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-   -   The helmet thread (http://www.bikeforums.net/advocacy-safety/771371-helmet-thread.html)

ianstew 06-09-12 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hagen2456 (Post 14334818)
This is too stupid for me, sorry. Straw that broke the camel's back. Will someone please tell me how to "ignore" another member?

LOL

Go to my profile, look down under my profile pic, and you will see "add to ignore list"

mconlonx 06-09-12 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Six jours (Post 14334680)
You moved the goalposts. I'm looking for examples of "look(ing) down disdainfully on those who chose to wear a helmet". I just don't see that.

Then how 'bout an example of someone looking down disdainfully on those who don't wear helmets as being moronic?

I guess I'd need an example of what Sudo is talking about to reply in kind.

curbtender 06-09-12 07:34 PM

Just checking in... are people trying to talk other people out of a helmet? Or are people just saying they don't need a helmet, leave me alone? I wear a helmet because I'm going bald on top of my head and my ball cap doesn't stay on at 45mph.

mconlonx 06-09-12 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hagen2456 (Post 14334403)
That's not QUITE the same thing, but I get what you mean. On the other hand, there's been lots of abuse on both sides. I just can't think of an example of people calling helmet-wearers idiots for just wearing a helmet :-)

Hmm. Maybe valid.

Is there a substative difference between "you're stupid for wearing a helmet" and "you're stupid for not understanding why it's stupid to wear a helmet"?

mconlonx 06-09-12 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by curbtender (Post 14335278)
Just checking in... are people trying to talk other people out of a helmet? Or are people just saying they don't need a helmet, leave me alone? I wear a helmet because I'm going bald on top of my head and my ball cap doesn't stay on at 45mph.

People are still advocating helmets as unnecessary in the milieu of everyday cycling due to the various detriments attributable to helmets, and the lack of verifiable protective qualities assigned to them in the face of widespread public belief that they protect beyond their design parameters in situations for which they have not been designed, tested, or subsequently found effective.

With a side of "I don't need a helmet, leave me alone."

hagen2456 06-09-12 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mconlonx (Post 14335281)
Hmm. Maybe valid.

Is there a substative difference between "you're stupid for wearing a helmet" and "you're stupid for not understanding why it's stupid to wear a helmet"?

Aw, come on. No need for straw men, eh? Your two alternatives are both rather different from "You're stupid for not understanding the limitations and possible dangers of bike helmets, but please use it if you wish to".

hagen2456 06-09-12 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mconlonx (Post 14335308)
People are still advocating helmets as unnecessary in the milieu of everyday cycling due to the various detriments attributable to helmets, and the lack of verifiable protective qualities assigned to them in the face of widespread public belief that they protect beyond their design parameters in situations for which they have not been designed, tested, or subsequently found effective.

With a side of "I don't need a helmet, leave me alone."

Except that I for one tend to think that helmets are of smaller benefit the faster you ride.

mconlonx 06-09-12 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hagen2456 (Post 14335328)
Aw, come on. No need for straw men, eh? Your two alternatives are both rather different from "You're stupid for not understanding the limitations and possible dangers of bike helmets, but please use it if you wish to".

Not actively trying to introduce a straw man argument here--acknowledging your point and seeking further clarification. Thank you for that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hagen2456 (Post 14335332)
Except that I for one tend to think that helmets are of smaller benefit the faster you ride.

Certainly.

rekmeyata 06-09-12 10:12 PM

I would like to take the next few moments and be insulting to everyone, but no one in particular.

You all suffer from symbolic oedipal anxiety combined with defensive infantile fantasies and fixated neurotic processing over helmets. Your mothers were hamsters and your fathers smelt of elderberries, you bunch of dweeby lunatics who have delusions about being the degenerate fruit baskets you all are, in addition to being cross dressing dysfunctional buffoons riding around in those bibs you bunch of wrinkly rejects.

And I leave you with this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zF3kAoLusAg

I thought I would relieve the nauseating boredom a bit.



Six jours 06-10-12 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianstew (Post 14334704)
Thats because you are one of the ones looking down disdainfully.........

Oh, I have all kinds of disdain alright. I disdain willfully ignorant people. I disdain people who can't be bothered to spell and punctuate. I disdain cyclists who fall over at the slightest provocation; who are constantly finding pedestrians and animals "magically appearing" in front of them. And I certainly disdain folks who are so galactically stupid that they think merely riding a bicycle without a helmet is tantamount to suicide, and who combine their stupidity with the kind of arrogance that allows them to tell everyone they see to "put on a helmet, moron!!!"

And I suppose I disdain folks so dense they can't tell the difference between disdain for helmet wearers vs. disdain for the above kind of folks who also happen to be wearing helmets.

Hope that helps clear things up for you.

Six jours 06-10-12 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mconlonx (Post 14335244)
Then how 'bout an example of someone looking down disdainfully on those who don't wear helmets as being moronic?

I guess I'd need an example of what Sudo is talking about to reply in kind.

I read the first sentence six times and in all honesty I can't make head or tail of it.

The second one, though, is between you and Sudo. I just really want to see some examples of someone being given a hard time here just because they choose to wear a helmet.

ianstew 06-10-12 02:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Six jours (Post 14335961)
Oh, I have all kinds of disdain alright. I disdain willfully ignorant people. I disdain people who can't be bothered to spell and punctuate. I disdain cyclists who fall over at the slightest provocation; who are constantly finding pedestrians and animals "magically appearing" in front of them. And I certainly disdain folks who are so galactically stupid that they think merely riding a bicycle without a helmet is tantamount to suicide, and who combine their stupidity with the kind of arrogance that allows them to tell everyone they see to "put on a helmet, moron!!!"

And I suppose I disdain folks so dense they can't tell the difference between disdain for helmet wearers vs. disdain for the above kind of folks who also happen to be wearing helmets.

Hope that helps clear things up for you.

Wasn't asking nor looking for clarification on any level. It doesn't take much to figure out your tactics and MO. My comment was spot on.

sudo bike 06-10-12 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mconlonx (Post 14331893)
As opposed to the many in this thread who look down disdainfully on those who chose to wear a helmet as being moronic and ignoring the "facts"...?

As noted, that's not usually the same thing. People aren't derided for wearing a helmet, but for a) preaching about how it saved them from serious injury or drain bamage, or b) talking about why wearing a helmet is good/necessary/etc. I'm sure there have been exceptions to this, but on the whole I think it's accurate.

I don't know anyone who has simply called someone an idiot for wearing a helmet and nothing more. I think nearly, if not everyone, talking about helmet limitations fully admit that there are some situations where they may be helpful. As I said, I even wear one in some limited situations.

Meanwhile, and what the real point of the quoted text was, people are being insanely hypocritical by willingly sacrificing their own optimum safety (by not choosing optimal helmets for safety) and then proceeding to deride people who make a similar decision and decide to forgo one altogether. "Organ donor" or "Darwin candidate" seems to be mentioned a lot about people who just choose not to use one.

And if you've never been lectured about not wearing a helmet, you haven't not worn one often :). I've been lectured at from cyclists on the MUP, to coworkers as I walk the bike in, to self appointed safety-police of the Internet.

skye 06-10-12 06:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rydabent (Post 14334722)
Discounting all the anti helmet blather, I went for a very enjoyable bent club ride today. I put the helmet on when we started, and totally forgot all about it till the ride ended and I took it off.

Senility is a wonderful thing.

curbtender 06-10-12 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rekmeyata (Post 14335724)
I would like to take the next few moments and be insulting to everyone, but no one in particular.

You all suffer from symbolic oedipal anxiety combined with defensive infantile fantasies and fixated neurotic processing over helmets. Your mothers were hamsters and your fathers smelt of elderberries, you bunch of dweeby lunatics who have delusions about being the degenerate fruit baskets you all are, in addition to being cross dressing dysfunctional buffoons riding around in those bibs you bunch of wrinkly rejects.

And I leave you with this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zF3kAoLusAg

I thought I would relieve the nauseating boredom a bit.



Thought for sure I'd get this link... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9V7zbWNznbs
French showing proper use of helmets.

rydabent 06-10-12 08:17 AM

Skye

So are egotistical people that think they know everything!!!

Six jours 06-10-12 11:23 AM

I think it might be possible to divide cyclists into two groups: those who aren't convinced helmets are necessary, and those who crash because they ran over a road reflector.

mconlonx 06-10-12 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Six jours (Post 14335969)
I read the first sentence six times and in all honesty I can't make head or tail of it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sudo bike (Post 14336275)
As noted, that's not usually the same thing. People aren't derided for wearing a helmet, but for a) preaching about how it saved them from serious injury or drain bamage, or b) talking about why wearing a helmet is good/necessary/etc. I'm sure there have been exceptions to this, but on the whole I think it's accurate.

It took a while, but I think I get it: perhaps I was delving into some kind of false equivalence...?

Mea culpa. (<-- Swahili for "my bad")

LesterOfPuppets 06-10-12 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sudo bike (Post 14336275)
"Organ donor" or "Darwin candidate" seems to be mentioned a lot about people who just choose not to use one.

My favorite is "If I didn't have my helmet on I'd be eating dinner with a straw." Surely if they thought about it for a second they'd realize that a typical bicycle helmet offers no protection to the jaw.

http://images.smh.com.au/2010/07/04/...nk-600x400.jpg

mconlonx 06-10-12 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LesterOfPuppets (Post 14337194)
My favorite is "If I didn't have my helmet on I'd be eating dinner with a straw." Surely if they thought about it for a second they'd realize that a typical bicycle helmet offers no protection to the jaw.

http://images.smh.com.au/2010/07/04/...nk-600x400.jpg

Helmet does not protect from getting disdainfully punched in the mouth by one of the bare-head brigade for wearing one in the first place...

skye 06-10-12 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rydabent (Post 14336485)
Skye

So are egotistical people that think they know everything!!!

It's not egotistical if it's true.

oxfordd30 06-11-12 04:01 AM

1 Attachment(s)
I think this conversation may have taken a turn for the worse, lol. There's no reason to be hostile over someone else's personal protection. Please, save the hostility for the lazy driver that is not watching where he is going and claims he 'didn't see you' despite all your reflective gear.
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=255404

njkayaker 06-11-12 04:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sudo bike (Post 14330960)
Have you ever skateboarded?

Back when I still did, I'd be a lot more tired after 2 miles of skateboarding than 2 miles of riding. Same for equivalent times on each; put me on a bike and 30-60 minutes of riding is nothing... make me jog it or skateboard it and my legs will be on fire :p. Bikes have a mechanical advantage... you can amble along with not much effort. With a skateboard, even its ambling speed requires more effort because you don't have the benefit of gearing to help you..

:rolleyes: No shizzle. The number of people riding skateboards 2 miles appears to be very, very small. And the percentage of skateboarders who do it (with any sort of regularity) is small too.

Weirdly missing the point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LesterOfPuppets (Post 14331616)
Ummm. OK, You're right AND you know skateboarding. Satisfied? ;)

:rolleyes: Weirdly missing the point.

=====================

Regardless of the activity, people are not going to tend to use or prefer using closed helmets, including the "skater" types, for high-effort sport

Thus, Monster Pete's notion that the closed "skater" types might be better could be true but it's not relevant because people won't use them.

If people are using closed helmets (including the "skater" type), they are not typically doing high-effort sports in them.

(The fact that there are exceptions, such as triathlon helmets, doesn't mean that is wrong either.)

NCbiker 06-11-12 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by njkayaker (Post 14339582)
:rolleyes: No shizzle. The number of people riding skateboards 2 miles appears to be very, very small. And the percentage of skateboarders who do it (with any sort of regularity) is small too.

I guessing you haven't been around a college campus lately.

rydabent 06-11-12 08:05 AM

skye

Thanks for proving my point.


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