can't car manufacturers design cars to be more safe for bicyclists?
#1
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can't car manufacturers design cars to be more safe for bicyclists?
I first wrote out some of these thoughts three years ago. You can see my original post here.
But I still don't understand why more isn't being done here — or maybe there is, and I am not aware of it. I hope that by posting my question here, someone might be able to let me know about some radical research that addresses what I'm thinking about.
Let say, too, that I am aware of BMW and Mercedes and Toyota's research into radar-input navigation systems that are designed to avoid crashes. And while these are very real technologies (a friend avoided hitting a deer on the interstate because his Lexus "reacted" to the deer before he was even aware of it), a certain number of crashes will still happen. Especially in tight, urban areas, where the effectiveness of radar/computer-reacting systems is diminished.
Kids will always dart out in front of cars, and so will cyclists. And it won't always be the cyclists' fault. And even when it is, death need not be the penalty for a poor decision.
So, I'm wondering, what can car manufacturers do to make cars safer for bicyclists? Air bags on the outside? Bumpers made of jell-o? Seriously, I'd love to read or hear about some off-the-wall ideas as well as new of any real research you know about.
But I still don't understand why more isn't being done here — or maybe there is, and I am not aware of it. I hope that by posting my question here, someone might be able to let me know about some radical research that addresses what I'm thinking about.
Let say, too, that I am aware of BMW and Mercedes and Toyota's research into radar-input navigation systems that are designed to avoid crashes. And while these are very real technologies (a friend avoided hitting a deer on the interstate because his Lexus "reacted" to the deer before he was even aware of it), a certain number of crashes will still happen. Especially in tight, urban areas, where the effectiveness of radar/computer-reacting systems is diminished.
Kids will always dart out in front of cars, and so will cyclists. And it won't always be the cyclists' fault. And even when it is, death need not be the penalty for a poor decision.
So, I'm wondering, what can car manufacturers do to make cars safer for bicyclists? Air bags on the outside? Bumpers made of jell-o? Seriously, I'd love to read or hear about some off-the-wall ideas as well as new of any real research you know about.
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In my urban setting, I think the biggest issue with cars is the people driving them, who make bad decisions. I guess the most realistic way for technology to improve the situation would be for stopped cars to have radar guns. A driver at a 2-way stop has to decide when there's a large enough gap to enter the stream of traffic. Usually, when they see a bike coming, they go, and I (charitably) suspect it's because people don't realize how fast bikes can go. If a driver knew I was doing 30 mph, instead of 8, that might get them to wait another few seconds and not test my crash avoidance skills...
#3
Fresh Garbage
Put large safety warning labels on the sides of cars "WARNING: OPERATING THIS MACHINE MAY RESULT IN DEATH OR SERIOUS INJURY"
#4
Cycle Year Round
The simplest safety measure is for motorist to simply obey speed limits and pay attention. There, most problems solved.
An alternative is to include speed limit data into gps road maps and connect that to a variable speed governor such that drivers are prevented from exceeding speed limits.
An alternative is to include speed limit data into gps road maps and connect that to a variable speed governor such that drivers are prevented from exceeding speed limits.
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They already have that, except that the GPS can warn the driver about speeding, rather than mess with the engine. That's probably a good idea, otherwise when you're doing 75 mph on the freeway - the legal limit and the speed of traffic - but your GPS suffers a momentary lapse of reason and thinks you're several thousand miles away, on a residential street or in the middle of some wilderness area, it doesn't bring your car to a crawl and get you rear ended.
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I think they could start with just making it easier to see out of the interior. Newer cars seem so have small windows and pillars everywhere. While these probably make the car more aero, and give them a place to hide more airbags, I'm finding it harder and harder just to see out and around the car.
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Of course it's also possible that a driver doesn't want to be stuck behind a bike that cycles at 10mph or less and won't let them pass.
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I think they could start with just making it easier to see out of the interior. Newer cars seem so have small windows and pillars everywhere. While these probably make the car more aero, and give them a place to hide more airbags, I'm finding it harder and harder just to see out and around the car.
example:
1985 civic
2005 civic
example:
1985 civic
2005 civic
newer cars, with their more rounded panels, cause less severe injuries to pedestrians, compared to jagged boxes. Also has better cushioning for biological objects getting struck also lower bumper seems to help too.
compare:
https://www.euroncap.com/tests/honda_civic_2006/270.aspx
https://www.euroncap.com/tests/bmw_3_..._2005/225.aspx
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https://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm
Last edited by AEO; 12-07-10 at 08:24 PM.
#9
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Make cars smaller and much much slower.
Require huge labels on the sides of every car with TERRIBLE pictures of car wrecks on them just like those pictures on cigarette cartons of infected lungs and mouths.
Require very expensive and thorough drivers training.
Require huge labels on the sides of every car with TERRIBLE pictures of car wrecks on them just like those pictures on cigarette cartons of infected lungs and mouths.
Require very expensive and thorough drivers training.
Last edited by zeppinger; 12-07-10 at 08:59 PM.
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Seriously, it's almost totally the driver. As long as it's in decent working order, no car old or new is likely to harm cyclists or peds if it is driven properly.
Last edited by AlmostTrick; 12-07-10 at 09:02 PM.
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It's not the vehicle, it's the driver. It's especially the lack of financial penalty for collisions. They are not accidents, they are bad driving. Impose a $2,000 penalty for any collision, a $5,000 penalty for any bodily injury collision and a $100,000 penalty for any collision with death. Do that and behavior would change. Make these penalties separate from insurance deductibles, make it illegal to deal with these penalties via insurance policies. They must be paid within 30 days by the driver, if not enforcement via lien on wages and IRS lost of deductions and credits until penalty is paid. This would make cars safer. People would scream bloody murder about the costs and give all sorts of bogus reasons why they are special and can't be expected to drive safely.
I would expect another side effect of this is that collisions will drop to almost nothing.
I would expect another side effect of this is that collisions will drop to almost nothing.
#12
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It's not the vehicle, it's the driver. It's especially the lack of financial penalty for collisions. They are not accidents, they are bad driving. Impose a $2,000 penalty for any collision, a $5,000 penalty for any bodily injury collision and a $100,000 penalty for any collision with death. Do that and behavior would change. Make these penalties separate from insurance deductibles, make it illegal to deal with these penalties via insurance policies. They must be paid within 30 days by the driver, if not enforcement via lien on wages and IRS lost of deductions and credits until penalty is paid. This would make cars safer. People would scream bloody murder about the costs and give all sorts of bogus reasons why they are special and can't be expected to drive safely.
I would expect another side effect of this is that collisions will drop to almost nothing.
I would expect another side effect of this is that collisions will drop to almost nothing.
I have the feeling we'd see a lot more hit-and-runs if we go this route.
#13
Cycle Year Round
They already have that, except that the GPS can warn the driver about speeding, rather than mess with the engine. That's probably a good idea, otherwise when you're doing 75 mph on the freeway - the legal limit and the speed of traffic - but your GPS suffers a momentary lapse of reason and thinks you're several thousand miles away, on a residential street or in the middle of some wilderness area, it doesn't bring your car to a crawl and get you rear ended.
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Granted, there would still be idiots, but IMO, that would eliminate at least a third of them, and render another third or so unable to text/eat/drink/whatever while driving.
#15
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^^
And add an engine cut off if the driver takes the second hand off the wheel.
And add an engine cut off if the driver takes the second hand off the wheel.
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Ban automatic transmissions; if you lack the intelligence and coordination to drive a stick, you have no business guiding a 2-ton missile at all.
Granted, there would still be idiots, but IMO, that would eliminate at least a third of them, and render another third or so unable to text/eat/drink/whatever while driving.
Granted, there would still be idiots, but IMO, that would eliminate at least a third of them, and render another third or so unable to text/eat/drink/whatever while driving.
It is sad that we have all these engineering improvements like ABS, AWD, awesome tires that almost never get flats, suspension systems that smooth out even the worst roadways, airbags, near universal seat-belt use, and yet we have seen almost no decrease in the CARnage on our roads. It really does seem like the easier driving gets the lazier the motoring public gets and the worse they drive.
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It is sad that we have all these engineering improvements like ABS, AWD, awesome tires that almost never get flats, suspension systems that smooth out even the worst roadways, airbags, near universal seat-belt use, and yet we have seen almost no decrease in the CARnage on our roads. It really does seem like the easier driving gets the lazier the motoring public gets and the worse they drive.
It's been suggested that cars would be driven much more carefully if the airbag in the steering wheel were replaced by a large spike aimed directly at the driver's chest.
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Might as well ask if bicycle manufacturers can do to make bicycles safer for drivers of cars.
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It is sad that we have all these engineering improvements like ABS, AWD, awesome tires that almost never get flats, suspension systems that smooth out even the worst roadways, airbags, near universal seat-belt use, and yet we have seen almost no decrease in the CARnage on our roads. It really does seem like the easier driving gets the lazier the motoring public gets and the worse they drive.
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Car manufacturers HAVE put a little effort in recent years into making cars safer for pedestrians that get hit. They try to design cars so that pedestrians get thrown up over top rather than falling under the wheels. I don't know if they do any testing and design specifically to help with car-bicycle collisions, though. Seems doubtful.
Also, there is the problem that the car companies are making whole classes of passenger vehicles (SUVs and huge pickups) that have been proven statistically to be much more dangerous to anything smaller, including normal cars. The fatality rate for people in cars hit by SUVs is much higher than the fatality rate for people in cars hit by other cars. And while I don't have the figures in front of me, I'd imagine that SUVs are also more dangerous to pedestrians or bicyclists that get hit by them, simply because they are higher off the ground and therefore more likely to roll over one. So, we already know that the car companies view safety to others as a tertiary concern at most, following marketing and safety for the occupants. Why would they care about pedestrian safety when they are heavily marketing an entire class of vehicles that kill lots more other people just so that the buyers can "feel" more secure/manly/etc? This focus on the vehicle occupants' safety to the exclusion of others will not change unless the government forces them to.
Also, there is the problem that the car companies are making whole classes of passenger vehicles (SUVs and huge pickups) that have been proven statistically to be much more dangerous to anything smaller, including normal cars. The fatality rate for people in cars hit by SUVs is much higher than the fatality rate for people in cars hit by other cars. And while I don't have the figures in front of me, I'd imagine that SUVs are also more dangerous to pedestrians or bicyclists that get hit by them, simply because they are higher off the ground and therefore more likely to roll over one. So, we already know that the car companies view safety to others as a tertiary concern at most, following marketing and safety for the occupants. Why would they care about pedestrian safety when they are heavily marketing an entire class of vehicles that kill lots more other people just so that the buyers can "feel" more secure/manly/etc? This focus on the vehicle occupants' safety to the exclusion of others will not change unless the government forces them to.
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Well, I just don't see how an auto can be made safer assuming a similar weight and speed. Kinetic Energy still equals 1/2 mass times velocity squared.
Augmenting the guidance systems would help. I have looked at statistical figures on fatalities. It looks as if males have far higher fatality rates than females. Male drivers currently suffer twice the fatalities per mile that females have. Maybe we have a case of testosterone poisoning. A decent safety precaution might be mandatory castration of all male drivers. I doubt that one would be very popular though.
Augmenting the guidance systems would help. I have looked at statistical figures on fatalities. It looks as if males have far higher fatality rates than females. Male drivers currently suffer twice the fatalities per mile that females have. Maybe we have a case of testosterone poisoning. A decent safety precaution might be mandatory castration of all male drivers. I doubt that one would be very popular though.
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Well, I just don't see how an auto can be made safer assuming a similar weight and speed. Kinetic Energy still equals 1/2 mass times velocity squared.
Augmenting the guidance systems would help. I have looked at statistical figures on fatalities. It looks as if males have far higher fatality rates than females. Male drivers currently suffer twice the fatalities per mile that females have. Maybe we have a case of testosterone poisoning. A decent safety precaution might be mandatory castration of all male drivers. I doubt that one would be very popular though.
Augmenting the guidance systems would help. I have looked at statistical figures on fatalities. It looks as if males have far higher fatality rates than females. Male drivers currently suffer twice the fatalities per mile that females have. Maybe we have a case of testosterone poisoning. A decent safety precaution might be mandatory castration of all male drivers. I doubt that one would be very popular though.
But again, Americans don't care about buying cars that are less likely to kill other people. So the car companies won't put much effort into that unless forced to by regulation. Safety for OTHERS is not a feature that the car companies have decided is very marketable.
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Ban automatic transmissions; if you lack the intelligence and coordination to drive a stick, you have no business guiding a 2-ton missile at all.
Granted, there would still be idiots, but IMO, that would eliminate at least a third of them, and render another third or so unable to text/eat/drink/whatever while driving.
Granted, there would still be idiots, but IMO, that would eliminate at least a third of them, and render another third or so unable to text/eat/drink/whatever while driving.
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