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Advocacy & Safety Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on every public road, just as do all other users. Discuss your bicycle advocacy and safety concerns here.

View Poll Results: Helmet wearing habits?
I've never worn a bike helmet 178 10.66%
I used to wear a helmet, but have stopped 94 5.63%
I've always worn a helmet 648 38.80%
I didn't wear a helmet, but now do 408 24.43%
I sometimes wear a helmet depending on the conditions 342 20.48%
Voters: 1670. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-07-14, 04:08 PM   #7576
MMACH 5
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The folding helmet would be great for folks who wish to go helmetless, but ride through areas with MHLs.

My commute takes me through 4 different cities. And the biggest chunk of it is in Dallas. Dallas, for now, has an all-ages helmet law, but the surrounding towns do not.

I wear mine, regardless, but for those who wish not to, this could make their lives more convenient.
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Old 05-07-14, 04:53 PM   #7577
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Here's an idea that may address the complaints about bicycle helmets--the invisible bicycle helmet:

GE FOCUS FORWARD - Short Films, Big Ideas

Enjoy,

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Old 05-07-14, 04:55 PM   #7578
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Here's an idea that may address the complaints about bicycle helmets--the invisible bicycle helmet:
Thes folks have a very effective PR machine. I'm curious about how the product actually does in the marketplace.
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Old 05-09-14, 03:43 AM   #7579
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One thing which as well bothers me with helmets currently is their price. Just got a new bell yesterday and it cost me 40 euros. That's like 60 USD. For a person making 500 euros per month that is not a small sum. When considering that cycling should be a cheap alternative to driving a car this stuff mounts up.

Now it doesn't really matter that my bikes cost me 3k since they are already bought (in a time when i had more monnee) and that I would rather get 100% bike and zero safety gear than a crappy bike and safety gear. With the 100% bike I might never get into a situation where I need safety gear.

I know I know there are alternatives to buying a helmet from a store but I'm curretly pissed about the expense. I could have bought so much more actual useful stuff for my bikes with that money (like a litre of rohloff chain oil for example)
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Old 05-09-14, 07:35 AM   #7580
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elcruxio

OTOH a stay in a hospital can easily cost more than your bike. If a helmet saves you from a hospital stay, it is a very cheap alternative.
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Old 05-09-14, 08:29 AM   #7581
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One thing which as well bothers me with helmets currently is their price. Just got a new bell yesterday and it cost me 40 euros. That's like 60 USD. For a person making 500 euros per month that is not a small sum. When considering that cycling should be a cheap alternative to driving a car this stuff mounts up.

Now it doesn't really matter that my bikes cost me 3k since they are already bought (in a time when i had more monnee) and that I would rather get 100% bike and zero safety gear than a crappy bike and safety gear. With the 100% bike I might never get into a situation where I need safety gear.

I know I know there are alternatives to buying a helmet from a store but I'm curretly pissed about the expense. I could have bought so much more actual useful stuff for my bikes with that money (like a litre of rohloff chain oil for example)
Regardless what Rydabent said, which is true what he said, you do make a point too. $60 or more, which probably the average helmet bought here in the US cost $110, is still nothing but a thin layer of plastic over styrofoam, with cloth covered thin foam padding, and cloth straps with plastic buckles, add on top of that they're made in China shouldn't cost more than $60 for a top of the line helmet! Aerodynamic racing helmets may cost a bit more due to wind tunnel testing, otherwise there's no cause for these expensive helmets.

But welcome to the world of bicycling where like most hobbies it's a sport considered to be taken up by people with disposable income so the industry rips us off to take advantage of that income. Consider this, there are bikes on the market that cost $8,000 up to $15,000 seen on the streets, yet you can get new racing motorcycles for those same prices, so which object, the bike or the motorcycle employs the greatest degree and expense of technology? right, yet a simple non complex bicycle can cost more than a lot motorcycles. That should tell you were the profits are going. Another example, tires, you can get skinny little bicycle tires that can cost $35 up to $110 that will last 1,500 miles to 3,500 miles yet you can buy car tires with far better technology internally that will last 20 to 40 times longer and in some cases 50 times longer, which means you would have to buy an average of 20 tires for one car tire, that's an average expense of $2,000 for a pair of tires over the average of 50,000 miles for the same expense of just $200 for car tires.

See this for more of an eye opening experience I'm trying to convey: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF4MIEkIBZs
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Old 05-09-14, 08:39 AM   #7582
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elcruxio

OTOH a stay in a hospital can easily cost more than your bike. If a helmet saves you from a hospital stay, it is a very cheap alternative.
My last 5-day stay in the hospital cost me 120 euros so 160 bucks. All hail the socialist scandinavian welfare state!
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Old 05-09-14, 10:58 AM   #7583
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My last 5-day stay in the hospital cost me 120 euros so 160 bucks. All hail the socialist scandinavian welfare state!
Oh, yeah, and don't forget to hail your 57% taxes, and hail your high gas prices of about $9 a gallon, and don't forget to hail American military who will defend your measly country's military if you join NATO as DPM Bjorklund wants to do, and why does he want to do that? Because he's scared of Russia's intentions and he knows that with their little 1.2% of their GDP going toward military has bought them a few horses and some bows and arrows! Even by their own admission they said they could last no longer than a week should Russia chose to invade. So countries like yours and other small NATO countries have had the financial blessing of not having to spend as much on military as the USA, or Russia, or China because they know America will come running to their defense, so that freed up a lot of their money for socialistic programs like your health insurance.

I wonder if (note I said if) Russia were to attack all these small little NATO and other countries and America enters into the fry, which legally we have to, and if we win, will all those countries help pay for the massive financial losses America takes? I doubt it, hell they're not paying a dime now toward our expenses after all these years. Must be nice to bask in our protection without having to pay for it. Personally I think the USA should have treated the NATO treaty like the mafia operates...you pay for our protection!

I'll just sit back now and laugh at the fireworks about to explode here.
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Old 05-09-14, 11:20 AM   #7584
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Originally Posted by elcruxio View Post
One thing which as well bothers me with helmets currently is their price. Just got a new bell yesterday and it cost me 40 euros. That's like 60 USD. For a person making 500 euros per month that is not a small sum. When considering that cycling should be a cheap alternative to driving a car this stuff mounts up.

Now it doesn't really matter that my bikes cost me 3k since they are already bought (in a time when i had more monnee) and that I would rather get 100% bike and zero safety gear than a crappy bike and safety gear. With the 100% bike I might never get into a situation where I need safety gear.

I know I know there are alternatives to buying a helmet from a store but I'm curretly pissed about the expense. I could have bought so much more actual useful stuff for my bikes with that money (like a litre of rohloff chain oil for example)
Here in the States, I can get a cheap helmet for under $20, choices under $30.

In the bike shop where I work, we have closeout helmet styles around the same money.

Maybe CE safety standards are partially to blame...?

But really: You have a bike with Rohloff hub and you are complaining about spending $60 on a helmet?!? If you'd bought a $120 helmet when you had the money, you'd not be complaining now...
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Old 05-09-14, 01:39 PM   #7585
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Oh, yeah, and don't forget to hail your 57% taxes, and hail your high gas prices of about $9 a gallon, and don't forget to hail American military who will defend your measly country's military if you join NATO as DPM Bjorklund wants to do, and why does he want to do that? Because he's scared of Russia's intentions and he knows that with their little 1.2% of their GDP going toward military has bought them a few horses and some bows and arrows! Even by their own admission they said they could last no longer than a week should Russia chose to invade. So countries like yours and other small NATO countries have had the financial blessing of not having to spend as much on military as the USA, or Russia, or China because they know America will come running to their defense, so that freed up a lot of their money for socialistic programs like your health insurance.

I wonder if (note I said if) Russia were to attack all these small little NATO and other countries and America enters into the fry, which legally we have to, and if we win, will all those countries help pay for the massive financial losses America takes? I doubt it, hell they're not paying a dime now toward our expenses after all these years. Must be nice to bask in our protection without having to pay for it. Personally I think the USA should have treated the NATO treaty like the mafia operates...you pay for our protection!

I'll just sit back now and laugh at the fireworks about to explode here.
You're funny. It's clear you have no military experience but that's beside the point. The reason why why Russia would not probably attack our country is because it would just be too expensive. When almost every man is trained as a infantry man, querilla fighter and specialist in one or several military disciplines it makes invading a relatively difficult endeavour. Plus our soldiers on average are better than yours (we take both dumb and intelligent alike, you only take the dumb)
Also the taxes aren't that bad when you consider what you're getting. I mean I would rather pay high taxes than pay 100k if I needed to get a surgery or some sort. And it also ensures people actually go to doctors = in general a healthier populace = less healthcare costs. Simple stuff.
Gas prices is a bit of a mehh. We're not that car centric of a country (except the rural areas but who cares about them). And we have a functional public transport system. And bicycles. And infra which allows a car free lifestyle. And cars are expensive. Who would pay like 20k just to get around and be bored doing it. At least in a bus you can read a book.
And I mean what protection? We don't have protection from the US. Never have and hopefully never will (If the defecation hits the oscillation so badly that we need it then even the US can't really help that much)
Btw, Are you mixing Sweden and Finland now?
But yeah, politics and religion so I'll just end this here.

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Here in the States, I can get a cheap helmet for under $20, choices under $30.

In the bike shop where I work, we have closeout helmet styles around the same money.

Maybe CE safety standards are partially to blame...?

But really: You have a bike with Rohloff hub and you are complaining about spending $60 on a helmet?!? If you'd bought a $120 helmet when you had the money, you'd not be complaining now...
Ah but you misunderstand. I said rohloff chain oil. It's different stuff than the oil that goes inside their hubs. And it's like the best chain lube ever. A bit wet and attracts some grime in the summer but a good wiping will take care of that. My bikes are pretty normal with standard derailers and mid level components. Cheaper to replace stuff when it breaks.
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Old 05-09-14, 04:22 PM   #7586
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You're funny. It's clear you have no military experience but that's beside the point. The reason why why Russia would not probably attack our country is because it would just be too expensive. When almost every man is trained as a infantry man, querilla fighter and specialist in one or several military disciplines it makes invading a relatively difficult endeavour. Plus our soldiers on average are better than yours (we take both dumb and intelligent alike, you only take the dumb)
Also the taxes aren't that bad when you consider what you're getting. I mean I would rather pay high taxes than pay 100k if I needed to get a surgery or some sort. And it also ensures people actually go to doctors = in general a healthier populace = less healthcare costs. Simple stuff.
Gas prices is a bit of a mehh. We're not that car centric of a country (except the rural areas but who cares about them). And we have a functional public transport system. And bicycles. And infra which allows a car free lifestyle. And cars are expensive. Who would pay like 20k just to get around and be bored doing it. At least in a bus you can read a book.
And I mean what protection? We don't have protection from the US. Never have and hopefully never will (If the defecation hits the oscillation so badly that we need it then even the US can't really help that much)
Btw, Are you mixing Sweden and Finland now?
But yeah, politics and religion so I'll just end this here.

Well, you just keep telling yourself that.
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Old 05-09-14, 09:59 PM   #7587
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rekmeyata +1
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Old 05-12-14, 11:22 PM   #7588
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nah, elcruxio +1. Conflating universal healthcare with low military spending was pretty weak in the first place. There are loads of ways countries can balance their economies (or not balance them, as in the case of the US).
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Old 05-13-14, 02:02 AM   #7589
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Please make cycling helmets a legal requirement - e-petitions

UK government for once responds with science...
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Old 05-13-14, 06:02 AM   #7590
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I like the part about mandatory helmet use likely reducing the number of cycling participants, especially children, thus affecting "National Health" negatively.
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Old 05-13-14, 09:36 AM   #7591
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Just got brought here from another thread, currently trying to sort out what information - if any - is real relative to the MIPS helmets out there. So far all I can find is the designer pages, which have little to no real information on test data, a Swedish insurance companies review of helmets which included a MIPS helmet (scored top in youth, but not in adult), and of course the ads from the very few manufacturers producing helmets based on MIPS.

I've emailed the manufacturers and the patent-holders to hopefully get some information relative to real world conditions (like direct impact, rotational based on collision with a vehicle, and rotational based on hitting the pavement). If anyone has seen anything like that, I'd be very interested.
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Old 05-13-14, 01:08 PM   #7592
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I got an email back from SCOTT Sports, in which I had asked about any testing SCOTT has done as noted above. The reply I got back was to refer to the MIPS website, despite me stating in my email that there is no specific information there.

In other words, no answer from SCOTT Sports on actual testing and results of those tests. I'll update again if anyone from MIPS replies to my emails.

Last edited by JosephG; 05-13-14 at 01:23 PM.
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Old 05-14-14, 07:51 AM   #7593
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Just got brought here from another thread, currently trying to sort out what information - if any - is real relative to the MIPS helmets out there. So far all I can find is the designer pages, which have little to no real information on test data, a Swedish insurance companies review of helmets which included a MIPS helmet (scored top in youth, but not in adult), and of course the ads from the very few manufacturers producing helmets based on MIPS.

I've emailed the manufacturers and the patent-holders to hopefully get some information relative to real world conditions (like direct impact, rotational based on collision with a vehicle, and rotational based on hitting the pavement). If anyone has seen anything like that, I'd be very interested.
Cool. I'm very interested in reading what you find out. I like that some manufacturers are actually trying to make safer helmets, but I sure hope it's not marketing drivel with no research to back it up.

MIPS | Test results that speak for themselves

MIPS | Research documentation
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Old 05-14-14, 08:04 AM   #7594
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Cool. I'm very interested in reading what you find out. I like that some manufacturers are actually trying to make safer helmets, but I sure hope it's not marketing drivel with no research to back it up.

MIPS | Test results that speak for themselves

MIPS | Research documentation
Well the unfortunate thing is that the research available is either the review of types of impacts or it has a focus in motorcycle helmets. Which is great, but not the same type of impact. I'm interested in MIPS not just for myself, but also for my wife who is an equestrian.

That said, a motorcycle helmet (full face, wrapping around the head, tightly fit) is different than a bicycle helmet or an equestrian helmet. It straps in differently, and at lower speeds.

I don't doubt there is a benefit for the full wrap design, but I'm not convinced for helmets that are loose fitting and covering the top of the head. What kind of force needs to be applied to have it work the same as the helmet that covers the entire head? Does a standard helmet create the same effect by the nature of being a looser fit, as opposed to the snug fit of a motorcycle helmet? Would tightening the straps down to create that right of a fit negatively effect the design? Will it effect the results of direct impacts?

What works in one situation doesn't work in all. I'd really like to see something from POC or SCOTT, but all I got was a non-answer from SCOTT. No other responses yet, but I'll post up here if I get anything.
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Old 05-14-14, 11:18 AM   #7595
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Well the unfortunate thing is that the research available is either the review of types of impacts or it has a focus in motorcycle helmets. Which is great, but not the same type of impact. I'm interested in MIPS not just for myself, but also for my wife who is an equestrian.

That said, a motorcycle helmet (full face, wrapping around the head, tightly fit) is different than a bicycle helmet or an equestrian helmet. It straps in differently, and at lower speeds.

I don't doubt there is a benefit for the full wrap design, but I'm not convinced for helmets that are loose fitting and covering the top of the head. What kind of force needs to be applied to have it work the same as the helmet that covers the entire head? Does a standard helmet create the same effect by the nature of being a looser fit, as opposed to the snug fit of a motorcycle helmet? Would tightening the straps down to create that right of a fit negatively effect the design? Will it effect the results of direct impacts?

What works in one situation doesn't work in all. I'd really like to see something from POC or SCOTT, but all I got was a non-answer from SCOTT. No other responses yet, but I'll post up here if I get anything.
I too e-mailed Scott abut 3 or so months ago when I brought up the MIPS issue here, I never heard back either.
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Old 05-14-14, 11:53 AM   #7596
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I have no idea what he was doing, but could it be that Texas ain't the Netherlands, and 25 km is quite a bit more than 3.5 km, let alone 30 mph (and up) versus 30 kph?

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i dont know about texas, but i think 30mph is the same everywhere in the world? at least in texas you have less things to crash into
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Old 05-14-14, 12:09 PM   #7597
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i dont know about texas, but i think 30mph is the same everywhere in the world? at least in texas you have less things to crash into
Pretty sure this holds true pretty much everywhere:

30 mph > 30 kph.
30 mph > 30 km/h.
30 mph > 30 km*h[SUP]-1[/SUP].

30 mph ~ 50 kph.

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Old 05-14-14, 04:07 PM   #7598
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i dont know about texas, but i think 30mph is the same everywhere in the world? at least in texas you have less things to crash into
In certain areas there may be nothing and thus not much to crash into, but in other areas it may be highly congested with an abundance of stuff to crash into...just like anywhere.
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Old 05-15-14, 06:42 PM   #7599
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Maybe if I put it this way. Lets say for any of many reasons you are pitched off your bike. Your head is about to hit the pavement with gravel on it. Wouldnt you want something between you and your scalp?
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Old 05-15-14, 11:22 PM   #7600
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Maybe if I put it this way. Lets say for any of many reasons you are pitched off your bike. Your head is about to hit the pavement with gravel on it. Wouldnt you want something between you and your scalp?
And this exactly the reason I wear a hat.
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