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Old 11-24-04, 05:16 PM   #1
MadeInKIM
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NYC November CM... Black Friday!

Me and friend wanted to come into NYC for this Friday's CM.
But we don't wanna get arrested either.
Will they be enforcing bike regulations (reflectors, lights, helmets...)???
And traffic laws???
~ellis

Its also, Buy Nothing Day!
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Old 11-24-04, 06:16 PM   #2
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make sure to buy your lights before buy nothing day. helmets aren't the law- yet.
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Old 11-24-04, 06:55 PM   #3
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Its also, Buy Nothing Day!

Yea, good luck with that.
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Old 11-25-04, 07:41 PM   #4
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You won't get arrested if you don't break the law. At least, that's the theory.
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Old 11-25-04, 07:46 PM   #5
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Ain't happening heh.
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Old 11-26-04, 08:31 PM   #6
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OK so that was a let down. I finally convinced my girlfriend to come out to Critical Mass, which was very exciting for me.

We went out to Union Square where there was a pretty thin turn out, but TONS of cops and the pre-requisite demoralizing van announcing that people who ride in the mass will be arrested.

Cops were distributing flyers with this text:

NOTICE TO BICYCLISTS:

THE NEW YORK CITY POLICE DEPARTMENT REQUIRES YOUR COOPERATION IN COMPLYING WITH THE LAW AND PROTECTING THE PUBLIC FROM HARM.

IT IS DANGEROUS AND ILLEGAL TO RIDE A BICYCLE IN A PROCESSION ON THE PUBLIC STREETS WITHIN NEW YORK CITY, IF A PERMIT FOR THE PROCESSION HAS NOT BEEN ISSUED BY THE NYC POLICE DEPARTMENT.

NO PERMIT HAS BEEN ISSUED FOR A BICYCLE PROCESSION FOR TONIGHT, NOVEMBER 26, 2004.

IF YOU CHOOSE TO RIDE IN A PROCESSION THIS EVENING, YOU WILL BE ARRESTED AND YOUR BICYCLE WILL BE SEIZED.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.

What is the story with this? Last I heard, the city's injuction against Critical Mass riders was denied and a preliminary injuction barring the City from seizing bicycles without charges was granted.

More info on that
here.

There were cops on many corners around Union Square park with long banners of orange mesh fabric that they were clearly using as nets to surround bikers and arrest them.

Although the majority of bikers had already left Union Square park and dispersed, I saw several girls in riot cuffs (the plastic handcuffs) and their bikes stacked up together on the North East corner of 14th street in front of the Diesel store.

Do four girls count as a procession now?

What is the story with the legal issues??? If anyone has any info, please post.
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Old 11-26-04, 08:33 PM   #7
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I swear, Kona, I bugged out of there so fast people's head woulda spun. It was a really ugly scene down in the Square tonight...
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Old 11-26-04, 08:37 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Konakazi
OK so that was a let down. I finally convinced my girlfriend to come out to Critical Mass, which was very exciting for me.

We went out to Union Square where there was a pretty thin turn out, but TONS of cops and the pre-requisite demoralizing van announcing that people who ride in the mass will be arrested.

Cops were distributing flyers with this text:

NOTICE TO BICYCLISTS:

THE NEW YORK CITY POLICE DEPARTMENT REQUIRES YOUR COOPERATION IN COMPLYING WITH THE LAW AND PROTECTING THE PUBLIC FROM HARM.

IT IS DANGEROUS AND ILLEGAL TO RIDE A BICYCLE IN A PROCESSION ON THE PUBLIC STREETS WITHIN NEW YORK CITY, IF A PERMIT FOR THE PROCESSION HAS NOT BEEN ISSUED BY THE NYC POLICE DEPARTMENT.

NO PERMIT HAS BEEN ISSUED FOR A BICYCLE PROCESSION FOR TONIGHT, NOVEMBER 26, 2004.

IF YOU CHOOSE TO RIDE IN A PROCESSION THIS EVENING, YOU WILL BE ARRESTED AND YOUR BICYCLE WILL BE SEIZED.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.

What is the story with this? Last I heard, the city's injuction against Critical Mass riders was denied and a preliminary injuction barring the City from seizing bicycles without charges was granted.

More info on that
here.

There were cops on many corners around Union Square park with long banners of orange mesh fabric that they were clearly using as nets to surround bikers and arrest them.

Although the majority of bikers had already left Union Square park and dispersed, I saw several girls in riot cuffs (the plastic handcuffs) and their bikes stacked up together on the North East corner of 14th street in front of the Diesel store.

Do four girls count as a procession now?

What is the story with the legal issues??? If anyone has any info, please post.

Were the police that arrested people carrying toilet plungers?
I'm not sure about NYC, but if a cop violates a court ruling here in California they become personally libale, and they can be sued, along with the city.
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Old 11-26-04, 08:37 PM   #9
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Vince, did you make it to Washington Square or did you just split from Union Square? I was looking for you and Laika but alas.

What made you split so quickly?
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Old 11-26-04, 08:44 PM   #10
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I split from Union Square. We had the police literally up our asses. Then I saw the flier, the idiots next to me were taunting the police...

And so on and so on...

I just had a feeling it was going to get ugly...

Check out my post on my site...

That's how my night went. Believe me, I am not happy, and my wife is even more pi$$ed off and she wasn't even there...
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Old 11-26-04, 09:08 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vincenzosi
In an hour there, I saw people curse at, flip off, gesture at, and mock the police that were there, all with zero provocation. Contary to what their feeble brains can comprehend, that does nothing to endear yourself to the gun toting, handcuff flinging night stick holding law officers of which there were so many.
Pretty well written, V. I got to USN at 7 exactly. I didn't see any of the blatant rudeness you did. There was an occasional feeble "f*ck you!" as the prerecorded loop paused between repetitions, but mostly people were stzadning around talking it over by the time I got there.

I ended up walking my bike to 11th and University and then riding down to Washington Square Park. somebody I know told me that TimesUp was calling for a new rendezvous at 8pm. I rode down MacDougal with Yoshi to get food. He got a falaffel, I went to a curry joint. I don't know if he went back, but I got fat and sassy on vindaloo and dragged my butt home.

V, I hope that I read your site correctly and you were more discouraged by the overwhelming police presence than by the poor manners of the CM riders. I honestly don't know what you encountered before I got there...the group was discouraged but chill when I arrived. You are right, though...this was a discouraging waste of a Friday night. Hopefully CM can stop being so political/confrontational and start being fun again soon. Maybe let's hook up for one of the apolitical moonlight rides or something, OK?

Kona, I'm sorry I didn't see you there. I had my red bandanna on and everything! Maybe next time.

Yoshi, I hope you got home safe. I would have stuck around but I don't want to get arrested again until February, when my ACD expires. Hope everyone who did stick around got home OK.

Man, it was a cold night for a ride!
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Old 11-26-04, 09:09 PM   #12
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I ran into Laika twice, once at Union Square and then again at Washington Square when we changed locations. We ended up changing locations and changing the start time and actually managed to confuse the police so that when we started riding (only 20-30 strong, with maybe 50 more joining later) there were no cops and we went through the financial district and chinatown pretty much undisturbed.
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Old 11-26-04, 09:09 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Konakazi
Vince, did you make it to Washington Square or did you just split from Union Square? I was looking for you and Laika but alas.

What made you split so quickly?
Kona, I wish I'd seen you. How long did you stick around? I was at USN and WSP both.
It was cold out!
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Old 11-26-04, 09:11 PM   #14
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Laika, you did read it correctly. I saw the idiots as annoyances, but I am still fuming over the police. This isn't the last of this. I'm so sorry I didn't get to bump into you guys

We do have to get together though. Maybe a NYC Bikeforums.net informal ride down the greenway on a Sunday Afternoon or something...
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Old 11-26-04, 09:13 PM   #15
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Hey Laika! Glad you chimed in. I was standing by the stairs of that little stage area with my girlfriend and even asked someone else all dressed in black if they were you, haha. Oh well.

We were there from about 7:10 to 7:45 I think, trying to figure out what was up and chatting with a friend I ran in to.

Yeah what a let down tonight was. I didnt' see any confrontations, just a lot of dejected people bummed out that the city was ruining a community activity.

I'm curious as to what happened at Washington Square.

So what is the deal with the flyers / announcements vs. the court decisions that were letting CM go without permits? I was completely confused, as I 'm sure the cops wanted us to be.

---

I'm all for the bikeforums ride! It'd be great just to put faces with names for starters.
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Old 11-26-04, 09:17 PM   #16
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Well Kona, the way I understand it, is that the flyers were within the guidelines technically.

The ruling said the police couldn't seize the bikes without charging the riders. In effect, the police warned the riders that the charges would be having a percession without a permit, thus giving them cause to jack your bike.

I'm no lawyer, but I think that's their loophole.

Don't get me wrong; I don't agree with it; I just think that's how they tapdanced it.
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Old 11-26-04, 09:23 PM   #17
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But if the courts said that Critical Mass didn't NEED a permit, then saying that riding without a permit is cause to be arresested and have your bike seized is rather nonsensical.

I'm a little frustrated with Time's Up. If they are going to be involved with Critical Mass, I wish they would take a leadership role rather than just fading in to background. Clearly the opposition is organized and we need to be too.
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Old 11-26-04, 09:26 PM   #18
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I think those of us in this city who give a damn about the deteriorating conditions of cycling in this city need to take it over and go through the legal hoops if CM isn't going to die...

Get the permits...

Pay the fees...

Do everything by the book...

The way things are, we'll never win.
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Old 11-26-04, 09:26 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Konakazi

Yeah what a let down tonight was. I didnt' see any confrontations, just a lot of dejected people bummed out that the city was ruining a community activity.

I'm curious as to what happened at Washington Square.
Looked like more of the same til I went and ate.

Quote:
So what is the deal with the flyers / announcements vs. the court decisions that were letting CM go without permits? I was completely confused, as I 'm sure the cops wanted us to be.

I think the police are just acting like that didn't happen. This was hateful and discouraging tonight.
Quote:
I'm all for the bikeforums ride! It'd be great just to put faces with names for starters.
Me too!
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Old 11-26-04, 09:29 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vincenzosi
I think those of us in this city who give a damn about the deteriorating conditions of cycling in this city need to take it over and go through the legal hoops if CM isn't going to die...

Get the permits...

Pay the fees...

Do everything by the book...

The way things are, we'll never win.
I'm interested to see if the lawyers are able to make hay with this at all. The preemptive threat aginst the ride is a new tactic.

The other alternative to making CM street legal is to have the all-new sooper seekrit CM. Like every third thursday, meeting at a randomly chosen intersection, all flash-mob stylie. Or something. This blows, tho.
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Old 11-26-04, 09:32 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Yoshi
I ran into Laika twice, once at Union Square and then again at Washington Square when we changed locations. We ended up changing locations and changing the start time and actually managed to confuse the police so that when we started riding (only 20-30 strong, with maybe 50 more joining later) there were no cops and we went through the financial district and chinatown pretty much undisturbed.
Good for ya! I hope it was fun.
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Old 11-26-04, 09:34 PM   #22
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This definitely blows. The overresponse by the police was outrageous.

The "netting" was even worse. This could've been a really fun night. Instead only the cops could walk home puffing out their chests at how they busted up us rabble rousers.

I never should've doubted the stuff I heard about the police and critical mass in the past. Man was I frigging wrong. Anyone who thinks it's all the fault of CM'ers really needs to take their heads out of their bums and pay attention.
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Old 11-26-04, 09:37 PM   #23
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It's not the fault of CM'ers. It's the fault of all those people who think they're cool by expressing their angst at CM with their own political agendas. There's nothing wrong with a bunch of guys riding around in bikes. There IS something wrong if they're going to use it to disrupt the city for a political agenda. Which is exactly what happened at the RNC. I knew it was gonna happen and it did.

CM is a good idea but too many kids think just cause they have something to be angry about they deserve to use CM as a forum for expressing it.

I bike to work every day along with a whole bunch of people who take the main avenue I take and several of my coworkers, THAT is our CM. Not this once a month crap.
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Old 11-26-04, 09:54 PM   #24
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Well it's only crap now that the man has thrown an orange net around it , flown a helicopter over it, and got the press to record the whole thing.

I think the solution shouldn't be making it secretive but rather working with the city to legitimize it.

These situations have happened in other cities. I was watching a documenatry on OLN about the CM in Austin and how the cops were harassing them forever. They wound up videotaping every CM to show how the cops were acting.

Long story short they wound up getting some incriminating footage of the cops and showed it to local government officials and wound up getting a lot of breathing room for the ride.

I think there should be some serious organization of Critcial Mass. Volunteer marshalls would help a lot and I just think that if the group would learn to police itself we wouldn't have to have the government doing it for us.

Set a ton of co-operation and positivity rather than recklessness and disruption.

It would be nice to be able to ride and not see dumb asses drinking beers, throwing cans at people, or doing bunny hops off the hoods of cars, etc.
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Old 11-26-04, 10:13 PM   #25
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Quote:
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...It would be nice to be able to ride and not see dumb asses drinking beers, throwing cans at people, or doing bunny hops off the hoods of cars, etc.
Doh! My bad! I'll stop that.
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