defensive driving class with bicycle-safety emphasis.
    Perhaps a new idea for a A&E reality series? They could call it "Road Rage Intervention" and air it along with "Intervention", "Hoarders" and "Dawg the Bounty Hunter"
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  17. #17
    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sggoodri View Post
    What kind of communication or intervention has been demonstrated to be truly effective in changing the behavior of belligerent motorists? I'm not talking about motorists who lose their licenses or go to jail - just the ones who will remain on the road with a negative attitude and are likely to buzz cyclists.

    Clearly, in-person confrontations with cyclists don't work - things generally escalate for the worse. What about "official" messaging from police? It seems if they won't even wear their seat belts, they won't care what the police say. Does greater likelihood of being held accountable for unsafe behavior have an effect? Can empathy for other road users hurt by unsafe driving be developed before the driver hurts someone themselves? Surely someone has studied this issue for habitual reckless or road-rage driving behavior, haven't they?
    As I understand the program, Colorado has a system, with a website, that cyclist can report JAMs. The state police will then send out a letter of warning to the owner of the vehicle. Sadly, probably few other states have a similar program.

    Because there is only one freeway and one highway passing through a gulch which people may directly travel to Honolulu from my town, everyone gets funneled through one of the two routes. As such, I cross paths with the same JAMs that live near me on a regular basis. That is a big part of the reason for the JAM log. When jogging or just doing an easy ride around residential streets in my town, I have spotted vehicles which JAMs have used in their harassment. A few of these JAMs have repeatedly harassed me. Once I know where one lives, I have made it a point to ride by their home/apartment complex on a regular basis (completely legal and specifically exempt from Hawaii harassment and stalking laws as long as I do not make certain gestures or verbal threats). Once these JAMs have seen me a few times riding by/near their home, they have stopped the harassment.

    Disclaimer: There is one Hit&Run JAM that still carries a grudge against me. He lost both a criminal and a civil legal battles. He honks his horn, passes close and swerves in front of me almost every time he passes me. Sometimes, he even tries to get me with his windshield washer spray.

    Having an easy way of getting an address may be beneficial. It certainly beats the, by chance, location of JAMs of jogging by their home. But, as I found out when I ran many of the license #s in my log and then searched for addresses in the real-estate database, very few of the JAMs own their own homes/condos. When I have some free time, I will check the old style phone book and see if that is still a useful tool.
    Land of the Free, Because of the Brave.

  18. #18
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CB HI View Post
    As I understand the program, Colorado has a system, with a website, that cyclist can report JAMs. The state police will then send out a letter of warning to the owner of the vehicle. Sadly, probably few other states have a similar program.

    Because there is only one freeway and one highway passing through a gulch which people may directly travel to Honolulu from my town, everyone gets funneled through one of the two routes. As such, I cross paths with the same JAMs that live near me on a regular basis. That is a big part of the reason for the JAM log. When jogging or just doing an easy ride around residential streets in my town, I have spotted vehicles which JAMs have used in their harassment. A few of these JAMs have repeatedly harassed me. Once I know where one lives, I have made it a point to ride by their home/apartment complex on a regular basis (completely legal and specifically exempt from Hawaii harassment and stalking laws as long as I do not make certain gestures or verbal threats). Once these JAMs have seen me a few times riding by/near their home, they have stopped the harassment.

    Disclaimer: There is one Hit&Run JAM that still carries a grudge against me. He lost both a criminal and a civil legal battles. He honks his horn, passes close and swerves in front of me almost every time he passes me. Sometimes, he even tries to get me with his windshield washer spray.

    Having an easy way of getting an address may be beneficial. It certainly beats the, by chance, location of JAMs of jogging by their home. But, as I found out when I ran many of the license #s in my log and then searched for addresses in the real-estate database, very few of the JAMs own their own homes/condos. When I have some free time, I will check the old style phone book and see if that is still a useful tool.
    Two comments... one positive, and one negative.

    With regard to your repeated passing near some one's home... and getting positive results... I can't help but wonder if they suddenly see you as a neighbor and have thus stopped treating you badly... you are now "part of the community."

    OK the negative... So are you really being treated as the "driver of a vehicle" by these JAMs?

  19. #19
    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by genec View Post
    Two comments... one neighborly, and one negative.

    With regard to your repeated passing near some one's home... and getting positive results... I can't help but wonder if they suddenly see you as a neighbor and have thus stopped treating you badly... you are now "part of the community."
    Possibly, impossible to tell if they are just becoming neighborly or if they are cowardly bullies who are now concerned about what may happen to them since they are no longer anonymous.


    Quote Originally Posted by genec View Post
    OK the negative... So are you really being treated as the "driver of a vehicle" by these JAMs?
    JAMs are JAMs, they often treat other motorist just as badly. So with that in mind, I guess they are treating me as they would any other "driver of a vehicle". The other 99.x% of drivers treat me safely and properly in accordance with the traffic laws.

    As the traffic court database demonstrates, these JAMs are getting many traffic citations unrelated to any cyclist that may be on the roads.
    Last edited by CB HI; 12-01-10 at 02:13 PM.
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  20. #20
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CB HI View Post
    Possibly, impossible to tell if they are just becoming neighborly or if they are cowardly bullies who are now concerned about what may happen to them since they are no longer anonymous.
    Ah ha the old cockroach in the light of day theory... yeah that works too.

    Quote Originally Posted by CB HI View Post
    JAMs are JAMs, they often treat other motorist just as badly. So with that in mind, I guess they are treating me as they would any other "driver of a vehicle". The other 99.x% of drivers treat me safely and properly in accordance with the traffic laws.
    I can't debate that... I've never had the "honor" of meeting a JAM as both a motorist and a cyclist... so I really don't know if their behavior is exclusive to cyclists or universal.

  21. #21
    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by genec View Post
    I can't debate that... I've never had the "honor" of meeting a JAM as both a motorist and a cyclist... so I really don't know if their behavior is exclusive to cyclists or universal.
    I have seen my Hit&Run guy driving both on the freeway and on highways where he did not see me. He lives less than a mile from my home and he works 3 blocks away from my work (remeber my commute is 20+ miles each way - lots of roadway to cross paths on). I have seen him speeding and cutting off motorist on both the freeway and residential roads. I watched him run a red light forcing a motorist making a legal left turn on green arrow to slam on his brakes to prevent being T-boned.

    The day he hit me, he almost caused two head on collisions with oncoming motorist.
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  22. #22
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CB HI View Post
    I have seen my Hit&Run guy driving both on the freeway and on highways where he did not see me. He lives less than a mile from my home and he works 3 blocks away from my work (remeber my commute is 20+ miles each way - lots of roadway to cross paths on). I have seen him speeding and cutting off motorist on both the freeway and residential roads. I watched him run a red light forcing a motorist making a legal left turn on green arrow to slam on his brakes to prevent being T-boned.

    The day he hit me, he almost caused two head on collisions with oncoming motorist.
    That kind of JAM doesn't deserve to drive... really... probably an ahole just walking too.

  23. #23
    Senior Member ro-monster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B. Carfree View Post
    ...Just think how safe and pleasant our roads would be if we took away people's cars and licenses for traffic offenses. That would mean that the 95% who are harassing you would be walking, cycling, in buses, in cabs or begging rides....
    Taking away their cars might do something but I don't think revoking licenses would actually have very much of an effect. I seem to recall reading that up to 40% of California drivers are already unlicensed. Presumably that means there are a lot of people driving without licenses everywhere else too.

  24. #24
    genec genec's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ro-monster View Post
    Taking away their cars might do something but I don't think revoking licenses would actually have very much of an effect. I seem to recall reading that up to 40% of California drivers are already unlicensed. Presumably that means there are a lot of people driving without licenses everywhere else too.
    Uh maybe not... the states that are on the US border have a rather unique problem with "visitors" from other countries that come here and drive without licenses or insurance. No doubt there is a certain percentage of folks that don't have licenses in other states... it's just that CA has a lot more "visitors" that don't have licenses.

  25. #25
    2 Fat 2 Furious contango's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
    Threat of harm to their person or property is the most likely thing to scare them straight. Thinly veiled threats coupled with “I know where you live” would make most anyone very uncomfortable.
    I'd expect anything with evidence that "I know where you live" is actually true would make them wary.

    Excuse my ignorance here, can someone tell me what JAM stands for?

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